NBA Playoffs 2009

[Ridders]

Damn, the LeBron hate just oozed out.

Regular season the entire Cavs team chipped in above their weight. LeBron wasn't taking the ball from the inbound and running up post to shoot like Kobe was 2 years ago. In the Magic series the support cast hasn't carried their weight. The 4th game had LeBron regularly try and put a team mate through who would then butcher the pass and kill the play.

You mention Mo and Wallace and leave out Odom? Like Kobe had nobody on his team or some sh*t. LeBron has acknowledged for the Cavs to succeed he needs to get the entire team involved. Mo Williams acknowledged this. Everybody knows this. The Lakers 2 years ago weren't a team.

Another playoff triple double for LeBron when it counted

Top 3 players on Lebron's team - Mo. Williams, Big Z & Delonte West.
Top 3 players on Kobe's team - Odom........K.Brown.......S.Parker. Where is Smush these days?

 

[Ridders]

Very true, but whilst I don't think Williams will go 6-9 from 3 again, at least he found his range. All they need from him, Delonte & Wally is to hit 40% from the open looks they get from James. They do that, they win, simple.

My God the refs were inconsistent though. At the start of the fourth LeBron had a couple drives where there was definite contact but nothing was called. That's fine, just be consistent. However, by the mid-way point of the fourth, EVERYTHING was getting called. It really is amazing that the standard varies not just from game to game, but from quarter to quarter.

Much the same with the LA-Denver series. I don't know whether it comes down to different calls from different refs or refs conciously changing the way they officiate based on what part of the game it is?

 

[El Coconuto]

For the playoffs, James is averaging 36 points on 22 shots, along with 7 assists. James is doing everything he can to win basketball games. Kobe was doing everything he could for two straight years to win scoring titles, MVPs, and popularity. He gave up on his team more than once in the playoffs because he wanted to have a sook. He demanded a trade. I'm not saying Bron has been perfect, or that he won't do those things in the future, but they haven't happened yet.

#-o

You sum up my original argument so well...

Firstly, when Kobe was at the height of his so called "I'm Selfish" Era which officially brought to an end the great dynasty, how many shots was Kobe taking during the season? 26? 30? 35? Nope - 18! Less than 20 shots a game, and only just on 20 shots during the postseason, whilst averaging 5 assists per game at a time when his team-mates were lucky to even touch the rim on a layup attempt. Of course, LeBron is jacking up more shots but no one cares. Apparently if the media love you, it's "doing what's best for your team".

Secondly, Kobe may have demanded a trade, but what's the difference between Kobe demanding a trade and LeBron NOT extending his contract when Cleveland have done everything humanly possible to give him one? Seriously, what's the difference? The only real difference is that with the opt-out clause LeBron has the keys to the car, whereas Kobe needed to demand a trade because he was locked into a long term deal. But in essence, they're doing exactly the same thing. Kobe gave the Lakers a solution to a problem. LeBron is holding a whole city hostage, to the point where Knicks fans are chanting his name trying to wing him over. Kobe may have openly demanded a trade but every day LeBron holds out on extending he is privately saying "You know, I really don't know if I want to play with you guys anymore". There is no counter-argument for it. If he wanted to stay, he would've signed already. The only difference here is that the guys in the media oogle LeBron, and the only reason they oogle him is because he IS going to be one of the top three greatest players in NBA history. Kobe was never going to be that so everyone was prepared to crap all over him. The press catered to Jordan the same way. Jordan demanded that the Bulls trade Pippen, Grant and Cartwright after the Pistons debacle every year until they won the championship. But the media ALWAYS overlooked it because they knew that negavite press about Jordan meant they were never getting access to his private life again - and every reoprter wanted a slice of Jordan magic.

Again, it's the double standard LeBron gets away with and Kobe doesn't. My argument isn't that LeBron deserves the accolades (he does), it's that the accolades themselves come and go on a preferencial basis, that's all. (And it's coming from a person that doesn't even like Kobe...)

And why mention two of James' best teammates but not Kobe's at the time - Odom? Because Parker & Brown suited your argument better....?

Can we run a poll on "Which Second Best Player On A Los Angelas Playoff Team Is Likely To Sh*t His Pants As Soon As The Playoffs Begin" on this forum? We should, we must. I demand it. I mean, who would everyone here prefer to have on their team as their number two playoff guy: 2009 Mo Williams, or 2005-2009 Lamar Odom? I think you'll find the reason in that answer there.

 

[Tiger Hawk]

Much the same with the LA-Denver series. I don't know whether it comes down to different calls from different refs or refs conciously changing the way they officiate based on what part of the game it is?

Both I think. Some refs will call the game very tight, others not so much. But then it's like they get together at half-time, look at the tape and go "damn, we gotta be calling that as a foul" and suddenly whistles galore. It's piss poor at times.

Top 3 players on Lebron's team - Mo. Williams, Big Z & Delonte West.
Top 3 players on Kobe's team - Odom........K.Brown.......S.Parker. Where is Smush these days?

Hang on, James made the Finals two years ago with who exactly??? He floundered in mediocrity for the first three years of his career, correct? He suddenly gets a couple shooters outside him and that's his fault?

Unquestionably, Kobe has more weapons by his side than at any stage since Shaq left, but let's not mix the issues up here. You can't compare Bron's 09 cast to Kobe's 06 cast......you compare Bron's 09 cast with Kobe's 09 cast and Bron's 06 cast with Kobe's 06 cast. Otherwise it's apples with oranges, and total b/s.

Where is Eric Snow these days? Devin Brown etc etc? (they're just off top of my head from James' 2007 Finals team).

 

[Tiger Hawk]

#-o

You sum up my original argument so well...

Firstly, when Kobe was at the height of his so called "I'm Selfish" Era which officially brought to an end the great dynasty, how many shots was Kobe taking during the season? 26? 30? 35? Nope - 18! Less than 20 shots a game, and only just on 20 shots during the postseason, whilst averaging 5 assists per game at a time when his team-mates were lucky to even touch the rim on a layup attempt. Of course, LeBron is jacking up more shots but no one cares. Apparently if the media love you, it's "doing what's best for your team".

Actually, Kobe was at the height of his I'm Selfish Era in 2006 - when he openly gunned for the scoring title shooting more than 27 times a game. If you fail to acknowledge this, you're deadset kidding yourself.

Secondly, Kobe may have demanded a trade, but what's the difference between Kobe demanding a trade and LeBron NOT extending his contract when Cleveland have done everything humanly possible to give him one? Seriously, what's the difference? Kobe gave the Lakers a solution to a problem. LeBron is holding a whole city hostage, to the point where Knicks fans are chanting his name trying to wing him over. Kobe may have openly demanded a trade but every day LeBron holds out on extending he is privately saying "You know, I really don't know if I want to play with you guys anymore". There is no counter-argument for it. If he wanted to stay, he would've signed already. The only difference here is that the guys in the media oogle LeBron, and the only reason they oogle him is because he IS going to be one of the top three greatest players in NBA history. Kobe was never going to be that so everyone was prepared to crap all over him. The press catered to Jordan the same way. Jordan demanded that the Bulls trade Pippen, Grant and Cartwright after the Pistons debacle every year until they won the championship. But the media ALWAYS overlooked it because they knew that negavite press about Jordan meant they were never getting access to his private life again - and every reoprter wanted a slice of Jordan magic.

Well no, not really. LeBron holding out until he's sure that he's:

1. getting the best offer financially; and / or
2. making the franchise put in place the best possible team to help him win

isn't holding the city hostage, and it's certainly nowhere near comparable to demanding a trade. Kobe had his $20m+ contract in the bag for another 3 (or 4?) years, whereas LeBron is yet to sign that extension. It's not the same game, let alone ballpark.

Can we run a poll on "Which Second Best Player On A Los Angelas Playoff Team Is Likely To Sh*t His Pants As Soon As The Playoffs Begin" on this forum? We should, we must. I demand it. I mean, who would everyone here prefer to have on their team as their number two playoff guy: 2009 Mo Williams, or 2005-2009 Lamar Odom? I think you'll find the reason in that answer there.

Let's see:

Lamar Odom. Can play the 3 or 4, or 5 in small ball lineups. Best Laker in last year's Finals. When he's on, a top 15 talent in the NBA.

Mo Williams. Shooting guard in point guard body. Struggles to run an offence, or create for others. Can shoot but does little else.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm - I'll take Odom thanks. Williams is great when playing with James. Put him with Kobe, not so sure.

 

[El Coconuto]

Unquestionably, Kobe has more weapons by his side than at any stage since Shaq left, but let's not mix the issues up here. You can't compare Bron's 09 cast to Kobe's 06 cast......you compare Bron's 09 cast with Kobe's 09 cast and Bron's 06 cast with Kobe's 06 cast. Otherwise it's apples with oranges, and total b/s.

Why not? If we're going to compare LeBron James to someone that hasn't played in the league for over a decade (tangent: I still can't believe it was over ten years ago that Jordan retired. Bogus), then we should be allowed to compare him to players that are still active. My issue here is the media aren't comparing apples and oranges, they're compaing apples and apples and treating one like it's an orange. When I'm President of the United States, I'm instituting a law that feeds the hungry, puts clothes on the back of naked men and women, and holds the media accountable for moulding the opinions of millions around the world. Vote for El Coco in 2012!

 

[El Coconuto]

Well no, not really. LeBron holding out until he's sure that he's:

1. getting the best offer financially; and / or
2. making the franchise put in place the best possible team to help him win

isn't holding the city hostage, and it's certainly nowhere near comparable to demanding a trade. Kobe had his $20m+ contract in the bag for another 3 (or 4?) years, whereas LeBron is yet to sign that extension. It's not the same game, let alone ballpark.

You're right, LeBron blackmailing the Cavs into surrounding him with pieces to win a championship is compleeeeeetely different to Kobe asking out because of a lack of pieces to win a championship. My bad, guys. I didn't fully realise the situation.

Lamar Odom. Can play the 3 or 4, or 5 in small ball lineups. Best Laker in last year's Finals. When he's on, a top 15 talent in the NBA.

Odom only plays one (mayyyyyyyyybe two if he gets the right matchup) effectively. And since when did the playoffs become one series?

Mo Williams. Shooting guard in point guard body. Struggles to run an offence, or create for others. Can shoot but does little else.

Steve Nash would fail to run the offense playing with LeBron. Chris Paul couldn't do it at the Olympic's, either. No point guard will thrive with a person who essentially plays point guard in a power forward's body.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm - I'll take Odom thanks. Williams is great when playing with James. Put him with Kobe, not so sure.

I'd take 2009 playoff Mo Williams in a heartbeat.

 

[Ridders]

Simply a brilliant performance that sees LA advance again the Finals. It wasn't just a great performance as much as it was a great TEAM performance. So happy to see Kobe and Gasol makes such great decisions when faced with the double team. Was encouraging to see guys other than Kobe and Gasol step up, especially Odom. Really encouraged with what i've seen with him in the last two games. Feel for a bit for Denver, they didn't deserve to go out the way they did. Bynum is about the only concern i really have going into the Finals, everyone else really played well today.

 

[McLovin]

I get the feeling Bynum is going to explode in the finals...

 

[Ridders]

So happy to see Orlando make the Finals, even though they match up better to the Lakers. Dwight you machine; 40 points, 14 rebounds and 4 assists. His free throw shooting has been very impressive this series. I mean there are times when he's shooting it from the charity stripe better than Lebron. Still amazes me that so few people, including myself, saw this coming.

 

[Special K]

I'm truely on the Magic bandwagon. They are my favorite team to use in 2k9 and Howard is so fkn likable.

Lewi$ ftw!

 

[El Coconuto]

Enjoy the off-season, LeBron :nwave:\\\\/

 

[Stonecutter]

Loved it! Wish it was a Nuggets vs Magic final....can't have everything your way though .

 

[McLovin]

Lakers to win on their home floor in 6...

Kobe to average 38ppg...

Bynum to dominate in the paint...

 

[McLovin]

I think the Lakers bigs will pose alot more problems for Dwight than the Cavs bigs. I think he'll be in foul trouble alot during this series...

 

[Ridders]

No doubt, LA's front line will pose more problems. Then again, Gasol has been the only constant, Odom has been on and off and Bynum actually looks alright, his problem is that he can't stay on the court because of foul trouble. I like this series alot cause there are so many questions.

 

[El Coconuto]

Orlando in 7

(Blind hope)

 

[Ridders]

SVG must be loving life atm. Got shafted in Miami when a title was in site, this year has Shaq publicly rip him, gets his coaching credientials questioned by everyone in the media and gives them a big f**k you by outclassing coach of the year Mike Brown to make the NBA Finals, when no one thought they could. Who's the Master of Panic now Shaq?

 

[ByRd]

Great series coming up but i really hope my Lakers can make up for a disappointing finals against the Celtics last season. The Magic are going to be tough and we all know about there weapons and how quick they can score, we will match up better then what the Cavs did and believe we will win it in 6 but you never know, cait wait for the series to begin!!!

 

[andrew057]

Bynum will be no match for Howard. I would favour the Magic if that had a healthy Nelson, but thats history. Lakers in 5, but praying for a Magic SWEEEEEEEEP.