What was the reason...

[bobmar28]

Considering there are plenty of AFL and Soccer fields in all districts in Sydney, it's safe to assume that AFL and Soccer has "eaten into" our working class fan base.

Participation of youth in a sport is also a clear indicator of how the future of that sport is fairing, but that's another argument.

Soccer is big in this area (always has been due to the ethnic make up of the population) but not AFL. Also soccer and rugby league can be played on the same fields. League is the game most kids follow around here. That may not be the case for inner city/north shore areas.

 

[Perth Red]

I think most people agree there is a need for probably 4 or 5 new teams over the next 20+ years. How we get them will be very interesting, relocation, replacement or addition???

 

[adamkungl]

I think most people agree there is a need for probably 4 or 5 new teams over the next 20+ years. How we get them will be very interesting, relocation, replacement or addition???

A new team every 5 years, or 2 every 10, seems a feasible method of expansion, obviously without actually knowing player numbers and such. None of this 4 teams at once ala 1995, too many too quick as we've seen. I think it should be done purely by addition, we don't want any more situations like Norths, Souths, or Reds. If the game doesn't have the player numbers to support a brand new team, without a Sydney team folding, then it should stay how it is and focus on junior development for a few more years instead.

 

[aids]

the biggest problem now, which didn't seem like so much on an issue during the 90's was talent
i think with English SL poaching a lot of good talents players it does through doubt over expansion on a larger scale.

 

[Dragonwest]

When I look at a Reds jersey I think "what could have been".

When i look at a red's jersey i now think of what CAN be! ....... that's if the nrl get off there ass n make a clear plan for the future of the game.

 

[Babyface O'reilly]

I believe there is to many teams in Sydney at this current point. The Roosters should move to the Central Coast.
There is no real reason for them to stay in Sydney these days. They have little support in their local area, no junior comp. They don't even have the Eastern Suburbs name no more.
Most of their supporters have moved out of Sydney due to expensive living. They have lots of fans who live in the Central Coast.
Central Coast has a large following and a large junior base, it would be a perfect fit for them. The true fans would watch them play there.

Central Coast Roosters is a must.

The ARU and the Swans would love Easts to relocate. That goes for your club too. This alone is a good enough reason to keep both clubs where they are not to mention the 100 year rivalry.

 

[The Mighty Panther]

I spoke to an official at Parramatta a few years ago, and he mentioned that a merge between Penrith and Parra back then was so close to fruition it's not funny.

From what he told me, Parra officials gave it the green light, as did Penrith officials, but was aborted by the officials at Penrith at the last minute for reasons unknown.

I heard that they were considering the name Penrith-Parramatta Panthers but that's just what I heard.

Being a Panthers fan, I'm glad it didn't transpire (and I really don't mind Parra as well), but what a heck of a team that would have been if it did happen

Alexander, Hindmarsh, Vella, Girdler, Carter, Cayless, Jason Smith, Gower, Dymock, Matt Adamson..............

 

[STSAE]

I believe there is to many teams in Sydney at this current point. The Roosters should move to the Central Coast.
There is no real reason for them to stay in Sydney these days. They have little support in their local area, no junior comp. They don't even have the Eastern Suburbs name no more.
Most of their supporters have moved out of Sydney due to expensive living. They have lots of fans who live in the Central Coast.
Central Coast has a large following and a large junior base, it would be a perfect fit for them. The true fans would watch them play there.

Central Coast Roosters is a must.

You beat us in crowds, 1 time in what, the last 20yrs????:crazy:

Now WE should relocate????:crazy:

Sonicboomboyyyyyyyy.:crazy:

:lol: :lol:

 

[Bring it home Knights]

I disagree East Coast Tiger, we too easily believe the BS we were told by people who had a hidden agenda. No other options were explored. If any were what were they? Did the league ever step into help knowing full well that within 10 years the money would be back in the game? So if the NRL had the sport as it's No.1 priority I do strngly believe they would have survived, but we know where the money and priorities lay. It's was basically like offering redundancies and cuting back as most corporations do to save money.



Wests Tigers were a basket case until Sheens got there and brought credibility to the club. With professional management and the incoming leagues club development there is NO reason why Balmain couldn't stand alone.
Regarding crowds, Wests Tigers in their first 5 years drew an average off:

2004 - 13,925
2003 - 8,993
2002 - 10,478
2001 - 9,294
2000 - 12,124

Hardly sensational, considering they had two clubs to draw from.

Last season they averaged 16,766 losing 2500 per match on previous year. Also they have the advantage of the Telstra Stadium which has way better facilities than Leichhardt Oval. I would imagine also that it would be more accesible to their support in the Western Suburbs assuming like Souths they have a large following in this area. I think most clubs have benefitted from Telstra's use crowd wise.

So Wests Tigers averaged 16,766 last year. Compare this to Balmain and Wests combined averages in their last two years:

1999 - 19,053 teams finished 15th and 17th
1998 - 17,877 teams finished 13th and 20th

Remembering the game today is structured to even out all clubs, thus more games are expected to be contests as opposed to past years.

So the WT haven't grown it at all, even after winning a premiership and making finals.



Of course they would, why did Wests Tigers? They were a joke of a club, remember Hoppa? It all comes down to Tim Sheens giving them the credibility they needed, Balmain could easily have signed Sheens (he was lookin fora job afterall), the players would have followed they could easily have played games at Leichhardt and Telstra and they could have nurtured their huge fan base. Remember clubs are only starting to get off their arses now. Balmain have as much potenetial as Souths.

The game is poorer for them not being there, the same with Illawarra and Norths. How's league going on the North Shore? An area that once drew an average of 15,116 per game with no club now so they follow union and AFL, now that really is great for RL?

I agree with a lot of what you said about the wests tigers being nothing special in their early days.

With players like hoppa, field, mcguiness etc, they were a team of thugs and poor role models.

 

[Bring it home Knights]

A new team every 5 years, or 2 every 10, seems a feasible method of expansion, obviously without actually knowing player numbers and such. None of this 4 teams at once ala 1995, too many too quick as we've seen. I think it should be done purely by addition, we don't want any more situations like Norths, Souths, or Reds. If the game doesn't have the player numbers to support a brand new team, without a Sydney team folding, then it should stay how it is and focus on junior development for a few more years instead.

It wasn't the 4 teams at once that were the problem, it was the fact that the super league war started during round 4 of their 1st season.

 

[Perth Red]

Re enough quality players, with the model we are running with in WA I can see within 10 years a large % of the Reds players being developed from WA. A Wellington team would presumably draw its players from NZ. Hopefully Victoria will see some its own players coming through in years to come and if we get a decent TV deal/better income generation by clubs and up the salary cap then we will see alot less players heading to SL/RU and will have plenty of talent without diluting the comp. You could probably make two competitive NRL teams from the players in SL alone.

 

[mightybears]

bring back the [CC] bears!

 

[Stagger eel]

Re enough quality players, with the model we are running with in WA I can see within 10 years a large % of the Reds players being developed from WA. A Wellington team would presumably draw its players from NZ. Hopefully Victoria will see some its own players coming through in years to come and if we get a decent TV deal/better income generation by clubs and up the salary cap then we will see alot less players heading to SL/RU and will have plenty of talent without diluting the comp. You could probably make two competitive NRL teams from the players in SL alone.

I wouldn't imagine that the NRL and or News Limited are prepared to invest 10 years to find out if your theory is true.

 

[Everlovin' Antichrist]

I agree with a lot of what you said about the wests tigers being nothing special in their early days.

With players like hoppa, field, mcguiness etc, they were a team of thugs and poor role models.

Poor choice there.

Kevin McGuiness is light years ahead of Hoppa and Craig Field. McGuiness cleaned up his act and didn't re-offend, he made a blue and sorted himself out, something the other two seemed unable to do at any time.

Budda doesn't deserve to be mentioned with the other two nongs.

 

[The Survivor]

but the decreasing population of the Eastern Suburbs

What decreasing population? There are more people living there now than there was 20 years ago.

 

[Gee_Up]

Soccer is big in this area (always has been due to the ethnic make up of the population) but not AFL. Also soccer and rugby league can be played on the same fields. League is the game most kids follow around here. That may not be the case for inner city/north shore areas.

If you live locally you'd know of course. A family member has a house in Ingleburn across the road from a Softball/Baseball field, an AFL ground and a Rugby League ground... they seem to play everything out there.

 

[The Survivor]

I believe there is to many teams in Sydney at this current point. The Roosters should move to the Central Coast.
There is no real reason for them to stay in Sydney these days. They have little support in their local area, no junior comp. They don't even have the Eastern Suburbs name no more.
Most of their supporters have moved out of Sydney due to expensive living. They have lots of fans who live in the Central Coast.
Central Coast has a large following and a large junior base, it would be a perfect fit for them. The true fans would watch them play there.

Central Coast Roosters is a must.

The Roosters are the only NRL team who's home ground is in the Eastern Suburbs. Soufs should relocate, hell they shouldn't have even been allowed back in.

 

[Gee_Up]

The Roosters are the only NRL team who's home ground is in the Eastern Suburbs. Soufs should relocate, hell they shouldn't have even been allowed back in.

I don't want anyone to re-locate except North Sydney to have a joint North Sydney- Central Coast team. North Coast Bears. It wouldn't be hard for the NRL considering their is already massive juniors there, a modern ground to play at (alternated with North Sydney Oval).

 

[Everlovin' Antichrist]

If you live locally you'd know of course. A family member has a house in Ingleburn across the road from a Softball/Baseball field, an AFL ground and a Rugby League ground... they seem to play everything out there.

AFL is almost dead in the South West. Bobmar is spot on.

I live locally and I know that area pretty well. There are very few AFL fields in the area and very few games played on them. The one you're talking about is the main AFL ground in the area and it's barely used, as far as I've seen it's only for the local team in the Sydney AFL comp and the crowds are less than you'd get at a Minto Cobras A Grade match.

There's an AFL field at Minto where they whack the posts up every year for no reason. I haven't seen a game being played there for 15 years.

I drive regularly past both grounds and even in Winter there's rarley a game on at either.

It was a decent AFL area before the Magpies moved out there. But no more and it hasn't been for a long time.

 

[Gee_Up]

AFL is almost dead in the South West. Bobmar is spot on.

I live locally and I know that area pretty well. There are very few AFL fields in the area and very few games played on them. The one you're talking about is the main AFL ground in the area and it's barely used, as far as I've seen it's only for the local team in the Sydney AFL comp and the crowds are less than you'd get at a Minto Cobras A Grade match.

There's an AFL field at Minto where they whack the posts up every year for no reason. I haven't seen a game being played there for 15 years.

I drive regularly past both grounds and even in Winter there's rarley a game on at either.

It was a decent AFL area before the Magpies moved out there. But no more and it hasn't been for a long time.

I go to the gym next to the AFL ground there spasmodically when visiting family. I have not seen a single game played there though assumed it was well used.

Very happy to hear League reigns supreme there.