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Organised crime and drugs in sport investigation part III

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R2Coupe

Juniors
Messages
1,520
Poor old CT has been butthurt ever since the sharks development got approved. It's too late CT, the shovels are turning regardless of asada.

No you mean me, and what is your fixation with hurting butts?

With all the whining in the Shire, the easiest way for this to be resolved is to cooperate fully. If there is nothing to hide, it is the logical decision.
 
Messages
17,566
No you mean me, and what is your fixation with hurting butts?

With all the whining in the Shire, the easiest way for this to be resolved is to cooperate fully. If there is nothing to hide, it is the logical decision.

Still trying divert attention from being caught out as coupe and CT being one and the same.

How's the floods?
Have you planned an 18 story extension to your house so you can still have a view?
Are all of your CT posts cleared and authorised by your wife and Capsis?

Crazy Crazy person you are indeed.

Have an awesome day crazy coupe and keep these things in mind;

Sharks will still be there after this ASADA garbage is over
Gal tower will rise high above your picturesque little corner of heaven and will provide you years of viewing pleasure.
Sharks fans will flock into your streets, park everywhere and make noise often.
The shopping centre at the Sharks development will be so convenient that your wife will support us by regularly shopping there.
And the best part, after the development is complete your roads will be filled with new residents making their way to and from wok everyday.

You are going to love it Crazy Coupe, love it!
 

El Diablo

Post Whore
Messages
94,107
Nutjob Tiger needs to read this http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/...o-comply-with-asada-probe-20130503-2iyf4.html

Off the hook: Sharks not obliged to comply with ASADA probe

Date
May 4, 2013

Adrian Proszenko
Chief Rugby League Reporter

Interviews between Cronulla and the Australian Sports Anti-Doping Authority could be scrapped altogether after independent legal advice to several players that they are not contractually obligated to participate in the process.

Just as it appeared the respective legal teams were close to resolving their impasse, Fairfax Media understands that a star player is considering pulling out of interviews, which could prompt his teammates to follow suit. The development could have huge ramifications for all 31 NRL players of interest to ASADA.

The Sharks are increasingly frustrated with the drawn-out saga, which has proved to be an unwelcome distraction to their premiership campaign. Wade Graham was the first NRL player to be grilled by ASADA, although his interview was abandoned after three hours over a legal argument about how much assistance he was required to provide. The players have been told they do not have to answer any questions that might incriminate them, but ASADA insists they must provide information about their teammates. However, the players' legal representatives believe they could implicate themselves should they, for example, admit they were in the same room as a teammate who was administered with a performance-enhancing substance.

The legal team of one of the players believes they do not need to submit to interview requests after studying documents including the NRL's code of conduct and the standard playing contract.

A separate legal source, lawyer Zali Burrows, prepared her own statement also questioning the NRL's agreement with ASADA.

''The players are under no compulsion or a contractual obligation to participate in ASADA interviews,'' Burrows wrote. ''[The] NRL is ascribing to make it a compulsive investigation yet the ASADA Act does not provide to compel a player to a coercive examination. An ASADA interview is voluntary, it is not under oath and without caution. ASADA cannot compel witnesses to attend or waive privilege against self-incrimination. In that context, if the player is a non-attendee and it is deemed to be a contract breach, then that is nonsense.

''It could be challenged that the NRL cannot hold to contract the erosion of a basic human right by forcing players to participate in an ASADA interview. If there are allegations of a criminal nature, the players are entitled to privilege against self-incrimination and the s89 of the Evidence Act 1995 precludes an unfavourable inference being drawn from an accused choosing to exercise their right to silence.''

Burrows, the partner of former Cronulla great Mark McGaw, has offered legal advice to at least one Sharks player. ''Article 4 of the ICCPR [International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights] provides a State may take measures derogating from its obligations in time of public emergency which threatens the life of the nation,'' Burrows wrote. ''Allegations of illegal drug use in Sport are arguably not a threat to the nation despite what the tabloids scream. ASADA is not afforded coercive powers as to conduct coercive questioning. Requests for interview are merely an invitation only. If this is a criminal investigation then the police should be conducting the investigation.''

Fairfax Media has been told that some players might consider granting interview requests even if they are not legally required to do so.
 

R2Coupe

Juniors
Messages
1,520
Still trying divert attention from being caught out as coupe and CT being one and the same.

How's the floods?
Have you planned an 18 story extension to your house so you can still have a view?
Are all of your CT posts cleared and authorised by your wife and Capsis?

Crazy Crazy person you are indeed.

Have an awesome day crazy coupe and keep these things in mind;

Sharks will still be there after this ASADA garbage is over
Gal tower will rise high above your picturesque little corner of heaven and will provide you years of viewing pleasure.
Sharks fans will flock into your streets, park everywhere and make noise often.
The shopping centre at the Sharks development will be so convenient that your wife will support us by regularly shopping there.
And the best part, after the development is complete your roads will be filled with new residents making their way to and from wok everyday.

You are going to love it Crazy Coupe, love it!

The damage to the NRL being done and the impact this may have on sponsorship dollars (which hurts all Clubs) does not concern you?

Miller, if the Sharks have done nothing wrong, what is the problem with Sharks players cooperating with ASADA?
 

Canard

Immortal
Messages
36,107
So we can put to bed the assertion that it's only ASADA that are dragging this out
 

Sea_Eagles_Rock

First Grade
Messages
5,216
If that is accurate, they currently have little evidence, based on a reasonable expectation that they would have made an example of somebody to put the wind up the rest of them.

They cannot force players to interview and cannot use evidence from the crime commission.

Other than comments from a previous trainer, what do they have? I can't imagine it would be too hard to establish that Elkin could be viewed as a disgruntled former employee.
 

Eion

First Grade
Messages
8,034
Been answered countless times by many posters crazy.

You've been outed, go and play with the tractors now, you'll be hearing them daily for months as gal tower goes up. Just be sure to ask your missus permission first.
 

Sea_Eagles_Rock

First Grade
Messages
5,216
So we can put to bed the assertion that it's only ASADA that are dragging this out

ASADA cancelled the interviews. As far as we are aware the players were going to go. Graham did. I think it is fair to say the response to dig deeper on their legal rights is fair response to ASADA delaying the interview process further after taking so long to start.
 
Messages
17,566
The damage to the NRL being done and the impact this may have on sponsorship dollars (which hurts all Clubs) does not concern you?

Miller, if the Sharks have done nothing wrong, what is the problem with Sharks players cooperating with ASADA?

Maybe ASADA should consider conducting themselves in accordance with their mandate.

If they have evidence, use it. Give it to the NRL. Have players busted based on evidence they have. Happy for any player from any club to be busted and outed based upon evidence gained in an appropriate manner.

If their own mandate does not compel a sports person from complying or attending an interview, then what is the issue if they chose not to do so?

Tell me crazy coupe, what would you be saying if the police could take away your right to silence and to be judged upon evidence, not innuendo?

Nobody want cheats in the game, however it is ASADA job to gather evidence and players have the right of the presumption of innocence. Something you do not appear to believe is their right.

Your alter ego has harped on like a screwed up drug addict about people's rights, when being critical of the Police, so I find the attitude about the conduct of this investigation somewhat hypocritical and when it's all said and done, agenda driven rubbish by someone with an axe to grind.

Have an awesome day!
 

Spot On

Coach
Messages
13,903
So we can put to bed the assertion that it's only ASADA that are dragging this out

It is possible that if ASADA had not farked around for months and began interviewing say just 1 month after the darkest day presser then the interviews would have been well and truly finished. But, as it stands, they have for some reason decided that there was no rush to do anything. Some like to think they were "shaking the trees" and some like to think they have very little to charge anyone.

Has G. Toovey been interviewed yet???
 
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Spot On

Coach
Messages
13,903
The damage to the NRL being done and the impact this may have on sponsorship dollars (which hurts all Clubs) does not concern you?

Miller, if the Sharks have done nothing wrong, what is the problem with Sharks players cooperating with ASADA?

What's the problem with ASADA laying charges?????
 
Messages
21,880
The debate is about what constitutes reasonable assistance.

There will never be an agreement on that , it's a highy subjective term. Most likely one that was put there to look like they were doing something.

There was never any debate about whether a player was allowed legal representation.


Actually there was. The debate was if they would be allowed legal representation at the interviews.
 
Messages
21,880
The damage to the NRL being done and the impact this may have on sponsorship dollars (which hurts all Clubs) does not concern you?

Miller, if the Sharks have done nothing wrong, what is the problem with Sharks players cooperating with ASADA?

:lol:

The old , 'why not cooperate if you've done nothing wrong'


Innocent people have been railroaded by investigators many times. That's why people are afforded the right to silence.
 

Canard

Immortal
Messages
36,107
It is possible that if ASADA had not farked around for months and began interviewing say just 1 month after the darkest day presser then the interviews would have been well and truly finished. But, as it stands, they have for some reason decided that there was no rush to do anything. Some like to think they were "shaking the trees" and some like to think they have very little to charge anyone.

Has G. Toovey been interviewed yet???

Why is everyone so George Bush on this?

It's possible to have an opinion without believing an extreme viewpoint on either side
 

gUt

Coach
Messages
16,935
http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/league-news/time-for-asada-to-come-clean-20130504-2izuh.html

Time for ASADA to come clean

It's now been almost three months since that infamous press conference in Canberra where it was declared Australian sport was riddled with the widespread use of performance-enhancing drugs, links to organised crime and match fixing.

In the days that followed, six NRL clubs were summoned to a meeting with the Australian Sports Anti-Doping Authority because they had been named in an Australian Crime Commission report associated with these very serious matters.

Since that time, five of these clubs have been exonerated of any wrong doing with regards to systematic doping. No individual or club has been charged with any offense relating to these matters. One player has been interviewed, and from all reports that discussion resulted in a frustrated investigation team walking from the room in protest at an alleged lack of co-operation.

What we have seen though, is a continual feed of hysteria, unfounded allegations and threats of serious punishment to individuals, churned out through the various media platforms. Every week there is a new story. We have frozen blood samples. We have phone taps. We have credit card receipts. We will instigate compulsory blood passports for all athletes. Get in quick to cut yourself a deal. Then there is the "dob-in-a-mate" option to reduce your own suspension. If you lie to the investigators you will end up in jail.

I have huge concerns over what appears to be a deliberate campaign to force some individual to come forward and incriminate either himself or others of these alleged offences.

In the early days following the press conference, what appeared to be investigators giving sound legal advice to players on their rights and responsibilities in this process, now seems to be part of a strategy to extract from players the information and evidence ASADA needs to lay charges against a club or individual.

You see, in my own uneducated and often sceptical mind, I have these questions about the whole messy affair. Why the ferocity and aggression of the initial press conference when it's now shown the vast majority of the allegations made at that time were merely speculation or exaggeration? Who benefited from that press conference? Why haven't these organised crime groups and match fixers been arrested and charged? If ASADA had the evidence to lay charges, why haven't they? If ASADA had the evidence to lay charges, why do they need to conduct this protracted interview process?

Am I being naive?

My biggest concern now is for the rights of the players who are about to be interviewed this week after having been subjected to months of what I see as deliberate inducement, if not intimidation, from those who have fuelled this persistent media barrage of threats and allegations.

Have our players' rights been protected?

In a lengthy discussion, I raised my concerns with Judge Paul Conlon, a man who has worked for the past thirty years in criminal law, 20 of those years as one of the state's leading Crown Prosecutors and the past seven years served as a Judge in the District Court.

Judge Conlon also serves on the NRL judiciary and has been instrumental in developing the game's judicial processes, with particular attention to the issue of fairness to the players with regards to prosecution, evidence and suspensions. He has been a tremendous asset to our game.

Over now to the Judge - who unlike myself, does have an educated mind and is well versed in dealing with fact, rather than getting carried away with emotion. However, he said he too had serious concerns about the process. He said he was happy to have the discussion as it was important that rights of individuals were not disregarded in the process.

When asked if he could detail some of those concerns, he said: "That was quite a performance in Canberra in early March. Everyone witnessing it could be forgiven for thinking that there was reliable and credible 'evidence' to support the sensational allegations labelled as the 'blackest day in sport' and that charges would follow based on that 'evidence'. The findings of the ACC were handed to ASADA and to date very little has happened.
''For those who have had years of experience in criminal law and dealing with crime commissions they would know that crime commissions do not call press conferences to talk about investigation findings prior to charges being laid. It is difficult to put a 'spin' on it to legitimise what took place. That is not to say there were not legitimate concerns, however, clearly there are better ways of addressing those concerns with the codes. The CEOs had to take on face value the validity of the allegations relating to their sport. David Smith and the NRL have acted in good faith and they continue to do so. However, I have real concerns over whether ASADA have so acted.

''One example of ASADA apparently not acting in good faith is that initially they addressed club officials, who were informed of the discounts for players who came forward to assist. Six NRL clubs were named. However, at a later stage it was acknowledged that in respect of five of those clubs there was no evidence of systemic doping. Why were they named in the first place? Damage to the reputation of those clubs would be considerable. Alarm bells should have been ringing at that point.''

PG: How important are the interviews in this process?

JPC: ''One thing is certain - you don't need to conduct interviews with players if you have 'evidence'. With the assistance of some sections of the media, it would seem that a campaign has been conducted, designed to intimidate and threaten players that, unless they come forward and tell ASADA what it wants to hear, their livelihoods will be destroyed. If the players have the right to a presumption of innocence, then it is for the other party to prove the guilt and that party should act with propriety. Look, perhaps my most important role as chairman of the NRL judiciary is to ensure that the players get a fair hearing. As a Judge presiding daily over criminal trials I am concerned to ensure that those charged receive a fair trial and that their basic rights are protected. However, I have paid close attention to the unfolding saga as it would appear they have little interest in a fair and just process and are demonstrating little regard for the rights of players. Indeed it seems their belief is that players have no rights.''

PG: Do the players have any notice of the allegations against them?

JPC: ''I am aware that the players' legal representatives have, quite reasonably, requested ASADA to provide particulars and details of allegations about which they want to interview players. Those requests have simply been rejected. Yet the NRL are requiring players to attend interviews in the absence of any knowledge of the allegations being made against them. I understand the NRL are doing that to assist the process. A recent newspaper article carried the headline, "Sports stars face a year in jail if they lie to ASADA" and quoted a section of the Commonwealth Criminal Code. It is highly questionable whether that would have any applicability to the interviewing of players by ASADA and, in any event, as the section involves a criminal sanction, surely the players would be entitled to a caution in respect of their right to silence. However, ASADA is of the view they have no right to silence. This is just another example of the intimidatory tactics being employed that may well lead to placing the players under duress. If the police in any state of Australia were to conduct the interview of suspected persons in this manner, our courts would rule the interview inadmissible. Under the NRL Anti Doping Code, players are required to provide 'reasonable assistance'. Sure, players should provide reasonable assistance, but this must be predicated on the assumption that those conducting this enquiry are behaving ethically and with propriety. On the evidence displayed in the public arena it would appear that has not been the case.''

PG: How can we get this matter resolved?

JPC: ''ASADA should be told to charge if they have evidence. The lives of people should not be the subject of a political game. Now, I understand difficult and important issues are involved, however, if there is no evidence, the government need to be so advised. Their legitimate concerns may then be able to be addressed by an inquiry where all parties are free to provide information without penalty. That would allow for the real problems, if they exist, to be addressed and for all sports to move forward with a new understanding. Of course, that will not happen if the only real interest at the moment is to claim a few 'scalps'.''

Like I said, I hope that our players' rights will be protected during this interview process.

Twitter-@gusgould91

:clap:
 

Pete Cash

Post Whore
Messages
62,165
We all know these drug agencies are slow as shit and will happily take forever to investigate. I just wish nothing had been mentioned until they had the evidence to establish a case. All the clubs under investigation and the governance of ASADA should have just kept quiet.
 
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