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NRL Expansion. Ideas and opinions.

Who would you admit as the next team into the NRL?

  • Perth

    Votes: 75 57.7%
  • PNG

    Votes: 8 6.2%
  • Wellington/2nd NZ team

    Votes: 5 3.8%
  • Adelaide

    Votes: 6 4.6%
  • Darwin

    Votes: 1 0.8%
  • Fiji

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Central Coast

    Votes: 10 7.7%
  • Central Queensland/4th Queensland team

    Votes: 12 9.2%
  • Samoa

    Votes: 1 0.8%
  • Other (please specify)/No Expansion

    Votes: 12 9.2%

  • Total voters
    130

Bojackhorseman

Juniors
Messages
331
Nope. Have you watched a NSW Cup game! ? Friends and relatives turn up. The NRL is a different and elite beast. You really don't have a feel for the code you are so recklessly commenting on. Commonsense leans to the Central Coast Bears. Apathy and ignorance is to not see this license to.make money and strengthen the code.
Quite remarkable how this bloke can’t write such unadulterated rubbish ad nauseam.
 

Bojackhorseman

Juniors
Messages
331
If the NRL was really interested in "getting the Bears support back" then the best thing they could do is get all of the NSW cup games broadcast live and promote the hell out of the fact that they are being broadcast.

That would make supporting the Bears (and other NSW cup teams) convenient and easy like supporting an NRL team, and it'd give the Bears a massive amount of exposure that they don't currently have.
Couldn’t agree more.
 
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flippikat

Bench
Messages
4,442
Since we are wasting every bodies time with anecdotes, I know/knew somewhere between 50-100 Bears fans well enough to know not only how they reacted to the Bears dying (which wasn't as straight forward as everybody likes to make out), but how they would react to them being resurrected.

Of that group that I know/knew maybe 25-30 (roughly half) could be described as "very much interested in a resurrected Bears", and from my general experience I'd say that they are definitely "reflective" of the group that are behind the Bears coming back.

If we're talking anecdotally about this "dormant Bears fanbase"... I have to admit that in the early 1990s, I cheered for the Bears.

The NSRWL competition was just making a splash here in New Zealand, with TVNZ's Channel 2 screening a few games each weekend. This was before Sky launched, when sport was on free-to-air TV at a decent time here. (No anti-syphoning laws mean it's all delayed WAY late in the evening on FTA now).

Anyways, when it came to picking a club to support I liked Norths story & brand. The lovable loosers, the epic drought. There was something under-dog about that which appealed. The red & black colours were cool too.. and they had a fierce bear-head as a logo. Very cool. I bought a jersey, cheered them when they played. As much as you could support an overseas club from New Zealand as a kid.

But then the Warriors came along... and since 1995 I've cheered for New Zealand's team in the competition.. and they're my team more than the Bears were. My country, my culture, us against the Aussies. I can't get to too many games (being here in Wellington, with family in tow means I just can't - travel, money, time all weighs against it), but I always watch the Warriors game on TV, and they've sold a bit of merch to me.

I can understand other people here in NZ (or North Qld) who stuck with their early 1990s alligences & still cheer for Manly or the Bulldogs, or the Raiders - and there are quite a few... BUT there's also a sizable number here who switched when a local option to support became available. Point is, there's going to be some support that's malleable.

Yeah, I still had a soft spot for the Bears.. and felt pretty pissed off when the Northern Eagles debacle unfolded.. but I just can't see them fitting in as another NSW club, when you have 10 out of 16 NRL clubs already from NSW.

It's gonna have to be somewhere outside of NSW, or as a replacement for a demoted NSW club.. and I think both of those scenarios are long-shots now.
 

The Great Dane

First Grade
Messages
7,768
A key assumption of yours is very doubtful . Every Bears fan I have met over the past decade or so has indicated a support for a Central Coast Bears. In fact I've met younger people from Gosford that were part of the Central Coast Bears membership drive. They tell me they were gathering great interest and momentum despite being killed off by a 'sitting on its hands' administration of the NRL. You can try to debunk the Bears popularity as much as you like. They have support and it would very successful. It's all there waiting to make money but procrastination and lack of strategic thinking is dominating this rugby league currently. The Bears fans would and do openly welcome some place in the sun of the top flight competition. You are not reflecting the reality of what a Bears fan wants. They want to see a Bears team in black and red playing in the NRL. You won't accept this. Others do.
I'm hoping a vibrant new ARLC chairman will have such a win/win scenario a reality for the next TV deal.Throw in Brisbane2 & it's a win/ win for the competition and code. From this the NRL aims toward WA and another ambitious area as time goes on.
Stallion what would you do if the Roosters (they're your team right?) were relocated?

Also remember those conversations with some of my old Bears supporter friends I was talking about before?

Well I've literally had conversations with a lot of them where they have said things like 'the CC Bears is only what the club has to do to get back into the comp, they'll be called the CC Bears and play one or two games on the CC, but they'll play the rest at NS oval and really they'll just be the NS Bears, otherwise I won't support them', and other utterly delusional stuff like that.

That's not to say that there aren't Bears fans that are behind the CC Bears, because there definitely are, but roughly speaking the above reflects most old Bears supporters opinions in my experience (of which I assure you I have way more then you do in this regard).

So every time you're talking to 'an old Bears fan' that desperately wants the Bears back in the comp you're hearing 'I'd love and support the CC Bears' and most of the time they're thinking 'I'd love and support the CC Bears so long as they are really just the NS Bears that I remember from the glory days posing as a CC team'.

Another thing that would shock you is if you were to ask them how much they think tickets to the Bears games would or should cost if they were in the comp, because when you tell them that roughly speaking $200 is the going rate for season tickets in the worst seats they will look at you slack-jawed and say that is extortion and that they'd never pay that much for tickets to the footy.
I reckon that roughly three quarters of the old Bears supporters would drop off actively supporting the club straight away if they understood how much it's actually going to cost them now days.

On top of that their aren't as many of them left as a lot of people (including you) like to make out. Back in the 90s before the merger there was maybe 10-15k active Bears supporters in Sydney, now days you'd be lucky if there were 8-10k of those people left, and the majority of them would be over 50.

Once you subtract from that 8-10k the ones that will refuse to support them unless they're based out of NS, then subtract the ones who can't afford/will refuse to pay the amount it cost for tickets these days, you'll be lucky if you are left with 1-2k of the old support base activally supporting the club, which isn't exactly the 'tens of thousands' of old Bears supporters just champing at the bit for the Bears to come back that are always promised is it.
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
65,842
Why are we still talking about the bears? They are extinct and like the dodo never coming back. I don’t know how much clearer the nrl could be when they told them to stop wasting their time on the CC.
 

The Great Dane

First Grade
Messages
7,768
Nope. Have you watched a NSW Cup game! ? Friends and relatives turn up.

Yeah because it takes a lot of effort to support a NSW Cup team.

You can't just switch the TV on and watch all their games, which means you have to attend most of their games, which means you've got to live close, and even then you can't watch most of their away games. Then on top of that the results aren't reported on widely and it's not well promoted either, which means you really have to know what you are looking for to even realise that it exists at all.

Basically it's a total shit show trying to be a fan of a NSW Cup (or QLD cup) team, trust me I've tried to follow the Bears more closely multiple times and I always end up throwing the towel in after a while, but broadcast all their games and get them well promoted in the media and I'd be right on board, and so would a lot of other people as well.
 
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Stallion

First Grade
Messages
7,467
Stallion what would you do if the Roosters (they're your team right?) were relocated?

Also remember those conversations with some of my old Bears supporter friends I was talking about before?

Well I've literally had conversations with a lot of them where they have said things like 'the CC Bears is only what the club has to do to get back into the comp, they'll be called the CC Bears and play one or two games on the CC, but they'll play the rest at NS oval and really they'll just be the NS Bears, otherwise I won't support them', and other utterly delusional stuff like that.

That's not to say that there aren't Bears fans that are behind the CC Bears, because there definitely are, but roughly speaking the above reflects most old Bears supporters opinions in my experience (of which I assure you I have way more then you do in this regard).

So every time you're talking to 'an old Bears fan' that desperately wants the Bears back in the comp you're hearing 'I'd love and support the CC Bears' and most of the time they're thinking 'I'd love and support the CC Bears so long as they are really just the NS Bears that I remember from the glory days posing as a CC team'.

Another thing that would shock you is if you were to ask them how much they think tickets to the Bears games would or should cost if they were in the comp, because when you tell them that roughly speaking $200 is the going rate for season tickets in the worst seats they will look at you slack-jawed and say that is extortion and that they'd never pay that much for tickets to the footy.
I reckon that roughly three quarters of the old Bears supporters would drop off actively supporting the club straight away if they understood how much it's actually going to cost them now days.

On top of that their aren't as many of them left as a lot of people (including you) like to make out. Back in the 90s before the merger there was maybe 10-15k active Bears supporters in Sydney, now days you'd be lucky if there were 8-10k of those people left, and the majority of them would be over 50.

Once you subtract from that 8-10k the ones that will refuse to support them unless they're based out of NS, then subtract the ones who can't afford/will refuse to pay the amount it cost for tickets these days, you'll be lucky if you are left with 1-2k of the old support base activally supporting the club, which isn't exactly the 'tens of thousands' of old Bears supporters just champing at the bit for the Bears to come back that are always promised is it.

A stack of incorrect assumptions again! You think the Bears fans have died off. Alot of people were 20 something to 40 something following the Bears in the late 1990s. And you dismiss new fans that may happen to.like Bears, the colours and from the Central Coast. Wow. How negative can.you get!? The reason billionaire John Singleton gave up.was due to the procrastinating rugbyleague administration. Nothing else. This man knew it was a license to print money but a poor rugby-league administration has been sitting on its hands. So he jumps ship out of frustration. I don't blame him!
 

Stallion

First Grade
Messages
7,467
Yeah because it takes a lot of effort to support a NSW Cup team.

You can't just switch the TV on and watch all their games, which means you have to attend most of their games, which means you've got to live close, and even then you can't watch most of their away games. Then on top of that the results aren't reported on widely and it's not well promoted either, which means you really have to know what you are looking for to even realise that it exists at all.

Basically it's a total shit show trying to be a fan of a NSW Cup (or QLD cup) team, trust me I've tried to follow the Bears more closely multiple times and I always end up throwing the towel in after a while, but broadcast all their games and get them well promoted in the media and I'd be right on board, and so would a lot of other people as well.

Nope. Mainstream public in Australia demand top flight status especially when the grade has been a feature of the past of a club. It does not pass the pub test. North Sydney Bears has a chance to shine in the NRL sun as the Central Coast Bears. John Singleton knew this. The league is still no wiser and obviously some on this site.
Go into a pub, talk about your side in the 2nd tier and wait how long your team is referred to as 2nd rate. Game over! You think this would not happen? Well rest assured it does!
 

The Great Dane

First Grade
Messages
7,768
A stack of incorrect assumptions again! You think the Bears fans have died off. Alot of people were 20 something to 40 something following the Bears in the late 1990s. And you dismiss new fans that may happen to.like Bears, the colours and from the Central Coast

Before we continue I'd like you to answer my question: What would you do if the Roosters (they're your team right?) were relocated?

Though it's definitely a factor, I wasn't really literally suggesting that most of the Bears fans have died off, most have simply moved on with their lives since then.

Also those 20 somethings from the 90s were not only a minority back then, but most of them would be on 50's doorstep now and have a family and responsibilities that they didn't back then, and the 30 to 40 somethings would be well over 50 by now like I said.

The youngest Bears fans that are still around from that time would be in their mid to late 30's now, but there isn't very many of them, definitely not the ten of thousands that are promised. The younger fans were also way more likely to start supporting another team as well.
 

Jimmy Wiggle

Juniors
Messages
116
A stack of incorrect assumptions again! You think the Bears fans have died off. Alot of people were 20 something to 40 something following the Bears in the late 1990s. And you dismiss new fans that may happen to.like Bears, the colours and from the Central Coast. Wow. How negative can.you get!? The reason billionaire John Singleton gave up.was due to the procrastinating rugbyleague administration. Nothing else. This man knew it was a license to print money but a poor rugby-league administration has been sitting on its hands. So he jumps ship out of frustration. I don't blame him!

How are bringing the bears in on central coast going to make the nrl money. It’s not helping ratings. It’s not getting big business to sponsor the nrl.

It might help with crowd numbers compared to some other clubs but leave all the clubs we have where they are, bring in Perth & Brisbane 2 & get as much money from tv as you can by adding nsw & qld cups to the mix as well.
 

Bojackhorseman

Juniors
Messages
331
How are bringing the bears in on central coast going to make the nrl money. It’s not helping ratings. It’s not getting big business to sponsor the nrl.

It might help with crowd numbers compared to some other clubs but leave all the clubs we have where they are, bring in Perth & Brisbane 2 & get as much money from tv as you can by adding nsw & qld cups to the mix as well.
Enjoy the response
 

Stallion

First Grade
Messages
7,467
How are bringing the bears in on central coast going to make the nrl money. It’s not helping ratings. It’s not getting big business to sponsor the nrl.

It might help with crowd numbers compared to some other clubs but leave all the clubs we have where they are, bring in Perth & Brisbane 2 & get as much money from tv as you can by adding nsw & qld cups to the mix as well.

It will help the two neighboring clubs for sure! Some great local derbies to be had. And increased viewers as more people gravitate to a game that is very visible ( stadium on a major rail line) It's nothe seen as a regressive and reclusive competition in its major region. That all helps . It's positive and if John Singleton sees it has merit? (and he very much did) I'll take his opinion over yours about business interest/success anytime!
 

Bojackhorseman

Juniors
Messages
331
It will help the two neighboring clubs for sure! Some great local derbies to be had. And increased viewers as more people gravitate to a game that is very visible ( stadium on a major rail line) It's nothe seen as a regressive and reclusive competition in its major region. That all helps . It's positive and if John Singleton sees it has merit? (and he very much did) I'll take his opinion over yours about business interest/success anytime!
There you go!
 

Jimmy Wiggle

Juniors
Messages
116
It will help the two neighboring clubs for sure! Some great local derbies to be had. And increased viewers as more people gravitate to a game that is very visible ( stadium on a major rail line) It's nothe seen as a regressive and reclusive competition in its major region. That all helps . It's positive and if John Singleton sees it has merit? (and he very much did) I'll take his opinion over yours about business interest/success anytime!

All good & well for Singleton to make money, that’s what he’d be in it for but once again that’s not going to grow the nrls pie. Do you honestly think tv stations are paying more for the bears over Brisbane 2 or Perth, surely you are smarter than that.
 

Stallion

First Grade
Messages
7,467
How are bringing the bears in on central coast going to make the nrl money. It’s not helping ratings. It’s not getting big business to sponsor the nrl.

It might help with crowd numbers compared to some other clubs but leave all the clubs we have where they are, bring in Perth & Brisbane 2 & get as much money from tv as you can by adding nsw & qld cups to the mix as well.

Perhaps you are conveniently ignoring that rugby league has been weakened in northern Sydney. A population of over 1 million plus more than 300000 to the Central Coast warrants a top flight club with local rivals in Newcastle and Manly Warringah. The presence alone will engender greater interest and neutrals that are unaware of this great competition will get on board. This addition is a consolidation and will give the NRL a stronger platform to undertake more ambitious expansions such as Perth and elsewhere.
 

siv

First Grade
Messages
6,562
Unless the club is based in NS and playing the vast majority of it's games at NS oval they won't be interested (

Disagree here

A Northern Bears entity had already engaged both CC and North Shore fans when they committed to invest in building Gosford Stadium

In respect to the Mariners soccer team who won the comp a few years ago, haven't engaged the North Shore. They chose to be a pure CC club and their setup at Tuggerah puts a lot of RL clubs to shame
 

Slater1

Juniors
Messages
104
Perhaps you are conveniently ignoring that rugby league has been weakened in northern Sydney. A population of over 1 million plus more than 300000 to the Central Coast warrants a top flight club with local rivals in Newcastle and Manly Warringah. The presence alone will engender greater interest and neutrals that are unaware of this great competition will get on board. This addition is a consolidation and will give the NRL a stronger platform to undertake more ambitious expansions such as Perth and elsewhere.

Are you really suggesting that people that live in Northern Sydney are NOT aware of the existence of the NRL?
 

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