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Rumours and Stuff

TheRam

Coach
Messages
13,480
To counter that Hindy I hope that Andrew Johns working with our spine will fix that problem. BA has evolved tho by going for bigger forwards who can ball play (which you, Ram and I have been advocating for years) but has he fixed our Achilles heal, defence?

I was just saying that yesterday to a mate. I am still worried that we have not improved in that area by much at all. We will see, but if that trial was any indication(I know it was just a trial) we still suck at defense and therefore can't put teams away that are plucky and who just hang in there till the game shifts in their favour like Souths on Friday night. We struggle to shut teams out that won't go away.

Sure we should have a good season this year baring injury, but will it be a great one? Our defense will be the key.
 

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
59,235
I was just saying that yesterday to a mate. I am still worried that we have not improved in that area by much at all. We will see, but if that trial was any indication(I know it was just a trial) we still suck at defense and therefore can't put teams away that are plucky and who just hang in there till the game shifts in their favour like Souths on Friday night. We struggle to shut teams out that won't go away.

Sure we should have a good season this year baring injury, but will it be a great one? Our defense will be the key.

You nailed it Ram.
 

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
59,235
@TheRam
I have been having trouble with my sweet potatoes. I've grown them exactly how you mentioned but they just aren't getting to the size we require. Any tips?

FB_IMG_1582439035081.jpg
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
85,094
I was just saying that yesterday to a mate. I am still worried that we have not improved in that area by much at all. We will see, but if that trial was any indication(I know it was just a trial) we still suck at defense and therefore can't put teams away that are plucky and who just hang in there till the game shifts in their favour like Souths on Friday night. We struggle to shut teams out that won't go away.
Doesn't this describe a problem with attack?
Sure we should have a good season this year baring injury, but will it be a great one? Our defense will be the key.
Agreed. But if the game is tight at the end there will always be the opportunity for either team to win it. If you were genuinely the better team and it was still close enough at the end for the opposition to score (every team concedes tries over 80 minutes, including in the final 5-10) then the problem was your attack.
 

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
56,227
Our forward pack is as good as any other team's, imo, in both attack, and defence.

Our biggest weakness lies in our inexperienced halves, imo - but Moses, Brown, Mahoney, and Gutherson have more than enough talent to compensate for it.

And recruiting players such as Campbell-Gillard (a Rep-level forward), and Matterson (a Rep-capable forward, who has already shown leadership qualities), will no doubt help us immensely.
 

Eelogical

Referee
Messages
22,557
Doesn't this describe a problem with attack?

Agreed. But if the game is tight at the end there will always be the opportunity for either team to win it. If you were genuinely the better team and it was still close enough at the end for the opposition to score (every team concedes tries over 80 minutes, including in the final 5-10) then the problem was your attack.
It could be mental. Probably grasping at straws, or reeds.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
85,094
Our forward pack is as good as any other team's, imo, in both attack, and defence.

Our biggest weakness lies in our inexperienced halves, imo - but Moses, Brown, Mahoney, and Gutherson have more than enough talent to compensate for it.

And recruiting players such as Campbell-Gillard (a Rep-level forward), and Matterson (a Rep-capable forward, who has already shown leadership qualities), will no doubt help us immensely.
This is the first year since Brian Smith left that I wouldn't be surprised if we were minor premiers. I also wouldn't be surprised if we finished eighth.

I would be very surprised if we missed the finals but I also thought that in 2018. I suppose the difference is in 2018 we brought in a negative influence to enhance the ones we already had. This year we seem to have strong leadership.
 

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
59,235
This is the first year since Brian Smith left that I wouldn't be surprised if we were minor premiers. I also wouldn't be surprised if we finished eighth.

I would be very surprised if we missed the finals but I also thought that in 2018.

If we aren't improved on last season which was very up and down and inconsistent. Most the good sides handled us quite easy. 2017 we where better and could compete with anyone.
2019 we never looked polished for most the season. BA must go if we dont give it a genuine shake
 

TheRam

Coach
Messages
13,480
Doesn't this describe a problem with attack?

No. Not in our case anyway. We generally don't have any problem scoring point. What we do have a problem with though is putting teams to the sword that show enthusiasm, even though we rack up points against them. Most teams still feel that Parra is a team waiting to implode. So they just keep coming till we oblige and let them back in, which to this date is still happening. Friday nights game was just another in a long list of games of teams hanging in till we let them take it from us.


Agreed. But if the game is tight at the end there will always be the opportunity for either team to win it. If you were genuinely the better team and it was still close enough at the end for the opposition to score (every team concedes tries over 80 minutes, including in the final 5-10) then the problem was your attack.

The modern day player is so well prepared and fit that if you get them focused and enthusiastic about defense and you have the right players that are capable in the squad, then attack ends up taking a back seat to it. Remember the RL field has not changed in size since day dot. So back then players were generally unfit amateur merkins just training once or twice a week, smoking a pack a day and sinking five to 20 schooners the night before a game. Today we have super athletes who live and breath conditioning and tactics. So since there is only so much room out there to throw that ball around something has to give and unfortunately attack can end up the casualty when teams get their defensive sh*t right.

So you are genuinely the best team if you can defend your way to victory. Not to many teams have won Premierships with average defense. Yes conceding point of course happens to the best of team. But you're a stats man Pou, don't the best defensive teams generally, by a big percentage I'm sure, play it out in the big one every year?

Now if you have a great attack and an equally great defense, then the chances are that you will win the big dance at the end of the year. Parra has a great attacking game and if we can equal it defensively then not to many team could stop us, not even the Roosters. We just haven't evolved enough in that part of our game from what I can see.

I like what Des Hasler has done for Manly in this regard. They all work very hard and together in defense. That is why they did as well as they did last year with a depth limited roster. Only major injuries ruined their season, especially at the back end of the season. They are my dark horse to make the GF this season if injuries are kind to them. Which is a big if considering how prone to injuries some of their players are.

Canberra's attack has always been great the last few seasons, so what changed last season? I'll tell you what, their defense in the halves in particular. Moving Jack Wighten to the halves was a massive bonus for them defensively in the halves, after having Blake Austin there the previous couple of season who was brilliant at times but very poor and so often isolated in defense by the attack. Also adding extra workers in defense and attack in the team overall completed a well balance team by Sticky.

I say this about Canberra after I predicted them to be spoon contenders last year. But to my defense I new nothing about Nicoll-Klokstad or John Bateman and who knew that Papalii could play a whole season in that type of form and basically be the form prop of the season? But if you look closely at the defensive patterns of the Raiders, you will see that Wighten is the difference and the key to their defensive success.

As the old saying goes, if you get your defense right the attack will follow. Or in other words, defense brings much confidence to at team that allows them to smash the other merkins.

From what I saw on Friday, we still don't dominate the ruck well and we get confused when the other team play at speed of of that and then throw numbers at us. We lose our heads a little and our defensive structures then start to break down. Then the opposition team see this and plays with its tail up even more. Once they score a try against the run of play so to speak it isn't to difficult for them to smell the panic in the air.

Now even if we come back at them and score again, it doesn't matter to much to the opposition because they know that we will give up the ruck as we normally do and we don't have the mental fortitude in defense to do anything about it. So they keep coming believing no matter how well we are playing in attack, we can and do give team air at the ruck and so they feel that they are always in with a chance. If we were to become ruthless defenders, then if we were to score the first try or two it would then break the spirit of most teams and if they are being hurt in the ruck and in general, then game over.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
85,094
Well I agree about Canberra. Wighton in the line meant they only had one weak side in defence where most teams have a weakness on both sides. And they went with a smaller, harder working pack which further enhanced their defence. But the trial on Friday is meaningless as far as how we will go this year or even how we went last year. We had a defensive line full of backups after the first 20 minutes. That made it a lottery and the result (five tries each) was irrelevant.
 

TheRam

Coach
Messages
13,480
Well I agree about Canberra. Wighton in the line meant they only had one weak side in defence where most teams have a weakness on both sides. And they went with a smaller, harder working pack which further enhanced their defence. But the trial on Friday is meaningless as far as how we will go this year or even how we went last year. We had a defensive line full of backups after the first 20 minutes. That made it a lottery and the result (five tries each) was irrelevant.

I agree, but it was a display in defense that was all to familiar as a Parra fan. But you are right, we can't take that game alone as a guide for much at all. But UNTIL I see a change in our defense, history is my only reference as to what we our most pressing issue is from previous seasons.
 
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