Warriors salary cap investigation

[nqboy]

Similar to the Dogs, the Warriors deals will have to be restructured and this will affect 07 as well, is that right?

I don't agree with a points penalty. They've played no games over the cap, they got away with 05 (as the Dogs did with 01).

A big fine and the restructure affecting their next couple of seasons is cool with me.

 

[El Diablo]

The difference being that the team has not copped the points deduction punishement yet.

why should they if they get the team under the cap?

The Warriors have fielded an illegal team as well. The fact that the season is now over means it should start from the next.

same thing can be said for the Dogs of 03

Therefore their points punishment runs into the season about to start. You can't do it on a season already finished. It needs to happen in the current season or the next one about to be played.

why does it?

if things are in order for 06 then it hardly seems fair to be punished points from previous years crimes.

There is no risk of being found out if they own up to it before the season starts knowing all they will receive is a fine and not be disadvantaged in any other way for the season.

if it's the same management that was responsible for the breach you can't just dob yourself in and expect nothing. that is entirely different.

it seems the current Warriors management played no part in the rort and only found out recently when they went through the books thoroughly.

 

[aids]

kick them out of the comp or move them to the central coast



bad news warriors though, i really hope it's all resolved,. without a competative handicap added to the for this season.

 

[Cammo]

why should they if they get the team under the cap?

Because I believe it sets a bad precedent if they don't give a points penalty

same thing can be said for the Dogs of 03

The Dogs had already received their points penalty and missed a finals series because of it.

why does it?

if things are in order for 06 then it hardly seems fair to be punished points from previous years crimes.

Do the crime and you do the time. It should not matter when the crime was commited.

if it's the same management that was responsible for the breach you can't just dob yourself in and expect nothing. that is entirely different.

it seems the current Warriors management played no part in the rort and only found out recently when they went through the books thoroughly.

We don't know that for sure. How long the current management knew about the problem is something we will probably never know. Wether they would have admitted it if there was no full audit happening also remains unknown.

 

[Raider Ultra]

Why? Until clubs realise that breaching the cap will have severe and lasting consequences, then it will continue to happen. Clubs should be banned for a year, although this will never happen as its as good as cutting them from the comp.

 

[Robster]

as a Warrior fan, I am not sure what the fair way to go abouot this? most people are pointing the finger at Mick Watson but I'm not to sure upon that? I personally think the salary cap should be increased as team's always have tons of money in the kitty, however imagine what it would do to the game in New Zealand if they were to lose points?? the Warriors are expected to struggle this year as it is, there should be an alternetive to this, such as a huge fine. I don't know, to be quite honest I don't know what the hell to think about this situation.

 

[Cammo]

as a Warrior fan, I am not sure what the fair way to go abouot this? most people are pointing the finger at Mick Watson but I'm not to sure upon that? I personally think the salary cap should be increased as team's always have tons of money in the kitty, however imagine what it would do to the game in New Zealand if they were to lose points?? the Warriors are expected to struggle this year as it is, there should be an alternetive to this, such as a huge fine. I don't know, to be quite honest I don't know what the hell to think about this situation.

I understand that a points loss would be tough on the game in NZ, but I also think that you have to take emotion out of the equation when making a judgement such as this.

You can't have rules for one and not the other just because of what it might do the area.

It must be tough being a Warriors supporter with this going on, I know how I felt in 02 and it isn't good at all.

 

[Raider Ultra]

Plenty of teams don't have 'money in the kitty' as you suggest.

 

[El Diablo]

Because I believe it sets a bad precedent if they don't give a points penalty

a precedent if you're busted during a season, not before.

The Dogs had already received their points penalty and missed a finals series because of it.

only in 02. Once they got that side under the cap they participated in the 03 finals.

Do the crime and you do the time. It should not matter when the crime was commited.

if you get the side under the cap then no crime has been committed

We don't know that for sure. How long the current management knew about the problem is something we will probably never know. Wether they would have admitted it if there was no full audit happening also remains unknown.

we know they didn't write up the contracts so therefore have done little wrong

 

[Cammo]

a precedent if you're busted during a season, not before.

I don't believe there should be a distinction according to the time you were caught.

only in 02. Once they got that side under the cap they participated in the 03 finals.

Because they had already served their punishment

if you get the side under the cap then no crime has been committed

The crime has already been commited over the last few seasons and no punishment has yet been served. Ensuring they are under the cap for this year is expected, not recompense for the crime.

we know they didn't write up the contracts so therefore have done little wrong

They currently represent the club so they have to deal with what they have got into wether it is their fault or not.

 

[El Diablo]

I don't believe there should be a distinction according to the time you were caught.

why?

if they start 06 under the cap then what is illegal about that side?

Because they had already served their punishment

but the side was still assembled illegaly. you even signed Ryan before the bust.

The crime has already been commited over the last few seasons and no punishment has yet been served. Ensuring they are under the cap for this year is expected, not recompense for the crime.

if they are fined then that is punishment for breaches in previous seasons. currently they have not breached the 06 cap.

They currently represent the club so they have to deal with what they have got into wether it is their fault or not.

but it makes it different than what happened in 02 and should be handled that way

 

[HevyDevy]

It would be extremely harsh to dock the current management of points give that they had nothing to do with it and were forthcoming with the info once they discovered a problem.

The Bulldogs scenario makes it difficult but they are not identical.

However, I expect that points will be taken off to avoid complaints from other clubs (namely the Dogs). Unfortunate.

 

[nqboy]

The crime has already been commited over the last few seasons and no punishment has yet been served.

What punishment did the Dogs cop for their breach in 01?

 

[Baron Vo Mandor]

The penalty in 02 was an accumulated result of both infractions.

 

[El Diablo]

The penalty in 02 was an accumulated result of both infractions.

but they were never punished for what they intended to do in 03 in 03.

the same rule should apply to the Warriors for 06.

 

[Cammo]

why?

if they start 06 under the cap then what is illegal about that side?

The side was assembled illegaly as you posted below. They have not received a points punsihment for illegaly assembling a side. I believe they should.

but the side was still assembled illegaly. you even signed Ryan before the bust.

Exactly my point as per above. They assembled a side illegaly and have not been disadvantaged in any competition yet. I believe they should be just as The Dogs were in 02 they should be in 06.

if they are fined then that is punishment for breaches in previous seasons. currently they have not breached the 06 cap.

Fines should only be part of the punishment and not the be all and end all. Fines are not a harsh enough deterrent as has been shown in the past.

but it makes it different than what happened in 02 and should be handled that way

A systematic rorting of the cap should be treated with loss of competiton points IMO, fines are just a natural occurance of any breach.



Either way, it looks like we will never agree on the subject. The NRL will hand down their punishment according to what is revealled over the next few weeks I suppose. I would be very surprised if they don't deduct any competition points, but they are ones making that call.

 

[Cammo]

What punishment did the Dogs cop for their breach in 01?

Their fines and loss of competition points was a result of all the breaches, not just the breach for that season.

 

[Baron Vo Mandor]

but they were never punished for what they intended to do in 03 in 03.

the same rule should apply to the Warriors for 06.

By god! Are you stupid?

Why would they punish them when a punishment has already been inflicted.

One hasnt for the warriors has it?

That is why they are being punished in 06.

Rules where broken punishment must be dealt out simple as that. If they where caught when they were doing they would have been punished then end of story, they werent so they are justly being punished now.

Wake up.

 

[JK]

2002- 37 points

2006 - 6 points.

Hmmm.

That noted, I still would not like the Warriors to be rubbed out in 06 like the dogs were in 02. 37 points was too harsh that year. Oh well, water under the bridge.

 

[El Diablo]

The side was assembled illegaly as you posted below. They have not received a points punsihment for illegaly assembling a side. I believe they should.

The punishment should be a fine. The Dogs were only deducted bulk points as they were discovered during the season.

Exactly my point as per above. They assembled a side illegaly and have not been disadvantaged in any competition yet. I believe they should be just as The Dogs were in 02 they should be in 06.

The dogs weren't disadvantaged in 03 with an illegaly assembled side.

Fines should only be part of the punishment and not the be all and end all. Fines are not a harsh enough deterrent as has been shown in the past.

and points shouldn't be taken off if your side is under the cap. See Dogs in 03.

A systematic rorting of the cap should be treated with loss of competiton points IMO, fines are just a natural occurance of any breach.

i can't see how you can take points off a side that isn't breaching the cap. see Dogs in 03.

Either way, it looks like we will never agree on the subject. The NRL will hand down their punishment according to what is revealled over the next few weeks I suppose. I would be very surprised if they don't deduct any competition points, but they are ones making that call.

I would be too, but in this case i wouldn't see it as right. if it was the same management then i would.