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OT: Current Affairs and Politics

Discussion in 'Parramatta Eels' started by Gronk, Dec 10, 2018.

  1. Gronk

    Gronk Moderator Staff Member

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    Which brings us back to the bill. How is legislation that allows discrimination against muslims or catholics or farmers of pork or gays getting married or people seeking to avoid blood transfusions or for that matter ANYONE who does not vote for trump etc good for a cohesive society? This opens a pandora’s box of cluster f**kness.

    What ever happened to the separation of church and state ? It’s part of the constitution ya know.

    Ch 5 § 116 The Commonwealth shall not make any law for establishing any religion, or for imposing any religious observance, or for prohibiting the free exercise of any religion, and no religious test shall be required as a qualification for any office or public trust under the Commonwealth.


     
  2. Gary Gutful

    Gary Gutful Immortal

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    Folau would still fail based on the following caveats "statements must be made in good faith; not be malicious or harass, vilify or incite hatred against a person or group; not advocate for the commission of a serious criminal offence."

    Gender is f**king binary. It has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with science. Why should people be forced to pretend otherwise? I'll be respectful to someone that identifies as Ze, but sharing my view that gender is binary in a respectful manner is not discrimination. Just as them sharing their views in a respectful manner isn't discrimination against me.

    This example is f**king stupid. Assuming an employee was stupid enough to say this and ruin their employers business, the single mother would not be discriminating against them if they said "get f**ked, I am taking my kid elsewhere"

    I doubt it. Sounds like a pretty malicious thing to say.

    At non-religious school? Unlikely.

    I have never in 40 years of my existence ever discussed religion with a f**king retail assistant. This seems like a bullshit example. If it did happen, I would argue that it is malicious and designed to incite hatred.

    Pretty easy to ask for one that will.

    Shit example. That would be sorted out amongst the hospital. A patient would turn up and be treated by someone just as they are now.

    Doctor: "I wont prescribe you a pill but I will get another doctor that will."

    Patient: "That's discrimination!".

    I don't imagine too many pharmacists would risk jeopardising their business in such a way but if they are stupid enough to do so then it is pretty f**ken easy to go to another pharmacy.

    What a crock of shit. We are all going to become pregnant now? Please. Consider this rationally. A hospital would work out which Drs they have on board and ensure that they have coverage should someone need a super critical, super emergency PEP (within 3 f**king days).

    I'm struggling to see the problem here. Is the suggestion that by saying such a thing, she is encouraging her to commit suicide? Weird. If that is the inference then there are already protections against psychiatrists encouraging suicide.

    Could be, but would it be? I don't think so.

    I'm not convinced that many employers will push this too far for fear of being arse f**ked by a large portion of the population

    But in practical terms, in the unlikely event that it does happen, how does that impact a potential employee?

    Either they miss out on a job because they aren't religious enough, they have to act more religious while at work or they can choose to apply for a completely different job.

    I don't see that as discrimination, I see that as someone potentially being a poor fit for an organisation and an employer.

    There are many jobs that I will never get because of who I am.

    They don't want a satan worshipper on their Board? Fancy that!

    What does that mean in real terms and where exactly is the discrimination?

    I don't have a problem with this. If I am religious and inviting someone into my home to perform such a critical task where they effectively become part of the family it is reasonable for someone to be able to make that choice.

    Would it really happen that way? In 99.99999% of cases it wil be a simple question - Can you work the hours?

    This seems to be implying that someone should be compelled to hire a person who can't fulfill the requirements of the job? Thats f**ken daft.

    Most of these examples have been f**ken stupid but this takes it to a new level.

    More scare tactics. That is a hateful and malicious statement that would be unlikely to get through.

    Also, religion aside, a lot of companies have social media policies that prohibit you from saying much about your work place. The above comment would be a clear breach of that.

    Why the f**ken f**k would a non jewish person want to go to jewish school? F**k me!

    I'd like to think that in virtually every case it would be worked out between the school, kid and parents in a respectful manner.

    I just can't honestly see a what a school would have to gain by doing that.

    Lets flip this for a minute. The First Church of Satan should be allowed to use the Sydney Anglican Church's campsite to perform a black mass?

    F**k off.

    If I am applying to live in the home of someone who is deeply religious to the point where they would ask me that I am religious I am running a million f**king miles.

    But, given that it is their house I don't begrudge their right to do so even if I think they are weird.

    So at this point, you have to ask yourself what rights are actually being denied through enforcing such a rule?
     
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  3. Gronk

    Gronk Moderator Staff Member

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    Is your criticism of the article made through the lens of unity, understanding and inclusiveness or did you set out to rip it to bits via satire ?
     
  4. Poupou Escobar

    Poupou Escobar Post Whore

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    But we do. We're currently allowed to discriminate against people for exercising their religion.
     
  5. Poupou Escobar

    Poupou Escobar Post Whore

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    We moved away from the inclusive society long ago. Now we have multiple competing 'communities', and communities are by definition exclusive. In fact (most) religions are among the few communities that anyone can choose to become part of. Not so with racial communities or even many socioeconomic or geographic communities that require money to join.
     
    hindy111 likes this.
  6. Poupou Escobar

    Poupou Escobar Post Whore

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    See what I mean? Exclusion
     
  7. Bazal

    Bazal Post Whore

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    Yeah....nah
     
  8. Poupou Escobar

    Poupou Escobar Post Whore

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    Adults need to retain the right to choose their own values and not have the values of others foisted upon them. On the upside, Gronk, this will lead to big businesses (that sell goods and services to progressive rich white folk) hiring fewer religious employees. So your tribe will still keep winning.
     
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  9. Bandwagon

    Bandwagon Moderator Staff Member

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    No we are not.

    That's a load of shit , people are not permitted to practice their religion in a manner that discriminates against others, though there are so many exceptions to this that even that's only partially true.
     
  10. strider

    strider Post Whore

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    Im confused who is intimidating, the person withe the camera or all the people with masks trying to hide their identity for some reason
     
  11. Bandwagon

    Bandwagon Moderator Staff Member

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    Yet the very thing you complain of here in reality only exists in that those very same adults are restricted in choosing their values only in sense of foisting their values upon others.

    It's quite the conundrum.

    Ha ha ha, it's amazing how the conservative has become such a victim these days. FFS.
     
  12. Gronk

    Gronk Moderator Staff Member

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    I see, so legislation that permits or even encourages division in the community is good ?

    upload_2020-3-1_14-27-32.jpeg

    upload_2020-3-1_14-28-14.jpeg

    upload_2020-3-1_14-29-5.jpeg

    upload_2020-3-1_14-29-55.jpeg
     
  13. Gronk

    Gronk Moderator Staff Member

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    Ok way to make things personal. Didn’t this escalate quickly ? Don’t let your insecurities cloud the debate merkin.
     
  14. strider

    strider Post Whore

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    I won't pretend i know all about all .... serious question - what would currently happen if they did not introduce this? Are people who feel strongly about their beliefs currently open to prosecution if they say/do all that stuff? I wouldnt have thought so. Or maybe i just dont know.
     
  15. strider

    strider Post Whore

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    The article is clearly a one sided attempt to create fear

    I agree with gutful .... most the examples there are quite extreme and very unlikely and even if they are real then the person on the receiving end would be better off dealing with someone else than the shithead being bad to them
     
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  16. Gary Gutful

    Gary Gutful Immortal

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    It is designed to stop discrimination on religious grounds. I'm against any kind of discrimination rather than just the discrimination against things I happen to like and stand for.
     
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  17. Bandwagon

    Bandwagon Moderator Staff Member

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    What it's supposed to do is allow religious people and institutions practical exemptions from current laws around discrimination where the particular discrimination they wish to indulge in is part of their religious practice or doctrine.

    It is also designed to protect these same people and institutions from having to perform certain services they would otherwise have to perform if that in providing that service it be in contravention of their religious practice or beliefs.

    The whole problem around it for mine is that it sets in place a hierarchy of rights, whereby the rights of some trump the rights of others based solely upon their religious beliefs.

    I will gladly concede here i am openly hostile to the idea of one groups rights being given precedence over another's on the basis that they talk to the sky.
     
  18. Bandwagon

    Bandwagon Moderator Staff Member

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    No, I don't believe that is the case, it is one of the intents I'm sure, but in doing so it also further enshrines in law the ability to discriminate upon religious grounds. Only that the grounds are established via belief rather than membership of any particular religion.
     
  19. Gary Gutful

    Gary Gutful Immortal

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    1. You should't lecture on the basis of "unity, undertstanding and inclusiveness" when many of the people who are critical of the bill are showing anything but that.

    2. Rather than silly, meaningless knee jerk reactions I decided to explore each of the listed concerns in detail and form my own opinion on their merit.

    3. I doubt you'll be able to argue me on the specifics because based on any rational interpretation, the concerns that have been outlined are pretty weak. They are either irrelevant, unlikely or just plain misguided.

    4. I don't have a lot of time for religion, but I don't believe people should be discriminated against because they are practicing it.

    5. A lot of the concerns raised by people about not being able to go a jewish schoool or be employed by a church seem like a f**ken pathetic attempt to be a victim. I doubt they'd give two f**ks if there was some other type of discrimination towards some other group that ultimately benefitted them.

    Come on man, you are a smart guy. Surely you can concede that I have a point?
     
  20. strider

    strider Post Whore

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    Talk to the sky or whatever .... people are entitled to their beliefs to an extent

    I think in cases where there is a readily available alternative, like cases gary mentioned above, then i dont have a problem with people basing their decisions in line with their beliefs

    I think a staunch catholic dr should be able to say i dont believe in the pill, so im not presribing it - cos theres a heap of others that are available.

    And no im certainly not religious myself ... i dabbled in high school cos some of my friends were and i wanted to pick up chicks (yeah, didnt think that through) - but i came out of that stage
     
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