Round 1 vs. Bulldogs Discussion + Voting

[Dazzat]

Just watching the Footy Show ... Thaiday was asked he was putting pressure on Ben Hunt at the club. He only volunteered Kodi Nikorima.

Griffin has clearly shown his philosophy on new, young players. He will only blood them, and give them a go, because of a crisis. Corey Oates for example, only was given an opportunity to show his class last year because we were fresh out of wingers.

How is this a way to build a club for the future, and isn't it why we are now in this dilemma now, where the club has a very shallow talent pool?

And the same will happen with Hoffman and Nikorima. The kid will only be given a go when the club is bumping along in the bottom six, and handed the responsibility of digging the team out of a hole.

Griffin should be showing some faith in young players. I believe we only played three of our four bench on Friday night. Surely he could have selected Nikorima on the bench and given him 10 minutes when the game was in the bag.

 

[man2iel_]

Just watching the Footy Show ... Thaiday was asked he was putting pressure on Ben Hunt at the club. He only volunteered Kodi Nikorima.

Griffin has clearly shown his philosophy on new, young players. He will only blood them, and give them a go, because of a crisis. Corey Oates for example, only was given an opportunity to show his class last year because we were fresh out of wingers.

How is this a way to build a club for the future, and isn't it why we are now in this dilemma now, where the club has a very shallow talent pool?

And the same will happen with Hoffman and Nikorima. The kid will only be given a go when the club is bumping along in the bottom six, and handed the responsibility of digging the team out of a hole.

Griffin should be showing some faith in young players. I believe we only played three of our four bench on Friday night. Surely he could have selected Nikorima on the bench and given him 10 minutes when the game was in the bag.

Kodi has Alf's endorsement. Enough said. Play him Hook.

 

[Big Pete]

Corey Oates for example, only was given an opportunity to show his class last year because we were fresh out of wingers.

Oates was brought into the team off the bench against Melbourne after a fantastic display in the NYC team the week before.

Bad example.

 

[Bronco18]

Man lots of negativity here.. I thought we won?

I know the Dogs are in a period of transition themselves, but we are too aren't we? After getting pummeled by the Warriors in the trials, one would think we would have been more appreciative of that heroic defensive effort (especially after last years second half fade-outs).

Also, I think some of us actually need to appreciate some of Griffin's conservative selections. We paid him out for leaving out Granville and Nikorama but those two little fellas might have really struggled in that second half. Imagine having a spine of Hunt, Nikorama, Barba and Granville on at the same time? The dogs would've ran in more tries than they did. Maranta showed why he was chosen ahead of Mills; what he lacks in attack he makes up for with his safe decision making and catching. I will admit though I didn't think Maranta had some of that in him.

 

[Boy]

You can't seriously doubt Granville's defence can you ?
He's a kid who can back it up in defence

Get kodi in
Granville on bench as utility
Hoffman goes on wing with reed
I want hodges and vidot on the same side
Copley to contest weekly for a spot

That back line will win us games if given the freedom to play how they want
No more bomb to corner and hope
Every player is a danger when the balls in their hands

If we do any good this year it will be because of the players not the coach
But I have hope of a better season

 

[Dazzat]

Oates was brought into the team off the bench against Melbourne after a fantastic display in the NYC team the week before.

Bad example.

OK Pete. Oates may have won his initial start in first grade, but he was only retained because we ran out of wingers.

Take Glanville as another example - one game last year I believe. Getting a start is one thing. Having a carefully considered, and executed strategy for bringing young players through is another.

Can you name one player that has been successfully "blooded" in Griffin's time? I can't think of one. Maybe Maranta ...? He would be the only young player Griffin has persisted with.

Look at the Sydney Roosters in contrast. Their premiership team had several players who had less than two year's experience.

Usually I don't get upset with coaches and will give them the benefit of the doubt. But I don't believe in defending the indefensible.

 

[JamesBrandy]

I agree with what somebody said earlier about Reed should be worried about losing his spot when Hodges comes back.
To be honest I don't know why we even bother having a left winger in attack with Reed playing out there at centre.

1. Barba
2. Hoffman
3. Copley
4. Hodges
5. Vidot

 

[Big Pete]

OK Pete. Oates may have won his initial start in first grade, but he was only retained because we ran out of wingers.

Who is to say? Yes he wound up on the wing because he played remarkably well there but the Broncos were thin on forwards and the club has a high opinion of him. If they didn't, he wouldn't have signed an NRL contract in 2012.

Can you name one player that has been successfully "blooded" in Griffin's time?

English international Jack Reed.

Their premiership team had several players who had less than two year's experience.

They also made a few handy and 'conveniently' well-timed signings that occurred right after the salary cap was upgraded. Hmmm...

But I don't believe in defending the indefensible.

Nor letting facts get in the way of a good rant. ;-)

 

[Dazzat]

Mmm .. one player Jack Reid in two years. And I'd argue that Jack Reid played his best football when he first made grade and has gone backwards a little since.

Again, I have seen no player actually improve under Griffin. A promising player like Norman went backwards during the last year.

No young players have been developed and we are struggling with no depth whatsoever. This point is beyond dispute.

 

[Big Pete]

Hey you asked me to name ONE player. Talk about shifting the goal posts to suit an agenda.

 

[u4er]

Reed seems to cop a bad rap on here. He's one of the best defensive centres getting around, he hasn't done much in attack in the last couple of seasons but I remember him doing his best work under kicks close to the oppositions line, been a while since he's had any decent kicks to work with.

 

[Dazzat]

Hey you asked me to name ONE player. Talk about shifting the goal posts to suit an agenda.

Pete, with all respect as I think you probably know more about the club than me, but I granted you the "one player" in Jack Reed, but pointed out that he was playing better football when he came to grade than he is now. So, he hasn't really "developed" as a player IMO.

I would say the only younger players that have improved during Griffin's tenure are McCullough and Maguire. McCullough's progress has been painstaking - improvement, but at a very slow rate. Maguire much the same, although again, I was playing better two years ago than he is now.

I don't believe Griffin has a plan for player development - otherwise we could see one in action. His decision making is based on the short-term, and I'd imagine we are getting to the point, his decision making will be tainted by the threat of keeping his own job.

 

[man2iel_]

A "I know more about the club pissing contest" - fantastic. I was there for round one 1988; can I join in? We are better than this surely as a supporter group and let's face it: google and the Rugby League Annual Review are your best friend when one wants to go all David Middleton on a member LOL

Dazzat, I agree with your sentiment as Griffin is short sighted. I've held that view for a while now and you're again correct to state, "his decision making will be tainted by the threat of keeping his own job." Griffin knows he is under the pump and is long odds to retain his job past this season.

 

[Bronco18]

You can't seriously doubt Granville's defence can you ?
He's a kid who can back it up in defence

I haven't followed much of him in the Qld Cup, but last year he was dropped after an average defensive effort against the Bulldogs and their giant pack. Having him, Hunt and Nikorama on at the same time is dangerous.

 

[Pierced Soul]

Vidot is going to be one of the signings of the years if he keeps up that kind of form.

he was great. we havent had a powerful winger like that since folau left, and before that it was tuquiri. he showed why he and yow yeh were both fighting for the vacant origin position a few years ago

Where did he get his nickname because I have never seen him "hook" any player no matter how deserving.

he played hooker as a kid. the nickname comes from that. it's a double edged sword. if he chops and chanegs he gets accussed of not giving players time to settle into their roles. i think his problem is he actually gives them too much time and hopes they'll come good. it took him most of last season to see norman wasnt putting in

Usual concerning quotes from Griffin after the game, telling us that he thought Hoffman had a good game at No. 6.

Why is it always the case that one wonders if Griffin watches the same game as supporters do.

but does he bag hoffman instead? i mean the way things go in this day and age with the media you're safer to speak positively about players and tell them negative stuff behind closed doors. i dont think too many players would like to hear their coach bag them publicly.

Mmm .. one player Jack Reid in two years. And I'd argue that Jack Reid played his best football when he first made grade and has gone backwards a little since.

Again, I have seen no player actually improve under Griffin. A promising player like Norman went backwards during the last year.

No young players have been developed and we are struggling with no depth whatsoever. This point is beyond dispute.

Reed has become a nuffy since his first year. everytime the ball goes to him you expect him to drop it or trip over.

Norman seems to float in and out of games and has been doing it for a long time. he reminds me of jarryd hayne when he was younger in terms of temperament

the effort from the boys was there which is important in the first few rounds. both wingers were excellent, i thought glenn and gillett did a lot of work in attack and defence. macca looks to have stepped up again. it was a win and it was something to build on.

coaches rarely change winning teams so hoffman will likely be in 6 again next week. whislt i'd like to think he can only improve, i suspect the hoffman at 6 ploy will ultimately fail. kodi may have gone well in the 20's but i'm pretty sure in the trials he never really stood up. that only really leaves someone like barba and i dont think you'd want to move him from the back and increase his defensive workload

 

[Bronco18]

I think we can all agree Hoffman is just a stop-gap option. Blooding Nikorama at his age might be damaging to his confidence and Strasser has done little to impress. Moving Barba to 5/8th means making two big positional changes when only one is necessary.

Barring Hoffman improving by leaps and bounds, Kahu will slot back in soon enough and Hoff can return to a running role.

 

[Dazzat]

I think we can all agree Hoffman is just a stop-gap option. Blooding Nikorama at his age might be damaging to his confidence and Strasser has done little to impress. Moving Barba to 5/8th means making two big positional changes when only one is necessary.

Barring Hoffman improving by leaps and bounds, Kahu will slot back in soon enough and Hoff can return to a running role.

I know there is a balance when it comes to blooding new players, but one only needs to look at the lack of depth at the club to realise that we are baby-ing our young players to their development's detriment.

Our bench on the weekend consisted of Lowrie, Hannant, Kennedy and Wallace. Wallace played no minutes. I think that says it all. I would argue that NOT playing someone like Wallace is more damaging to one's confidence than if he played and made a mistake or two.

And Griffin has done this time and time again. He has also shown he is more likely to select an older hack - like Lowrie or Stagg - than a younger player with potential.

 

[Kiwi]

My votes would be

3 - Parker
2 - McCullough
1 - Vidot

Gee it's nice to see a big fast strong winger back on the flank again

 

[man2iel_]

Daniel Vidot I was excited about when we jagged him; confirmed why on Friday night. Here is hoping we have a long term option here. I cannot put him ahead of Maranta though for the 3, 2, 1.

 

[Big Pete]

A "I know more about the club pissing contest" - fantastic. I was there for round one 1988; can I join in? We are better than this surely as a supporter group and let's face it: google and the Rugby League Annual Review are your best friend when one wants to go all David Middleton on a member LOL

Dazzat, I agree with your sentiment as Griffin is short sighted. I've held that view for a while now and you're again correct to state, "his decision making will be tainted by the threat of keeping his own job." Griffin knows he is under the pump and is long odds to retain his job past this season.

Is that how it's coming across? My bad, wasn't my intention but a few points needed to be straightened out.

For what it's worth, Hook is clearly on borrowed time as we speak and I'm sure we'll have a new head coach by next year. In saying that, I don't believe player development is really a key concern for him. A few cases here and there but if anything his faith in his 2012 squad and landing the Milford signing for 2014 is what's done him in.

And that doesn't even go into his lackluster attacking structure nor the mediocre defence.