Vettori quits as Test captain

[African Monkey]

And you can abuse the batsmen all you like really and I definitely have in the past but the fact of the matter is we aren't going to win any test matches because our bowling attack is very rarely going to roll quality teams for under 350. If the batsman stepped up more often at least we'd get more draws I spose.

Yep our bowling is pissweak atm. Hopefully this is the end for Arnel. He's no more than a medium pacer who doesn't have the ability to do anything with the ball.

 

[Red Bear]

Not to mention the fact that excluding Bangladesh since he took over, we won 2 of 27 matches.

But, is that Vettori's fault or largely due to the fact that, bar Bond, your quicks have been mediocre at best.

Vettori's a bit over rated as a bowler, definately, but he also lacks any support from those around him. The quicks have been sh*thouse for some time, bar the occasional spell (Southee vs England, Martin vs India). Would be interesting how he'd gone having a consistantly good fast bowler or two up the other end.

Anyway, time to play him as an all rounder and search for decent bowlers?

Guptil
McCullem
Williamson
Taylor
Ryder
Vettori
Young/Hopkins/Whoever

is a pretty decent top 7, and frankly Franklin doesnt seem a great player, Vettori probably a better option.

Bowling seems very thin. Whats Bennett like when fit, at least had a bit of pace. Martins 36, Southee has a way to go.

 

[African Monkey]

But, is that Vettori's fault or largely due to the fact that, bar Bond, your quicks have been mediocre at best.

Mate, he's had chances to get us home in at least 3-4 test matches and failed in all of them. He gets talked up as a world-class player, acts as if he's bigger than NZ cricket, yet he never wins any test matches for us and the bowlers have done their fair share supporting Vettori in these games.

 

[KeepingTheFaith]

Our bowling stocks are horrid, no two ways about it. When our best bowlers can barely average under 35 you know we're in trouble.

Like what I saw from Southee against the paks. Didn't get the reward, but is starting to look more like a consistent bowlers.

Aside from that what have we got?

Wagner - Has to come in when eligible.

Wheeler/Milne - Young, raw, would rather they both had 2-3 seasons of first class cricket before being picked.

Astle - Probably won't get a chance with Vettori being the medium pacer of choice, but has started the domestic season very well and is only 24 so there's room for him to get better.

Boult - Like Wheeler/Milne he's still very young.

Bates - Left armer so a bit of variety there, can't see him doing any worse than Arnel.

4 bowlers with an average of around 30 I'd settle for. It's not like we're asking for a McGrath or Warne here.

 

[shiznit]

yeah... i wanna see some variation in our attack... a new express bowler and a new spinner. if we have to take a chance on a few kids than so be it. as long as we have good coaches in place to get them prepared.

i also reckon its about time we seriously consider the NZRL's stance and send some feelers out to the Australian Domestic scene... with our countries so close surely theres a few decent players out there in the aussie scene who have NZ heritage.

on the captain itself... id have to go with Taylor... he's by far our most consistent batsman... and by default that makes him the leader of the team. he seems to be starting to value his wicket more... and maybe test captaincy will bring that along further. John Wright also may help bring him along also.

hes got the talent to be anything in cricket... but to me watching him play is like watching a junkie trying to kick a crack addiction. he seems like hes always fighting an endless battle against himself not to relapse and play a stupid shot. hes got a natural flair about him that he has to constantly keep in check.

i would like to see the percentage of dismissals Taylor's had where hes got himself out.

 

[Iafeta]

Harsh on Taylor, 78 isn't bad and it's not like every time you are going to go on and score a big 100 and he pretty much anchored our 1st day batting effort while the top order fell around him. And then in the 2nd innings he scored at good clip which was required and got out late in the day when we would have had to declare overnight anyway.

Not harsh at all. Over the past few years there have been a number of pretty 30s-70s, but not enough grinding it out and converting into a match winning 100+. Ryder, Taylor, McCullum, Guptill.. a lot of blokes who regularly get starts but none of them go the whole hog often enough. His second innings was at a strike rate of 51. That's certainly not a good clip in modern test cricket. A good clip is 60+.

 

[Iafeta]

Mate, he's had chances to get us home in at least 3-4 test matches and failed in all of them. He gets talked up as a world-class player, acts as if he's bigger than NZ cricket, yet he never wins any test matches for us and the bowlers have done their fair share supporting Vettori in these games.

The best way to sum up Vettori, much like a lot of the New Zealanders, decent bat, decent bowler, but not a match winner. Crikey, even Matt Hart spun NZ to a test win in South Africa once :shock:

 

[African Monkey]

The best way to sum up Vettori, much like a lot of the New Zealanders, decent bat, decent bowler, but not a match winner. Crikey, even Matt Hart spun NZ to a test win in South Africa once :shock:

Lol John Bracewell and Paul Wiseman even managed to win us a couple of tests.

 

[Twizzle]

bring back Patel

 

[Iafeta]

Dipak?

 

[Twizzle]

yeh, you wanted a decent spinner

I remember he opened the bowling for NZ

 

[Patorick]

yeah... i wanna see some variation in our attack... a new express bowler and a new spinner. if we have to take a chance on a few kids than so be it. as long as we have good coaches in place to get them prepared.

i also reckon its about time we seriously consider the NZRL's stance and send some feelers out to the Australian Domestic scene... with our countries so close surely theres a few decent players out there in the aussie scene who have NZ heritage.

on the captain itself... id have to go with Taylor... he's by far our most consistent batsman... and by default that makes him the leader of the team. he seems to be starting to value his wicket more... and maybe test captaincy will bring that along further. John Wright also may help bring him along also.

hes got the talent to be anything in cricket... but to me watching him play is like watching a junkie trying to kick a crack addiction. he seems like hes always fighting an endless battle against himself not to relapse and play a stupid shot. hes got a natural flair about him that he has to constantly keep in check.

i would like to see the percentage of dismissals Taylor's had where hes got himself out.

Get a bunch of South Africans, worked for England.

 

[El Diablo]

Vettori?

never heard of him

 

[Fast Eddie]

Oh wow El Diablo trolling what a surprise.


I'd say Wagner will come into that pace attack for Arnel which will be a good change.

 

[shiznit]

Get a bunch of South Africans, worked for England.

lol... weve got a few up our sleeve... i know we were lining Johnathan Trott up to play for us when he was down here playing for Otago... ( http://www.birminghampost.net/midla.../kiwis-wooing-reluctant-trott-65233-16675725/ )

i just think there must be some solid FC cricketers in aussie with kiwi connections... maybe there not good enough for Australia... but they may be able to provide some good depth for NZ.

 

[shiznit]

an initiative from NZ Cricket id like to see... ask Ross to pull out of the IPL... have about 3 or 4 NZ winters playing county cricket instead... NZ Cricket can pay the difference between his county deal and his IPL contract...

i reckon he would benefit greatly by having a couple of years on the county scene... learning how to become a REAL pro.

 

[ANTiLAG]

It all comes down to Wagner making the transition. Southee will imporve but never live upto the initial media hype. At least the media has been hush hush with Wagner.

 

[KeepingTheFaith]

Don't get to see a lot of domestic NZ cricket, but what do those who do think of Kitchen as a potential test batsman? Around 26-27 so he's just coming towards his peak, averages 43 or so in first class, but what's most impressive to me is his record of two 50's and five 100's. Seems to go on once he's gotten himself in. The only problem being that he's more of a middle order batsman, but possibly a more mature option at 3 than Williamson?

What about the young keepers? I see Young as a temp more than a long term solution. Guys like De Boorder (sp?) and Austin-Smellie seem to be developing handy looking records.

I could live with Vettori being our all rounder, but not a pure spinner who can bat.

1. McCullum
2. Guptil
3. Kitchen
4. Taylor (c)
5. Ryder
6. Vettori
7. De Boorder/Austin-Smellie
8. Astle
9. Wagner
10. Southee
11. Boult

Keeping in mind my limited exposure to NZ domestic cricket other than what I read/see on youtube, is that team likely to be any more competitive than what we're currently dishing out?

I rate Williamson, but think he needs further development, especially at first class level. Franklin has been handy in one day games recently, but as a test batsman his shortcomings have been badly exposed.

Broom has etched out a nice first class record, but never seems to take that extra step up.

 

[TheParraboy]

Looking forward to seeing Vettori bamboozle the australians in two tests here next summer...

 

[TheParraboy]

Looking forward to seeing Vettori bamboozle the australians in two tests here next summer...