Who do you think will surprise us in 2012?

[AuDragon]

I suppose the official Rugby League website was too.

Compare Lockyer 2006 to 2008-2011 and then get back to me. Honestly in 2006, Lockyer was easily the best long distance kicker in the game and he had this knack for pulling off those awesome kicks that just pull up short of the dead ball line. His drop kicks were also fantastic and it still s**ts me when people accredit Campese for these 50m+ drop punts when Lockyer was doing it consistently while Campese was a nuffie in reserve grade.

By the by, what's your source for the first stat.? It's not that I'm skeptical, just interested.

nrlstats.com

But wait a minute, did Lockyer 2006 play last season? I'm arguing the fact that just because the Broncos didn't find grass as often as the rest of the NRL on long kicks, doesn't make Locky a crappy kicker, and certainly doesn't mean he didn't dominate most games with his kicking.

Whether he was as good as in 2006 is debatable, but he certainly came close and 2011 was definitely his best since 2006. He was very good again last season, and I don't need to look at stats to see that. Certainly not stats that tell me that he didn't find grass as often as the other NRL teams.

Btw, who was the best team and what was their percentage?

 

[user_nat]

Lockyer's kick was still pretty awesome post 2007 in most Origins. So it's not like he couldn't kick just as well after the knee.

As for last year. Stats say we were the best kick chasers, which helps counter those ineffective kicks.

 

[Big Pete]

Do you have access to overall stats.?

And the argument was NEVER Lockyer is a crappy kicker nor that he never dominated teams with his kicking game. He did, but with his short distance kicking game. When it came to long distance kicking, as stats. shown he wasn't as good as he was in 2006.

I never said he didn't have a good season last year, again, that's just you distorting my post. I will say though, there were times where he was a bit off the pace and made uncanny mistakes.

user - How is that stat. measured? Also can I get a source? I don't doubt it either, our kick chase is very reasonable and it's usually a department I don't pay much attention to when I'm watching other teams.

At the end of the day though, it's one area we can improve in, judging on what I saw from Norman, I believe he can do a better job than post-op Lockyer in THAT department.

EDIT: The best teams were: St. George Illawarra, Warriors, Manly, South Sydney, Penrith & Newcastle.

 

[user_nat]

I don't know how they measure it, but my source is..
From August..

Most Good Chases

The hidden gem in the Storm line-up is Gareth Widdop. There are many reasons he is playing great football and leading this kick-chase category is one of them. He’s not over the line though as Brisbane pair Peter Wallace and Jack Reed are just one behind. Stormers and Broncos make up the entire top five… memo other teams: get your kick chase right!

Gareth Widdop (Storm) – 52
Peter Wallace (Broncos) – 51
Jack Reed (Broncos) – 50
Billy Slater (Storm) – 41
Jharal Yow Yeh (Broncos) – 40

And from the Tigers season review

Where They Struggled: For all their good work with the ball in hand, the Tigers let themselves down in the detail at times – none more so than their kick-chase. In fact, their 254 ‘good’ chases were the second fewest tallied in the NRL, ahead of only Canterbury, and easily the worst of any of the top-eight sides. By comparison, Brisbane produced 142 more ‘good’ chases in 2011 with 396,while Melbourne weren’t far behind with 389. Not surprisingly, the Tigers also produced 46 poor chases – a statistic only exceeded by lowly Parramatta.

I remember seeing something else that said a Broncos player ended up topping that stat, but can't find it.

 

[Big Pete]

I'd be very interested to see their interpretation of what a 'good chase' is but cheers for the source nat!

 

[AuDragon]

Do you have access to overall stats.?

And the argument was NEVER Lockyer is a crappy kicker nor that he never dominated teams with his kicking game. He did, but with his short distance kicking game. When it came to long distance kicking, as stats. shown he wasn't as good as he was in 2006.

I never said he didn't have a good season last year, again, that's just you distorting my post. I will say though, there were times where he was a bit off the pace and made uncanny mistakes.

user - How is that stat. measured? Also can I get a source? I don't doubt it either, our kick chase is very reasonable and it's usually a department I don't pay much attention to when I'm watching other teams.

At the end of the day though, it's one area we can improve in, judging on what I saw from Norman, I believe he can do a better job than post-op Lockyer in THAT department.

EDIT: The best teams were: St. George Illawarra, Warriors, Manly, South Sydney, Penrith & Newcastle.

And what were their percentages?

Please don't argue semantics. The point here is that according to stats, Brisbane was the second worst team in the comp when it came to long kicks last season. You threw the Lockyer from 2006 in, not me.
Lockyer was also much faster in 2001 than 2011 captain obvious...

The stats only mention whether the kicks hit grass, they don't mention whether they were well positioned (ie a corner of the field close to the try line) to allow the chasers to pin the opposition deep into their own territory. Long range kicking is not about finding grass, it's about gaining territory. If the kick is well placed and the kicker finds grass as well, then it's even better, but the most important part is to allow the opposition as little room as possible to return the ball successfully and at the same time, give your chasers the best chances to pin them down as deep as possible.

From memory, most of Locky's kicks hung fairly long in the air to allow our chasers to practically be on top of the receiver by the time the ball came down, and generally kicked to one of the corners of the field.

I agree that the Broncos were one of the best chasing teams last season, and I doubt that would be possible without a good kicking game, short AND long!
Very curious as well about the criteria for that stat though...

 

[Big Pete]

The point here is that according to stats, Brisbane was the second worst team in the comp when it came to long kicks last season.

Yes....

You threw the Lockyer from 2006 in, not me.
Lockyer was also much faster in 2001 than 2011 captain obvious...

And that was my point from my initial post. He didn't have the kicking power he used to. Yes, he was known for it but it had withered in the past few years.

The stats only mention whether the kicks hit grass, they don't mention whether they were well positioned (ie a corner of the field close to the try line) to allow the chasers to pin the opposition deep into their own territory. Long range kicking is not about finding grass, it's about gaining territory. If the kick is well placed and the kicker finds grass as well, then it's even better, but the most important part is to allow the opposition as little room as possible to return the ball successfully and at the same time, give your chasers the best chances to pin them down as deep as possible.

Yes, they're probably not as accurate as one would hope but I believe they give a fair indication and they're the closest thing you're going to get in determining long distance quality - at least without compiling a mass youtube video but honestly who has the time? At least for accuracy as the ultimate goal of a long distance kick is trying to gain as much territory as you can so if you can subtract the amount of time the receiver has of getting the ball, the better. Hence you aim for open turf.

From memory, most of Locky's kicks hung fairly long in the air to allow our chasers to practically be on top of the receiver by the time the ball came down, and generally kicked to one of the corners of the field.

Well our memories obviously differ.

I agree that the Broncos were one of the best chasing teams last season, and I doubt that would be possible without a good kicking game, short AND long!

Depends how the stat. is measured.

They have Wallace down as one of the highest good kick chasers in the game. I'd imagine the majority are off his own kicks and most of those don't gain the territory they should.

Don't think there's anything more to be said.