What IF - instead of the Broncos this happened?

[rwaite]

Originally Posted by Teddyboy

If they had merged both the N.S.W. and Queensland comps in the early 1980's who would of been in the comp and how many teams.

 

[rwaite]

Let's for argument's sake say that Qld allowed poker machines 10 years earlier than they did and the BRL could afford to be a part of a national comp. Rather than the Broncos entering the Sydney comp what alternatives could there have been?

 

[docbrown]

I've thought about this before to a fair degree. If this would have happened the ARL would have been in a stronger position than AFL. Whereas the AFL had the strongest comp do a hostile takeover of the other two strong states (like NSWRL...), a combined QRL/NSWRL would have keep the strongest clubs and ensure their positions, then set up expansions sides in other states.

So:
Perth
Adelaide
Melbourne
Canberra
Illawarra
Newcastle
Gold Coast
Sunshine Coast
Central Queensland
Townsville
Auckland
7 x Sydney sides
4 x Brisbane sides

 

[rwaite]

I've thought about this before to a fair degree. If this would have happened the ARL would have been in a stronger position than AFL. Whereas the AFL had the strongest comp do a hostile takeover of the other two strong states (like NSWRL...), a combined QRL/NSWRL would have keep the strongest clubs and ensure their positions, then set up expansions sides in other states.

So:
Perth
Adelaide
Melbourne
Canberra
Illawarra
Newcastle
Gold Coast
Sunshine Coast
Central Queensland
Townsville
Auckland
7 x Sydney sides
4 x Brisbane sides

Yeah, I think it would have been better to start a completely new national level competition that was above both the Sydney and Brisbane competitions instead of taking an existing Sydney suburban competition and expanding that to a national competition which means we are stuck with too many Sydney teams in the national competition.

Creating a new competition and seeking applications from existing clubs and new franchises would have been the way to go. If there wasn't such an imbalance between the Sydney and Brisbane sides due to Brisbane clubs not having the extra poker machine money they had down south it might have happened that way.

 

[rwaite]

Those number of Brisbane and Sydney clubs would have been about right and you could have had two divisions with a lower division comprising the remaining Sydney and Brisbane clubs. There could have been promotion and relegation between the two divisions similar to how it is in the UK with most clubs having a SL license for a limited period of time before reapplying.

 

[siv]

Yeah, I think it would have been better to start a completely new national level competition that was above both the Sydney and Brisbane competitions instead of taking an existing Sydney suburban competition and expanding that to a national competition which means we are stuck with too many Sydney teams in the national competition.

Creating a new competition and seeking applications from existing clubs and new franchises would have been the way to go. If there wasn't such an imbalance between the Sydney and Brisbane sides due to Brisbane clubs not having the extra poker machine money they had down south it might have happened that way.

Ah the original Super League proposal once again !

 

[siv]

The issue at the time in teh AMCO Cup was taht Brisbane could not compete financially at club level with Sydney

While in 1974 Brisbane comp was not far behind Sydney it did not take long for "Brisbane clubs" to fall away from the midweek comp - and to be replaced by a Brisbane Rep team

While the creation of Brisbane was probably right back in teh 1980's - today its not the way to grow the Brisbane market

It would be much better to grow up promoting existing teams - eg Ipswich Jets and Redcliffe Dolphins as the entities that repreent Brisbane West and Brisbane North

 

[XXXX Cap]

It would be much better to grow up promoting existing teams - eg Ipswich Jets and Redcliffe Dolphins as the entities that repreent Brisbane West and Brisbane North

Interesting concept - neither of them are part of Brisbane - and quite proud not to be part of it.

 

[The Engineers Room]

I've thought about this before to a fair degree. If this would have happened the ARL would have been in a stronger position than AFL. Whereas the AFL had the strongest comp do a hostile takeover of the other two strong states (like NSWRL...), a combined QRL/NSWRL would have keep the strongest clubs and ensure their positions, then set up expansions sides in other states.

So:
Perth
Adelaide
Melbourne
Canberra
Illawarra
Newcastle
Gold Coast
Sunshine Coast
Central Queensland
Townsville
Auckland
7 x Sydney sides
4 x Brisbane sides

So you think established clubs would have just rolled over? And only 11 clubs survive whilst they bring in 11 completely new clubs?

I just don't think that would have happened. What they should have done is keep all the 11 clubs (-Newtown) in Sydney add Newcastle, Illawarra and Canberra then add Gold Coast, Sunshine Coast and other Qld entities into the Brisbane comp and use those as two conferences then add other clubs like Melbourne etc to a third conference and have a top 8 with top two of each conference and next two as wildcards.

14 in Sydney
14 in Brisbane
6 in the other

Then gradually reduce the number of clubs in the first two conferences into a second tier or redistribute the conferences year by year adding more clubs from Vic-SA-WA-etc.

 

[docbrown]

So you think established clubs would have just rolled over?

Then gradually reduce the number of clubs in the first two conferences

You've just suggested that teams be reduced as well. Back in the early 90's, the ARL had spoken to several Sydney clubs about relocations to Adelaide and Melbourne. Their plan was to let clubs die off naturally over time and be replaced - before all the super league stuff. They were looking at a 14 team national competition - obviously though QLD would have been unrepresented.

The other alternative in the 70's and 80's would have been to have two conference - rename the NSWRL the ARL and rename QRL the NRL.

Then you could have added expansion teams to those comps both in their own state and from others. With 2 x 10-14 team comps, you could have had inter and intra league play.

The problem was though that NSWRL were focused on their own comp and QRL declined. No one was thinking of the bigger picture. If somebody in the 70's had the vision to combine the management structures - the game would be 10-20 years ahead of where it is today.

 

[The Engineers Room]

You've just suggested that teams be reduced as well. Back in the early 90's, the ARL had spoken to several Sydney clubs about relocations to Adelaide and Melbourne. Their plan was to let clubs die off naturally over time and be replaced - before all the super league stuff. They were looking at a 14 team national competition - obviously though QLD would have been unrepresented.

The other alternative in the 70's and 80's would have been to have two conference - rename the NSWRL the ARL and rename QRL the NRL.

Then you could have added expansion teams to those comps both in their own state and from others. With 2 x 10-14 team comps, you could have had inter and intra league play.

The problem was though that NSWRL were focused on their own comp and QRL declined. No one was thinking of the bigger picture. If somebody in the 70's had the vision to combine the management structures - the game would be 10-20 years ahead of where it is today.

What you were suggesting seemed like you were going to immediately dump teams not gradually reduce the number in the top grade. What I suggested was a tier system, all the clubs could remain as entities either in first grade as relocated teams or in the second tier playing for promotion with the relocated teams guaranteed first grade and bigger grants.

 

[Titanic]

It's all academic now, however, the mystifying nature of the expansion (perhaps this term should be re-positioning) of Rugby League in Australia and the South Pacific is dizzying.

Perhaps there is hope in an independent management structure but historically partisan interests have dominated the sport and it is my worry that the "three years out of the game" clause could just alienate any form of currency from the candidacy pool while attracting the old school back to the table.

 

[siv]

So you think established clubs would have just rolled over? And only 11 clubs survive whilst they bring in 11 completely new clubs?

I just don't think that would have happened. What they should have done is keep all the 11 clubs (-Newtown) in Sydney add Newcastle, Illawarra and Canberra then add Gold Coast, Sunshine Coast and other Qld entities into the Brisbane comp and use those as two conferences then add other clubs like Melbourne etc to a third conference and have a top 8 with top two of each conference and next two as wildcards.

14 in Sydney
14 in Brisbane
6 in the other

Then gradually reduce the number of clubs in the first two conferences into a second tier or redistribute the conferences year by year adding more clubs from Vic-SA-WA-etc.

If we could split RG from Qld Cup / NSW Cup

you have the basis for a quality Mid Week Knockout

NRL 16 clubs + 5 best NSW Cup / 5 best Qld Cup / 5 best NZ and Port Moresby

Where the teams selected is decided out of a hat for the first 3 rounds

 

[Southern Rooster]

Originally Posted by Teddyboy

If they had merged both the N.S.W. and Queensland comps in the early 1980's who would of been in the comp and how many teams.

If they did it in the early 80's and had an 16 team comp with Illawarra and Canberra in.

I'd have 8 from Sydney and 6 from Brisbane. Back in those days you would have kept.

Parramatta
Canterbury
Manly
Easts
Saints
Souths
Balmain
Penrith
Valleys
Souths
Wynnum Manly
Northern Suburbs
Eastern Suburbs
Redcliffe
Illawarra
Canberra

16 team comp.

 

[Titanic]

Brisbane Valleys, Norths and Souths weren't a show at that stage ... their commercial positions were woeful. The most logical amalgamation of the competitions would have divided Brisbane into 4 teams, geographically representing Brisbane's urban sprawl e.g. Reddy, Easts, one of the inner city clubs such as Brothers and someone westside like Wests (but not at Purtell). Slice and dice the Sydney-centric mob and add the emerging areas like WA, etc.

The time was ripe but the politics more ripe

 

[Jakemcc]

Very cool concept, Imagine the stadium Souths-Logan would have if they made it in. Expensive piece of real-estate they are sitting on.