Rumours and Stuff

[Bandwagon]

Is it Moses?

Is it Moses what?

 

[Glenneel]

Eels circling for Jai Arrow.

https://www.nospam47.com/au/league/...eels-garth-brennan/1wxqfuuprr7cu1q58w1e669c4t

Good solid player and would add plenty to our pack, good tackler and we need plenty of those. Our attack has improved immeasurably but our defence still the same, poor, and that needs to improve before we'll be able to contest a grand final. Arrow and Welch would transform our pack and tbh would probably complete our recruitment for next year.

 

[Gary Gutful]

Is it Moses what?

 

[Glenneel]

You left out Brown. Is that how you're going to fit Paulo, Arrow and Welch under the cap?

In case you haven't heard with the players being let go and re-signing of others, most for less, we should have plenty of money for 2 x $400k props. MJs salary, if re-signed, will drop from $700k to around $300-350k (my guess) that'll almost pay for one on its own.

 

[Glenneel]

Absolutely. If they were both evenly priced it wouldn’t even be a question. But in the age of salary caps you have to find value in your roster.

I also don’t think we should be relying solely on an untested Utoikamanu, which is why I think Welsh would be a decent pick up. Although he is now an “origin player”, I don’t think he’d cost as much as Arrow.

This would do nicely for next year (salaries are obviously estimates/guesses)

1. Gutho ($650k)
2. Fergo ($500k)
3. Blake ($500k)
4. Jennings ($400k)
5. Sivo ($200k)
6. Drown (upgrade to $500k)
7. Moses ($850k)
8. Paulo ($600k)
9. Mahoney ($300k)
10. Welsh ($500k)
11. Lane ($400k)
12. Mau ($400k)
13. Nrown ($600k)

14. Salmon ($300k)
15. Utoikamanu ($250k)
16. Niukore ($250k)
17. Gower ($200k)

18. Kaufusi ($200k)
19. Evans ($400k)
20. Tep ($200k)
21. Terepo ($200k)
22. Davies ($100k)
23. Davey ($100k)
24. Parry ($100k)
25. Stone ($150k)
26. Alvaro ($300k based on taking up option)
27. Hoffman ($200k)
28. French ($200k)
29. Schneider ($100k)
30. Smith ($150k)

This would come to $9.8 million, which would leave us about $400k spare.

Good summary Happy and probably about right with your values although I think some in there will not be here next year. Shows how a roster can be built under the cap without paying over the top values for under-performing players.

 

[Glenneel]

Defense will improve when Moses lesrns how to control a game. When to slow it down, find touch and al that. It doesnt matter how good defenders we have, if teams get 65% possesion in first 25mins we will always be up against it.
I do not see any real bad defenders in our side.

Well somethings wrong as we're down towards the bottom in defence!!!

 

[TheRam]

In case you haven't heard with the players being let go and re-signing of others, most for less, we should have plenty of money for 2 x $400k props. MJs salary, if re-signed, will drop from $700k to around $300-350k (my guess) that'll almost pay for one on its own.

Both Arrow and Welsh are 600K plus players now.

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

Good solid player and would add plenty to our pack, good tackler and we need plenty of those. Our attack has improved immeasurably but our defence still the same, poor, and that needs to improve before we'll be able to contest a grand final. Arrow and Welch would transform our pack and tbh would probably complete our recruitment for next year.

You're not going to complain that our pack is too small if we sign Arrow (101kg middle forward)?

 

[Happy MEel]

Both Arrow and Welsh are 600K plus players now.

Both are worth what the highest club is prepared to pay for them. I can see a desperate club offering Arrow around that figure but not Welsh

 

[TheRam]

Both are worth what the highest club is prepared to pay for them. I can see a desperate club offering Arrow around that figure but not Welsh

You do realize that there are always desperate clubs right?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

It does, but it also means defences can defend him easier. He’s our focal point in attack and oppositions know this, yet he is still coming up with points.

To be fair to Drown, he has shown a maturity and calmness far beyond his years thus far and I think it’s a much easier job to give an up and comer a structured game plan to follow, rather than be responsible for creating points. Look at Cleary for example.

As for the running half comment, that’s awesome. I want both of my halves keen to run the ball.

How many Origin halves didn't have a running game? Even Hodkinson would go himself when his runners were all covered.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Good summary Happy and probably about right with your values although I think some in there will not be here next year. Shows how a roster can be built under the cap without paying over the top values for under-performing players.

If teams pay overs for players it's not because they want to. They know how much players are worth. Getting them to sign for that much is the problem. If we want a player and the Roosters (for example) are offering 100% of what he is worth under the cap PLUS the opportunity to play rep footy PLUS money outside the cap, then we need to pay more than that 100% of what the player is worth, which means paying overs. The alternative is not signing any players.

The way you idiots talk you'd think everyone in rugby league knows how good players are except for the people running the weakest clubs. The problem isn't talent identification, it's convincing players to choose us over a better club. Extra money is generally the only lever weak clubs have.

 

[Soto]

Both Arrow and Welsh are 600K plus players now.

Arrow yes but Welch would be $400-$500k tops.
Jai Arrow would be the best forward acquisition. He is a beast and only going to get better. Great runner, excellent defender and has a massive motor.
In order of preference...Arrow, Welch, Ese'ese then George Burgess

 

[Happy MEel]

You do realize that there are always desperate clubs right?

Yes I do

 

[Enakeel]

Absolutely. If they were both evenly priced it wouldn’t even be a question. But in the age of salary caps you have to find value in your roster.

I also don’t think we should be relying solely on an untested Utoikamanu, which is why I think Welsh would be a decent pick up. Although he is now an “origin player”, I don’t think he’d cost as much as Arrow.

This would do nicely for next year (salaries are obviously estimates/guesses)

1. Gutho ($650k)
2. Fergo ($500k)
3. Blake ($500k)
4. Jennings ($400k)
5. Sivo ($200k)
6. Drown (upgrade to $500k)
7. Moses ($850k)
8. Paulo ($600k)
9. Mahoney ($300k)
10. Welsh ($500k)
11. Lane ($400k)
12. Mau ($400k)
13. Nrown ($600k)

14. Salmon ($300k)
15. Utoikamanu ($250k)
16. Niukore ($250k)
17. Gower ($200k)

18. Kaufusi ($200k)
19. Evans ($400k)
20. Tep ($200k)
21. Terepo ($200k)
22. Davies ($100k)
23. Davey ($100k)
24. Parry ($100k)
25. Stone ($150k)
26. Alvaro ($300k based on taking up option)
27. Hoffman ($200k)
28. French ($200k)
29. Schneider ($100k)
30. Smith ($150k)

This would come to $9.8 million, which would leave us about $400k spare.

If you think Mahoney, a 21 year old 80 minutes hooker leading the NRL tackle count is going to be on anything under 500k you’ve got rocks in your head.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

If you think Mahoney, a 21 year old 80 minutes hooker leading the NRL tackle count is going to be on anything under 500k you’ve got rocks in your head.

I can see how he might be on $500k, if he left us for the Dogs or the Titans, but it would be disappointing if we had to pay that much to retain a kid with less than 50 NRL games, and who isn't even a focal point of our attack. He might be worth it on a long contract - by the end of four years he'll almost certainly be worth $500k.

 

[TheRam]

Arrow yes but Welch would be $400-$500k tops.
Jai Arrow would be the best forward acquisition. He is a beast and only going to get better. Great runner, excellent defender and has a massive motor.
In order of preference...Arrow, Welch, Ese'ese then George Burgess

I agree with all your statements here, but the problem in regards to Welsh is he has been holding out for $600+ and now that he is an origin player and has a manager too would be even more determined to get that. If he has a big game he will probably get it too.

The reason we dropped off him a few months ago was his asking price. It's just that there are very few quality forwards around that you could pick up for less that he is still in the picture.

Even Burgess will bulk at a $350-400K figure. Watch how long he will ride it out if he can't get over $500-550K at least.

But yes you are right, on actual output, Welsh, and Ese'ese are worth around $400K. Burgess around $300-350K and only Arrow is worth around $600K, but you can guarantee that Arrow will be getting more then that if he were to leave the Titans.

 

[TheRam]

Yes I do

Good then the lower figures that you are stating probably won't happen then.

 

[Happy MEel]

Good then the lower figures that you are stating probably won't happen then.

Did you even read what I said? I agreed that Arrow might get close to that $600k mark from a desperate club (of which there are a few). However I disagreed that Welch will get that much, even from a desperate club.

 

[hindy111]

The difference between "solid" and "erratic" in a half at NRL level is really only down to how much risk they are prepared to deal with. Obviously skill comes into it more as more risk is taken on.

Cleary and Moses provide a classic example of that, Cleary is "solid" because his game is risk averse. Moses is "erratic" because he is a risk taker.

Moses will only become an elite half if and when he finds the balance between his level of skill, and the level of risk he takes. So he either hones his skills, or takes less risk. Or perhaps a combination of both.

Of the two though I know which one I'd prefer to watch, and it aint Cleary.

Scores are locked at 18 all and there is 5 to go and your in good field position.
Who would you prefer on the field?

Moses is great. But sometimes he throws a pass when it just is not on or puts in a woefull kick. I reckon that is the reason we end up in some games where we are dominated in opening 25mins and a lot of times can't recover.

The thing is he can fix it and when he does he can be the best half in the game. If he does fix it.

Cleary will just start to read a game better. He will learn when and how to choke the team. I doubt his ceiling is as high as Moses but unsure Moses will ever reach that ceiling. I reckon Cleary will slowly improve. He is 21yrs old.