Nathan Brown: Don't blame him for underachieving Saints

[Willow]

Yeah you're right. Those grand final appearances and minor premiership were just a fluke.

 

[Jimbo]

So you're 100% happy having Brown as coach?

 

[Broncodroid]

I am not speaking for Dragon's fans here, let's clear that right up, though I have time for Nathan Brown the person and coach. I still have not seen a worthy post enlightening me that Nathan Brown is a real bad coach, funny that. :roll:

Let's look at who coaches were able to improve their teams fortunes in 2004 in comparison to their 2003:

Ricky Stuart

2003 - 2nd - 17W - 7L - 0D - 2B - 680F - 445A - 38pts (Grand Final)
2004 - 1st - 19W - 5L - 0D - 2B - 710F - 368A - 42pts (Grand Final)

Steve Folkes

2003 - 3rd - 16W - 8L - 0D - 2B - 702F - 419A - 36pts
2004 - 2nd - 19W - 5L - 0D - 2B - 760F - 491A - 42pts (premieres)

* Bulldogs defence whilst not as strong as 2003, they improved everywhere else winning title

Wayne Bennett

2003 - 8th - 12W - 12L - 0D - 2B - 497F - 464A - 28pts
2004 - 3rd - 16W - 7L - 1D - 2B - 602F - 533A - 37pts

* Broncos defence whilst not as strong as 2003, they improved everywhere else though failed again in the finals

Nathan Brown

2003 - 10th - 11W - 13L - 0D - 2B - 548F - 593A - 26pts
2004 - 5th - 14W - 10L - 0D - 2B - 624F - 415A - 30pts

Graham Murray

2003 - 11th - 10W - 14L - 0D - 2B - 606F - 629A - 24pts
2004 - 7th - 12W - 11L - 1D - 2B - 526F - 514A - 29pts

* Cowboys attack whilst not as strong as 2003, they improved everywhere else making the prelim final losing the GF qualifier in a nailbiter to Sydney City

Tim Sheens

2003 - 13th - 7W - 17L - 0D - 2B - 470F - 598A - 18pts
2004 - 9th - 10W - 14L - 0D - 2B - 509F - 534A - 24pts

* Tigers were stonger in both attack and defence compared to 2003, the Tigers were the own worse enemy at times (defence) and narrowly missed the finals when in all honesty they should of made it ahead of Canberra

6 from 15 coaches were able to improve their team, 7 if you include the debut season of Raper who improved on Anderson's record of 2003 though we will see what he does in 2005. 1 coach, Daniel Anderson, did not survive the season nor did Paul Langmack.

So, Brown is in the company of great coaches like Sheens, Bennett, Murray and Folkes joining another up and coming potentially great coach in Stuart. Not bad for a coach apparently "one of the worse coaches in the NRL". :roll:

 

[Tommy Smith]

A good coach doesn't slap his captain infront of everyone. Sure it may have been a one off, but it displays a lack of control. Why couldn't he have just kicked a chair like Sticky?

That incident amongst others makes me wary of whether he has complete respect and control of his players. Something Stuart and Bennett have completely.

Does he also prepare his side well enough for the big occasions? I know you like stats B'Droid so here's some for ya:

The Dragons record against the top 8 sides in 2004 was:

3 W, 9 L

And two of those wins were huge victories over Penrith which is very concerning because this is the exact same team they crumbled against in the big one - the Qualifying Final - by falling behind 24 nil before Mark Gasnier could shout "f**k me, fire up!".

So the big issue here of course is Browny's ability to mentally prepare his side for the big games. And on the surface of it when reviewing the stats, it doesn't look to good for him in that regard does it?

Is it fair to call Browny the worst coach in the comp heading into 2005? No, it's not. Two years does not make you a seasoned coach just as two roots does not make you Ron Jeremy. However, no-one can say he is a quality coach either. What we can all say is this, 2005 will determine whether he is a dud or not.

 

[Jamesy]

Well said Tommy. That was an awesome read and i tend to agree with you, he is far from a bad coach but unfortunately for us Dragons fans, he is far from the best coach. He prepares his team well for the easy and even par games, but he struggles to prepare them for the big games. Having said this, it's not only Browny's fault, the players are professionals and thay need to prepare themselves aswell.They should know how to preapre themselves properly, each player prepares themselves differently and Brown only does what he thinks is best for the team. What works for Barrett, might not work for Ryles, and so on. So Browny can only do his best, and this is the year that, i believe, will decide his future at the Dragons. And i know i'll probably cop a bagging for saying this, but he can only do aswell as he can with the players he has available. and in the past 2 seasons, he hasen't had the best team he could and when he did (Dragons vs Panthers 2004, WIN Stadium) his boys beat the reigning "Premiers" 44-12. Go on all the non-dragons fans, I'm ready for the shit you guys are goin 2 give me about that injury excuse not being a valid reason, I'm ready to cop it. :roll: :roll:

Good Luck Browny, and do ya best son.

 

[gregstar]

it could be worse for brown - he could be at the coach killing club which has had names like gibson, beetson, lang, anderson pass through it & even with their skill unable to make gold from sh*t!

 

[Jimbo]

So you're 100% happy having Brown as coach?

Didn't think so...

 

[innsaneink]

An interesting quote from Mark Riddell when asked of the training at his new club, Parramatta.

"Its a much more professional set up here, to what I'm used to."

Its not often you see players
having a dig at their former club, its usually along the
lines of "I enjoyed my time at old club but my
futures now at new club and things are looking
good, the atmosphere is great here blah blah blah :blahb: ......

 

[gregstar]

"Its a much more professional set up here, to what I'm used to."

what - he's not allowed to supersize?!

 

[Mr Saab]

A good coach doesn't slap his captain infront of everyone. Sure it may have been a one off, but it displays a lack of control. Why couldn't he have just kicked a chair like Sticky?

That incident amongst others makes me wary of whether he has complete respect and control of his players. Something Stuart and Bennett have completely.

Does he also prepare his side well enough for the big occasions? I know you like stats B'Droid so here's some for ya:

The Dragons record against the top 8 sides in 2004 was:

3 W, 9 L

And two of those wins were huge victories over Penrith which is very concerning because this is the exact same team they crumbled against in the big one - the Qualifying Final - by falling behind 24 nil before Mark Gasnier could shout "f**k me, fire up!".

So the big issue here of course is Browny's ability to mentally prepare his side for the big games. And on the surface of it when reviewing the stats, it doesn't look to good for him in that regard does it?

Is it fair to call Browny the worst coach in the comp heading into 2005? No, it's not. Two years does not make you a seasoned coach just as two roots does not make you Ron Jeremy. However, no-one can say he is a quality coach either. What we can all say is this, 2005 will determine whether he is a dud or not.

that is some of the best stuff i have ever read on a message board. 10/10

 

[Lisa]

"Its a much more professional set up here, to what I'm used to."

Yeah he certainly looks more professional doesn't he? :roll:

 

[Lisa]

On the night that the Dragons got beaten by Penrith, Nathan Brown was up at the TAB with Mary McGregor punting on the horses just a couple of hours before the game - that's so unprofessional it's not even funny, though it is laughable

and it's only one example of the many stories I've heard about the guy

And then he was on the drink the night after wasnt he? Said he'd watch the tape later. Wasnt he shocked when the Cowboys won...what an idiot

Shireshark, you have been reading too many Rebecca Wilson articles, you are starting to sound just like her. Where did you get this information? By email?

 

[Broncodroid]

No, a good coach doesn't slap his player infront of everyone, I admit that, Brown admitted that...there is no excuse for the coach in his then rookie season.

The record vs the 8 is not impressive, granted, and yes some blame lies with the coach who was unable to mentally prepare the player(s), though do not portion the majority to the coach for the simple reason the individual was not able to rise to the occasion. We are talking about paid professionals.

The Dragons have made 5 GF appearances since their last GF win in 1979. They are 0 from 5. The Dragon's since their last GF appearance, have only made the finals 3 times, 1 was with Brown

In summary, IMO Nathan Brown is a good NRL coach I think he has the potential to coach in this league for quite a few years. Yes, there are going ot be lessons learned, the Barrett slap, though if Brown continues to improve his team each season against the top 8 as highlighted, the Dragons management are going to to be happy campers.

For the Brown faithful, take heart in the following stats showing the first 2 seasons of some rather "good" coaches:

Tim Sheens (Pen 84,85): 48G - 25W - 21L - 2D - 4B - 869F - 780A
* Highest placing 5th, 1 semi final appearance

Brian Smith (Illa 84,85): 48G - 17W - 31L - 0D - 4B - 671F - 855A
* Highest placing 8th, 0 semi finals appearance

John Lang (Cro 94,95): 44G - 28W - 16L - 0D - 0B - 948F - 688A
* Highest placing 4th, 1 semi final appearance

Graham Murray: (Illa 91,92): 44G - 25W - 17L - 2D - 0B - 769F -550A
* Highest placing 3rd, 1 semi final appearance

Wayne Bennett (Can 87, Bri 88): 46G - 29W - 17L - 0D - 2B - 915F - 693A
* Highest placing 3rd, 1 GF appearance

Steve Folkes (Cant 98,99): 48G - 28w - 19L - 1D - 1009F - 873A
* Highest placing 5th, 1 GF appearance, 2 semi finals appearances

Nathan Brown (Stg 03,04): 48G - 25W - 23L - 0D - 4B - 1172F - 1008A
* Highest placing 5th, 1 semi final appearance

As we can see, Brown is in good stead with the great coaches above. All barring 2 have won a premiership (Murray and Smith). I will come back to this thread after 2005 and see where Brown is at. My feeling is the Dragons and Brown will continue to improve with a full compliment of players.

 

[Broncodroid]

ShireShark...you hearsay rumours are not credible. Where have you heard or seen such nonsense? :roll:

 

[Mr Saab]

out of all those coaches records the 1st two yrs i would say brown would have one of the top talented teams.
I dont rate brown at all as a coach and he will not be there 2006

 

[gregstar]

out of all those coaches records the 1st two yrs i would say brown would have one of the top talented teams.
I dont rate brown at all as a coach and he will not be there 2006

yeah ok charlie we get the picture - you hate brown you hate the dragons blah blah - despite earlier saying how much of a league fan you are & having an interest in all clubs! have a lie down & avoid such threads in future! :roll:

 

[Mr Saab]

out of all those coaches records the 1st two yrs i would say brown would have one of the top talented teams.
I dont rate brown at all as a coach and he will not be there 2006

yeah ok charlie we get the picture - you hate brown you hate the dragons blah blah - despite earlier saying how much of a league fan you are & having an interest in all clubs! have a lie down & avoid such threads in future! :roll:

yeah i love league and watch all teams, but that doesnt mean i like EVERY COACH and PLAYER.
I have an interest i every club, yes...but... i have an opinion on the dragons coach.
I dont hate the dragons...the only club i have a slight dislike for is the Roosters.
I like watching the dragons play, they are very entertaining, but the coach of the dragons will not take them to the month of october.

 

[gregstar]

I like watching the dragons play, they are very entertaining

then how come that is the first positive statement you've made about them?

 

[Mr Saab]

i dont like certain players in the team.
Notably
Timmins and Barrett and the coach.
I bag them as i their window of opportunity is going down the toilet...and thats a shame.

 

[God-King Dean]

You're posts are just so biased Charlie it's not funny. Admit it, it wouldn't make a difference what Brown does next year, you'll come up with the same ol line "Oh but look at all the great players they have, & he hasn't won a premiership, he's shit"

Mate, I don't give a rats tail what players are in the team, the team as a whole has to win, not a series of talented individuals.

Let's put it this way, Waite in his first year with St.George Illawarra finished 6th, next year finished 9th. Brown first year 10th, 2nd year 5th & is still coach for next year. In which order would you prefer Broncos to finish if they got a new coach. 6th to 9th, or 10th to 5th?