What to do with Level 3 - Parramatta Leagues Club

[strider]

Pretty hard to raise your own funds as a footy club when the NRL get all revenue on merchandise. :crazy:

yeah thats f'ed

i think someone was talking about it at the meeting .... we should make a whole range of clothing that looks like supporter gear, smells like supporters gear, tastes like supporters gear, but isn't actually supporter gear! - no official logo on it .... the NRL don't own colours and patterns ffs .... sell it at the leagues club and via footy heaven

 

[Gronk]

yeah thats f'ed

i think someone was talking about it at the meeting .... we should make a whole range of clothing that looks like supporter gear, smells like supporters gear, tastes like supporters gear, but isn't actually supporter gear! - no official logo on it .... the NRL don't own colours and patterns ffs .... sell it at the leagues club and via footy heaven

You mean like the Roosters Street Wear ?

http://www.sydneyroosters.com.au/news.php?ArticleID=3683

 

[Suitman]

Pretty hard to raise your own funds as a footy club when the NRL get all revenue on merchandise. :crazy:

:?

Merchandise isn't the only source of funding.

Suity

 

[Gronk]

:?

Merchandise isn't the only source of funding.

Suity

No kidding.

 

[Suitman]

Pretty hard to raise your own funds as a footy club when the NRL get all revenue on merchandise. :crazy:

No kidding.

:?

Suity

 

[Delboy]

To repeat what happened to the funding, up to the iniquitous increase in poker machine turnover tax, the club used to produce profits of around $8 million, and the club basically spent all its grant on the NRL club (say $6 million), and to the junior league around $1 million and the rest in community grants.

The State Govt turnover tax then increased the tax to a point that the club now produces $1-$2 million in profit,the extra $6-6.5 miliion goes to the State Govt., who give nothing back to the community.

You have to remember it is a turnover tax and has nothing to do with profits, and it is devastrating for the clubs that used the grants to support sport and junior sport. There is not enough corporate or private support to replace it, the govt basically told porkies and the Clubs Accociation did little to tell what would happen.

In F\fact DF was one of the few that got on the front foot, I would say our club is well run, but have had little money over the last 3 years to make improvements to the club as all funds have gone to support the football side of it.

No matter which way you wash it up, the NSW govt are on their way to destroying the clubs which use the funds out into sport and the community.

DF and the Panters are trying to get the grants taken out of the tax grab, as is is part of why they were originally set up.

You can thank Bob Carr and Michael Egan for this, they removed themselves from office as these things (and others) began to bite, and it appears those that followed have continued the mess. Oh well, it was little to do with the smoking ban, other than that took away some hoped for increase in patronage, at least the profits from gambling went back into the community, I have little idea where it goes now , except probably wasted on beauracrats to get the current govt re-elected.

 

[bartman]

I would say our club is well run, but have had little money over the last 3 years to make improvements to the club as all funds have gone to support the football side of it.

Apart from Sterlo's balcony (for the smokers), and this Reno room (for the smoking pokie players)...

What's the average member (75% of the population are non-smokers, not all members want to watse their time and money on gaming machines) getting from the club these days... ? Not enough tpo justify $10 membership imo, lucky I and many others are perpetual members, or I probably wouldn't bother.

No matter which way you wash it up, the NSW govt are on their way to destroying the clubs which use the funds out into sport and the community.

More blame games rather than forward thinking... The tax and ban was advertised well before it was enforced, and it's been in a while now. Hopefully there are some people in the club industry spending their time getting on with business in this new climate, not engaging in an exercise in futility in attampting to wind back what (for the general population) are two very good and popular measures.

DF and the Panters are trying to get the grants taken out of the tax grab, as is is part of why they were originally set up.

Hopefully it's not Denis and the Panthers guy on their lonesome in this, it might actually be something achievable - are the NRL helping the efforts in that regard, or have they left the clubs out to dry?

 

[MarkInTheStands]

from memory i think we put in 2.5 million...

Yeah that would be 2.6 of the 6, with 500,000 going to the PDJRLFC to run the local competitions.

Which would mean we have had to cut NRL funding from 6 - 4 million over the last few years if my maths and memory is right.

So it comes back to making the Football side Pay for itself.

So how exactly do we do that.

I think the talk of additional members and the like is talking about chump change. I know every little bit helps but big problems first, work with the little stuff later.

So we most probably need to talk about 2 things, Getting Paid to play and then upping sponsorships to be around 4 million.

So firstly getting paid to play, it would be nice if the state government would pay us to play at Parramatta Stadium, kinda like the deal the put together with the West Tigers to go and Play at the SFS, but I don't think that would happen. That leaves us Playing at ANZ Stadium, which I am sure warms the cockles of Staggers Heart. The 2 deals for that stadium we have heard about is $2M a year plus extra if they get over a certain number of patrons. I am also informed that a club 2 years ago moved 1 game to Suncorp Stadium Vs the Cowboys and got a $1 million for doing it.

Next is raising more sponsorship. Something we have been quite poor at admittedly from all reports. So we need to go out and find a set of sponsors or put the squeeze on sponsors as per the following. All of these are minimums

Naming Rights : 1.25 Million.
Sleeve : $ 750,000
Back of Jersey: $500,000
Shorts (Separate Front and Back): $250,000

So there are the numbers and that brings us 3 Million and is an increase from the reported 2.45 Million for all sponsors in the SMH article in 2007.

The issue here is, we might price ourselves out of the market at these numbers, the Bulldogs are struggling to find a $1M sponsor they want. I know for a fact that naming rights on a top 8 team in 2003 was $300,000 so it is a lot for corporate Australia to swallow. A V8 Supercar naming rights is about 1 million just for comparison and their merch is littered with your logo, and not so much with your team logo (unless your HRT).

But there is another much simpler solution to all this.

Everyone goes and puts $50 in a pokie once a week or even fortnight.

 

[bartman]

well some are obviously not contributing as much to their NRL side and juniors than we are, we then need to look at our marketing, sponsorship and membership strategies to our NRL side which is something I and several others have been encouraging for a while.

if we fix that side of it than the leagues club becomes less an issue as we won't need fund the juniors and seniors as much as we have been.

I know... unfortunately it's been falling on deaf ears.

With the NRL responsibilities falling to an internal Board that is not directly elected, those deaf ears have been able to continue for some time now with no direct accountability.

Finally it seems the people have caught up to the system, and through much disbelief (and some conjecture over how those membership and marketing issues aren't relevent) seem to be making the people on that internal NRL board accounatble, through the only avenues they can - the FC and LC elections.

 

[MarkInTheStands]

Hopefully it's not Denis and the Panthers guy on their lonesome in this, it might actually be something achievable - are the NRL helping the efforts in that regard, or have they left the clubs out to dry?

They along with I think Michael Searle are on the Club Funding Subcommittee for the NRL that is working on this.

 

[bartman]

Everyone goes and puts $50 in a pokie once a week or even fortnight.

To be honest, I'd rather give up and follow a real community club like Newtown than give a cent to the gaming industry.

But if my club - through its policies of dissuading football fan/members from entering the premises on gameday (jersey rules and lack of pre-after match functions), and through it's sheer neglect of its facilities in relation to the needs of non-smokers and non-pokie feeders - is now offering no alternatives for fans to get involved other than gaming, and looking for ideas (but ignoring the fact the ideas were all things they used to actually do as a matter of course)... *shrugs*

 

[bartman]

They along with I think Michael Searle are on the Club Funding Subcommittee for the NRL that is working on this.

Cheers, hopefully they can get some actions and an answer sooner rather than later, so as not to hold any false hopes and prevent other methods/approaches to the funding issue if needed.

 

[Delboy]

Bart, as usual you make some rather slick comments, yet I fail to see where you suggest we can gain the revenue the club has lost from what was a legitimate and planned source.

I continue to point out that the club set itself up to fund through the leagues Club for probably 20 years , and yet the turnover tax was never discussed prior to its swift implementation, and the govt suugested it would have no impact.

While I acknowledge it is in place, there are plenty of posters who seem to think that it is a smokescreen for a poorly run organisation.

We have never met , and I hope you have more financial knowledge than myself, and even Ovo, but we need grand ideas and action. yet to see something from anyone where we can generate these funds quickly and easily, and yes I do believe the govt is greedy and incompetent.

Ok , there appear to be people prepared to condemn the club for a lack of foresight re revenue, use this forum and post all your big ideas and ways to generate this lost income. Over to you

 

[MarkInTheStands]

To be honest, I'd rather give up and follow a real community club like Newtown than give a cent to the gaming industry.

But if my club - through its policies of dissuading football fan/members from entering the premises on gameday (jersey rules and lack of pre-after match functions), and through it's sheer neglect of its facilities in relation to the needs of non-smokers and non-pokie feeders - is now offering no alternatives for fans to get involved other than gaming, and looking for ideas (but ignoring the fact the ideas were all things they used to actually do as a matter of course)... *shrugs*

Thats your call.

BTW you might have been away, but the Jersey Rule was lifted 2 years ago, your now aloud into the club with a Jersey on, on Game Day. Last year, I think we only had 1 Sunday afternoon home game at home, and we got a Post Match Function, will be interesting to see how that goes.

I am sure there are other alternatives, I am just talking about the quickest and most direct way of fixing the issue. Your not a fan of gaming, thats cool. My parents and grand parents used to work a cleaners at Souths Juniors, there were pokies then that had the name of a first grade player on a plaque across the top of them, meaning the profit from that machine, went to that player.

 

[bartman]

Bart, as usual you make some rather slick comments, yet I fail to see where you suggest we can gain the revenue the club has lost from what was a legitimate and planned source.

Del, if I was employed full-time by the club, or as someone who advises the club industry, then I might be able to help you out. Over to you.

I continue to point out that the club set itself up to fund through the leagues Club for probably 20 years , and yet the turnover tax was never discussed prior to its swift implementation, and the govt suugested it would have no impact.

to be honest, I don't know why you continue to point that out? Must just be venting, because it doesn't address in anyway solutions to the situation the club seems to find itself in.

While I acknowledge it is in place, there are plenty of posters who seem to think that it is a smokescreen for a poorly run organisation.

Another way of looking at it is that the continual references to the tax and ban eminating from the club administration, representatives and advisors may have simply alerted posters to look a bit deeper from their own perspectives at how the club's core business seems to have changed tack in the last 5-10 years.

We have never met , and I hope you have more financial knowledge than myself, and even Ovo

I'm simply a peasant boy who makes posts on an internet forum Del, I have never claimed greater financial knowledge than yourself (who I have never met) nor Ovo (who I have). But whether one has that financial knowledge or not shouldn't preclude them from having an opinion on the direction of a club they are a member of, and expressing in for discussion with others on an internet board.

but we need grand ideas and action. yet to see something from anyone where we can generate these funds quickly and easily, and yes I do believe the govt is greedy and incompetent.

I really couldn't care less what peopel think of any government, it's pretty irrelevent to going forward from the current situation we're in. This thread is about ideas for the 3rd floor, and there have been lots of them - ones that could generate greater income, bring the people that Ovo speaks about back to the club.

No-one's claiming it' s $6mil worth, but it's a start in the right direction - financially and for want of a better word... spiritually.

Ok , there appear to be people prepared to condemn the club for a lack of foresight re revenue, use this forum and post all your big ideas and ways to generate this lost income. Over to you

We have been. Just look through the previous pages. And as has been said, we are just the peasants, who post casually on a forum - not the professionals in the club's fulltime employ, those they engage for professional advice, nor those elected in charge of its direction. I think what a lot of people are saying here is really... over to them? Inform us, convince us, make changes to bring us back to what was once (not too long ago) a real club (not just a casino).

Rant over for today :lol: It's just an opinion Del.

 

[bartman]

If things don't change direction this year, then it might be a call I make... Games within walking distance from where I live, they care enough about non-pokies support to have a stall in the main street (where all the shops are) on every weekend (even through teh off season), and it wouldn't involve cheering against the team fro,m the place I grew up. Simple but effective - that's the rugby league I grew up to love in the first place.

BTW you might have been away, but the Jersey Rule was lifted 2 years ago, your now aloud into the club with a Jersey on, on Game Day. Last year, I think we only had 1 Sunday afternoon home game at home, and we got a Post Match Function, will be interesting to see how that goes.

Yep, I realised the jersey rule was eventually overturned following some complaint. Same as the banner saying don't approach players for signatures was overturned following some complaint.

But there has been no moves to re-instagate pre-match mealtimes (Sunday Champagne Brunch, maybe Saturday arvo Lunch) in Cafe 88 to my knowledge. And at the sole After match last year function we were promised a second one that season, which never eventuated and no explanation given. Despiet the overtures, members still often feel like a number, and a sometime unwelcome one at that in relation to the clubs facilities.

I am sure there are other alternatives, I am just talking about the quickest and most direct way of fixing the issue. Your not a fan of gaming, thats cool. My parents and grand parents used to work a cleaners at Souths Juniors, there were pokies then that had the name of a first grade player on a plaque across the top of them, meaning the profit from that machine, went to that player.

Sure, I was more making a general point in response. Pokies clearly bring in revenue for a club, but clearly not enough revenue for our club. They are not the golden solution some in the club industry believed (and still seem to believe?) they would be.

Apparently we came up with some 20 year plan on the back of pokies, which was not flexible enough to adjust the minute that laws (which had originally changed to make pokies flavour of the month) unsurprisingly (to most) changed again within that timeframe. We have clearly over-committed or over-extended ourselves, and people will blame th echange in law, rather than look beyond that at what could have been done, or having had a solid plan B.

That's it... I'm off to the club now ;-)

 

[Delboy]

Bart, the point that I am trying to make is to get some understanding of the depth of the financial problem that most clubs face, and the reason that they do.

It is easy to sit on judgement re the clubs direction, yet i believe they were put in an almost unwinnable position, and little has ever been acknowledged , particularly on this board.

I am nothing to with the club, but I am a keen supporter with some idea of what goes on.

Your comment re Newtwon , has a hint of double standards, as they receive their funding via Souths juniors and their gambling revenue, who not having an NRL club to fund send the money into the junior clubs, Parramatta do both.

By the way ,I rarely use the machines, and I dont drink or smoke, but each to their own, if people want to gamble then I am happy for their funds to be used for the community.

My family coninue to play football in the district and benefit from the Leagues Club, I just don't like the fact that this funding cpiuld be taken from the community.

Perhaps we will meet at some stage, and there will be no hard feelings, we just come at things from a different angle.

 

[fish eel]

To be honest, I'd rather give up and follow a real community club like Newtown than give a cent to the gaming industry.

But if my club - through its policies of dissuading football fan/members from entering the premises on gameday (jersey rules and lack of pre-after match functions), and through it's sheer neglect of its facilities in relation to the needs of non-smokers and non-pokie feeders - is now offering no alternatives for fans to get involved other than gaming, and looking for ideas (but ignoring the fact the ideas were all things they used to actually do as a matter of course)... *shrugs*

You have been contributing to the gaming industry either directly or indirectly for as long as you've been a leagues club member......

 

[Stagger eel]

hey bart just letting you know that Newtown is sponsored and funded by Petersham RSL...

just thought you'd like to know...;-)

 

[mickdo]

But there is another much simpler solution to all this.

Everyone goes and puts $50 in a pokie once a week or even fortnight.

I really hope that wasn't a serious comment Mark. It appalls me that a club such as ours has felt the need to go down the pokie road and alienate most of its football members, just to try to survive.