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RLIF website

Sun_Down

Juniors
Messages
1,637
Where is this site we were told was coming at the start of the year? I sent an email to various parties, but got no reply...
 

yakstorm

First Grade
Messages
5,728
The site is still under production, funding for the site has been secured, and currently the RLIF is talking to different companies over producing it and checking pricing. Items such as branding of the RLIF, and World Cup 2008 are things that are also being discussed and will be tied into the new site.

The plan launch will be just before the Tri-Nations.
 

griff

Bench
Messages
3,322
yakstorm said:
Items such as branding of the RLIF, and World Cup 2008 are things that are also being discussed and will be tied into the new site.

That raises a few alarm bells for me. Does that mean the same company will be responsible for doing the website as is responsible for developing the RLIF and RLWC identities?

If this is the case then the development of the RLWC brand identity will take place separate from the development of the marketing strategy of the RLWC. And we are likely to get either a second rate set of logos or a second rate website, or both.

On the other hand if the website is just on hold while waiting for the new logos to be developed by a decent branding firm, then I am happy to wait. Better take the time to get it perfect.
 

yakstorm

First Grade
Messages
5,728
griff said:
That raises a few alarm bells for me. Does that mean the same company will be responsible for doing the website as is responsible for developing the RLIF and RLWC identities?

If this is the case then the development of the RLWC brand identity will take place separate from the development of the marketing strategy of the RLWC. And we are likely to get either a second rate set of logos or a second rate website, or both.

On the other hand if the website is just on hold while waiting for the new logos to be developed by a decent branding firm, then I am happy to wait. Better take the time to get it perfect.

Sorry should of phrased it better, the logos are being looked after by a professional logo company, the same one that did the past couple of Summer Olympic Logos to give you an indication.

Marketing strategy and that is being worked on by the group doing the 08 World Cup, and yeah website a different group again, and yeah its all then got to be tied in all together.
 

dimitri

First Grade
Messages
7,980
I just hope that its released before the tri series


and that it is used extensively to promote the 2008 world cup as soon as it is released

also the nrl and super league sites should have links to it!
 

screeny

Bench
Messages
3,984
Yakstorm, do the other nations get a say in what content goes on it? Test nations like SA and Samoa for example?

Now I'm starting to get an idea why there hasn't been a site 'til now: the RLIF would have to admit that damp squibs like SA and Samoa are full Test nations.
 

Big Bunny

Juniors
Messages
1,801
I'm looking forward to seeing the website, I'm sure it will be great. As far as logos go, well the Sydney Olympic one was pretty good but for the life of me I wouldn't know the Atlanta one if plastered in front of me. I did send a submission into the RLIF some time ago, one I'd hoped might be adopted but since it won't be used I see no harm in posting it for reactions anyway..
 

Jeffles

Bench
Messages
3,412
Looks OK but I don't get the RLIF Austrlalia - what sort of otrganisation is that?

Oh, and I'd make the RLIF colours Red and Yellow.
 

Big Bunny

Juniors
Messages
1,801
Jeffles said:
Looks OK but I don't get the RLIF Austrlalia - what sort of otrganisation is that?

Oh, and I'd make the RLIF colours Red and Yellow.

The same as any international organisation, domestic branches or offices. They were just examples, not gospel Jeffles. As for the colour, well I wouldn't go with red and yellow, it's too often associated with fast food.
 

griff

Bench
Messages
3,322
Good effort Big Bunny and always good to see talented RL people offering to contribute for nothing in return. But I must admit I am not a huge fan of the design although I like the second one as it is the cleanest and simplest. Would they print ok in mono? On letterhead and business card size wouldn't the map of the world be way too small to print properly?
 

griff

Bench
Messages
3,322
yakstorm said:
Sorry should of phrased it better, the logos are being looked after by a professional logo company, the same one that did the past couple of Summer Olympic Logos to give you an indication.

Marketing strategy and that is being worked on by the group doing the 08 World Cup, and yeah website a different group again, and yeah its all then got to be tied in all together.

All good. Although I thought MI Associates just did project and management and planning, not marketing as well.
 

Big Bunny

Juniors
Messages
1,801
griff said:
Good effort Big Bunny and always good to see talented RL people offering to contribute for nothing in return. But I must admit I am not a huge fan of the design although I like the second one as it is the cleanest and simplest. Would they print ok in mono? On letterhead and business card size wouldn't the map of the world be way too small to print properly?

Fair enough, I did two designs, one modern and one a rather ordinary retro piece that was actually favoured.

Mono - yes. Small enough - yes, without detail in the map, but mate no logo with any detail to it is designed to have its smallest elements crystal without a magnifying glass at those small sizes, however the logo would print just fine as it's a scalable vector format, not a bitmap. Apart from the footy stuff I do this as my job rather than as a hobby.
 

griff

Bench
Messages
3,322
Big Bunny said:
Fair enough, I did two designs, one modern and one a rather ordinary retro piece that was actually favoured.

Mono - yes. Small enough - yes, without detail in the map, but mate no logo with any detail to it is designed to have its smallest elements crystal without a magnifying glass at those small sizes, however the logo would print just fine as it's a scalable vector format, not a bitmap. Apart from the footy stuff I do this as my job rather than as a hobby.

Yeah I know, I remember from when you did the Kenya logo. I'm not a designer but have had a little bit to do with them and the logo design process in my job, and so those are the sort of things I think about when looking at logos.

As I said, I like the two colour one. In terms of cost these days printing it wouldn't be much cheaper but the less colours the better the logo in my experience.
 

Big Bunny

Juniors
Messages
1,801
griff said:
Yeah I know, I remember from when you did the Kenya logo. I'm not a designer but have had a little bit to do with them and the logo design process in my job, and so those are the sort of things I think about when looking at logos.

As I said, I like the two colour one. In terms of cost these days printing it wouldn't be much cheaper but the less colours the better the logo in my experience.

Mate every job is different, some require full colour, some have heavy detail due to being used exclusively on the web whilst in other occasions cost restrictions require specific inks, 1 or two colours and any other number of issues. Whilst Kenya was a big let down on the development front, the logo was only ever designed for being embroidered and with the RLIF design all you need to see is R.L.I.F and that's all anyone will care about, along with a football clearly visible at a size suitable for letterheads and business cards. Secondary text elements can be changed in an instant to reflect whatever usage you require.

The colour as you can see was in a variety of styles and they all print fine in monotone, duotone, greytone and any other permutation when done. I haven't even posted the other 40 or so colour combinations let alone size charts or usage guides.

You may have had to deal with design elements in the past in your work but seriously if you've ever had to worry about the issues you've questioned here then I do suggest that you change marketing, design or ad agency partners for the benefit of your business, because they are basic questions learnt, understood, grappled and dealt with, by every graphic designer early in their first year of uni.
 

griff

Bench
Messages
3,322
Well certainly when I was at uni those were the visual communication issues we considered as well. I was always taught and been advised by graphic designers I have worked with that intricate elements like that aren't usually advisable because when reproduced and printed and faxed with the whole logo maybe only 20mm across, the detail of the map of the world would be only about 2mm wide, and so the map would not really work. But as it is not my area of expertise I was asking your expert opinion if this would be the case.

I was also just mentioning that purely from an aesthetics point of view and even ignoring cost etc that IMO the less colours and the simpler the better. I think that's probably still a trusim unless they have drastically revised the first year syllabus.

So based on that I do prefer your second one using two rather than four different colours, and solid blocks of colour rather than the gradation.

All in all I think they are very well done but had some queries about how the design would be applied in practice, that's all.
 

Big Bunny

Juniors
Messages
1,801
I'm really not keen on having to explain design issues unless it's a paying client who needs to understand the work being done for them and how to apply it. But you've questioned my methods and the basic design principles that I adhere to, based perhaps on a few conversations and dealings with other designers. It's pretty clear though that you're going to make your own conclusions and assumptions regardless of what's explained to you. To address what you have both stated and queried:

1. The logo you are looking at is nowhere near complicated by general market standards. Not every logo is a Nike or McDonalds. Do you think the NSW police logo fails to work on a business card? Some designs are simple and often that's best, but in many cases it's not what is required. Simplicity is a goal but sacrificing quality for the points you've raised isn't necessary or worthwhile.

There's a lot of elements on the NSW police logo, but it's still as clear as day in its nature and what it represents because the internal elements are easily interpreted for what they are.

I'm not sure if you consider NRL team logos to be problematic and too complicated but going on your own logic a readily identifiable blue and white football in my design is one that on shape alone and colour scheme must make every NRL club design seem equally as problematic.

So what if you can't see Australia and its coastlines on the football/globe? Your saying it doesn't work with that detail is like saying an outline style map of Australia fails to convey the message or be identifiable because it's missing rivers and borders. Or that the rabbits eye on Souths design makes the piece fall apart when you can only see the rabbit outline. Simple always works, but sometimes it's just not necessary to the extent you prefer.

2. All of the variations which you've looked at are all the same logotype, only with a different tagline. It's not a number of different designs. The colours were simple examples and a few of the many. Mate even if you were to open a copy of photoshop and shrink the designs and then have them printed to the size required for a business card you still won't get a fair representation of how it will print because of the nature of vector graphics based on coordinates as opposed to bitmaps and the way they pixelate.

3. The full colour version you've seen complete with gradients would never appear on a business card, it's for large print and web. The card version would be flat colours only. And hey, I'll tell you now, whilst 1-2 colours is often handy (hence having created roughly 35x2 colour variants among the 40) many logos work with more.

4. Just so you know, that full colour design, when it's printed using flat non gradiated colours it's still would only be 2 colours purchased on top of the black ink; various shades of a specific colour do not count as adding to the cost.

Every element of the design that you've questioned are those that are taken into account with every design I've created since the late 90's. I do welcome the questions and appreciate discussion but the assumptions you've made aren't exactly on target.
 

griff

Bench
Messages
3,322
Obviously you put a lot of work in on your own time and have a lot invested in them, and I'm not trying to criticise them or get into an argument about their merits or about the printing process.

The fact we are even having this discussion is because the current RLIF logo is a shocker and drastically needs replacing, so we should be focussing on that instead.

Is the retro one still in consideration? Who picks the logo? Having an RLIF committee picking a logo would be a nightmare.
 

Big Bunny

Juniors
Messages
1,801
Agreed.

The retro design was rubbish to begin with, it's like a tidied up version of the current design but wouldn't look out of place on the cover of a 1950's atlas. That it was liked really had me puzzled.. but anyway..

I don't really know who picks the design, I'd assume it's just Geoff Carr and Colin Love. As Yakstorm mentioned, they are going with the people that did the Olympics logo so I at least don't have any major fears about its quality. But which Olympic logo?

Sydney
http://www.futurebrand.com.au/futurebrand.html

Atlanta
http://www.landor.com/
 
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