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Why are many Aussies so narrow minded ?

Messages
15,659
No they don't .
Gc & NQ folded.
& as you are well aware the RL teams in Ad & Perth were a casualty of a SL war compromise.
 

strong_latte

Juniors
Messages
1,665
I think people predicting soccer will dominate the country are deluding themselves frankly. Junior numbers mean nothing longer term - I and most off mates played it as little kids and none of us watch us now. Moreover, cricket just passed soccer as the most played sport in the country anyway and has more TV dollars to its name by a long shot. This is something a lot of people don't properly appreciate; soccer doesn't even compete with our main football codes, it competes with Cricket, and cricket is actually growing at a faster rate than soccer right now, with the big bash getting better ratings and attendances after a mere 3 years.

And therein lies the rub; is soccer the biggest sport in the world? Sure. But what is different about the countries where soccer is number 1? As a rule, in almost all cases it has no competition from other major pro sports that have been established longer and more widely than it. Australia has that and then some, so to assume a non contact sport that has more draws and frankly less action than any other form of football is going to take over simply because it's been successful in uncompetitive markets is simply delusional and irrational.
 

Twizzle

Administrator
Staff member
Messages
153,039
No they don't .
Gc & NQ folded.
& as you are well aware the RL teams in Ad & Perth were a casualty of a SL war compromise.

Are you trying to say there are no FNQ and GC teams in the NRL ?

Bottom line is the market is there as they are still going strong, unlike Adelaide and Perth which never recovered and that was my point.
 
Messages
15,659
Are you trying to say there are no FNQ and GC teams in the NRL ?

Bottom line is the market is there as they are still going strong, unlike Adelaide and Perth which never recovered and that was my point.

No you read Haffas post wrong .

You mentioned RL teams folding .
He replied with

Isn't that the same as saying "Didn't Nth QLD and Gold Coast used to have A-League teams?".


He was talking AL teams .

Edit ,I just saw he had edited it .
 
Messages
15,659
I think people predicting soccer will dominate the country are deluding themselves frankly. Junior numbers mean nothing longer term - I and most off mates played it as little kids and none of us watch us now. Moreover, cricket just passed soccer as the most played sport in the country anyway and has more TV dollars to its name by a long shot. This is something a lot of people don't properly appreciate; soccer doesn't even compete with our main football codes, it competes with Cricket, and cricket is actually growing at a faster rate than soccer right now, with the big bash getting better ratings and attendances after a mere 3 years.

And therein lies the rub; is soccer the biggest sport in the world? Sure. But what is different about the countries where soccer is number 1? As a rule, in almost all cases it has no competition from other major pro sports that have been established longer and more widely than it. Australia has that and then some, so to assume a non contact sport that has more draws and frankly less action than any other form of football is going to take over simply because it's been successful in uncompetitive markets is simply delusional and irrational.

To add to that. The logic of some fans is flawed .
They talk growth. Etc .
Which is fine ,it is growing
But do they think other sports are not growing ,at the same time .

Bizarre logic.
 

strong_latte

Juniors
Messages
1,665
To add to that. The logic of some fans is flawed .
They talk growth. Etc .
Which is fine ,it is growing
But do they think other sports are not growing ,at the same time .

Bizarre logic.

Precisely. Rugby League recently signed by far its biggest ever deal and its juniors numbers are growing at a faster rate than ever. Meanwhile the game has had 4 of the top 5 TV events of the year.

So yeah, talk about growth of you like, but remember that your not on a track with stationary opposition.
 

Twizzle

Administrator
Staff member
Messages
153,039
Yes & I was reading what I seen posted .
But that still doesn't change the fact that yes 2 RL teams folded as you said .
But 2 AL teams have also folded ,& more recently than the RL teams .

Teams can fold from bad management and other reasons, like I said the market is there so GC team is back again.

I dont see the A League growing much more if at all although they do talk about expansion.

Same with League, I dont think there is a big enough market in Adelaide and Perth and the travel costs and time difference are a big disadvantage for Perth. Also will the Storm survive without News Ltd.

Same for AFL, its been around 120 years and they talk about more expansion here and overseas, if it were gonna grow it would have grown by now.

We have limited cash and people to support sport here, I tend to think not much will grow, we may get the odd new team here and there but they could also end up going the same way as the Chargers, Seagulls etc.
 
Messages
15,659
Teams can fold from bad management and other reasons, like I said the market is there so GC team is back again.

I dont see the A League growing much more if at all although they do talk about expansion.

Same with League, I dont think there is a big enough market in Adelaide and Perth and the travel costs and time difference are a big disadvantage for Perth. Also will the Storm survive without News Ltd.

Same for AFL, its been around 120 years and they talk about more expansion here and overseas, if it were gonna grow it would have grown by now.

We have limited cash and people to support sport here, I tend to think not much will grow, we may get the odd new team here and there but they could also end up going the same way as the Chargers, Seagulls etc.

Can't argue with that .
What I argue about is the soccer clowns who continually go on about a "foregone conclusion" that soccer will take over.
Sleeping giant
RL is dying .
BLAH blah .
As I posted above ,soccer might be growing ,but so are other sports .
& AL gets smashed when a competitor starts their season .
 

Big Sam

First Grade
Messages
8,976
To answer OP:

Australia has always been a xenophobic place (note I am not talking about racism here but rather a reluctance to accept that which is foreign), and you need only spend a bit of time abroad to realise that we as a people embrace change very reluctantly (if at all).

The stereotypes comes from ignorance about, and a lack of exposure to, football. For example, those Australians who say the game is boring often seem to be the ones who are more than happy to sit through hours of enthralling test cricket: they are purists who derive as much pleasure from a maiden over as a massive six because they deeply understand that sport and its nuances. In the same token, football purists understand that a 0-0 does not necessarily mean a game is boring and lacking in attacking intent. That perception will change as the Australian sporting public becomes further exposed to, and thus educated about, football.

Why I agree with Lemon Squash that football will become the number one football code in this century:

Relative growth
Football is the only one of the 4 football codes to have rapidly grown in popularity in the last 10 years. The NRL averages roughly the same range (14-16k) as it did a decade ago; Union's crowds/popularity/revenue has regressed enormously from those heady days of the 2003 RWC; and the AFL average has dropped 20% from its all time high of around 2006. Yes, people will point to the fact that both RL and AFL's media deals have doubled in the last decade to well over $200m each annually, but football has gone from $0 to $40m annually in that same timeframe and is looking at doubling that in the next rights deal. It may be behind but it's charting a more rapid trajectory.

Globalisation (Migration and FDI)
New migrants to the country are coming from parts of the world where either football or cricket are the number one sport (Asia). Further to this, overseas investment is increasing in the A-League in the form of TV money and club ownership; Brisbane is owned by Indonesians, and Melbourne City by Emiratis. Cricket Australia and the ARU have had their media deals boosted by money from overseas broadcasters too. However no money is coming from overseas at all for RL and AFL (and when it does potentially come e.g. in the form of Marwan Koukash, the sport is too xenophobic to embrace it).

To address the points made by the TFC xenophobes who have poked their heads in:

@Strong Latte
- We do not have an "indigenous sports culture"; all our main sports were imported from the UK in the case of cricket and RL/RU, or Ireland in the case of Aussie Rules.
- Your depiction of football as being like McDonald's with minimal/token cultural variation is highly ignorant. In fact the sport acts as a medium through which different national cultures are strongly expressed. To give you some brief examples of this:
-> The historical 'route one' style of British football comes from the fact that the weather there rendered the pitches mudbaths and meant that going 'in the air' was considered the best way to score.
-> The genesis of Total Football in the 1970s came from a nation (the Netherlands) that was going through an intellectual revolution which saw a rejection of norms and constraints imposed by the mainstream.
-> Even diving is a representation of national culture. It was started, and is today most prevalent in, cultures where hoodwinking officialdom/authority is revered.
(There are far more examples of how football acts as a conduit for national [and regional] cultural expression. Countless books have been written on this subject.)
- Conversely, there is no discernible difference in the style of play between Aust/NZ RL and English RL that can be put down to culture, and it is laughable to think as such. The SL is only faster in play because they don't wrestle and there's just one referee; nothing to do with culture. In the past in Union, you could say that there was a split in style (e.g. UK "10 man rugby" vs Aust/NZ "running rugby") between the hemispheres owing to culture but now they have converged to result in a terribly conservative game, probably due to its professional status.
- Yes FIFA is a corrupt and rotten organisation and you will not find one rational football fan who doesn't think it should be scrapped and re-started again with the crooks turfed out and punished. Thinking however that FIFA's rampant corruption means that Australians shouldn't follow the sport is frankly bizarre. If we were to use your moral compass, cricket should not be followed due to match/spot fixing, and the same with swimming and athletics due to doping.

@Phil McGrawhan:
- It's great that "some people like physical sports ,the brutality ,the gladiatorial aspect". It's one of the reasons I love RL. But clearly you and I are in the minority given that the admins of RL (and RU and AFL) are sanitising the shit out of the sport. Despite Sam Burgess' heroics, this unique selling point of physicality between football and the rugby codes/AFL is fading fast.
- As for your point about the A-League not being the 'best of the best' in its sport unlike the NRL and AFL; you need only look at the MLS to see how 20 years after its establishment it has gained enormous credibility within the global football community. It is well-regarded to the extent that it can now attract world class players (e.g. Lampard, Villa) closer to the prime of their careers without necessarily paying the enormous sums that got Beckham to come. Added to this, it has now become the main base for players in the US national team who see it more enhancing of their selection chances than benchwarming somewhere in Europe. The MLS is closing in on entering the top 10 leagues in the world and offers a reliable projection for what the A-League could be like in a decade.

In fact I'd go so far as to say that it's the J.Leagues, CSLs, MLSs, and ISLs of the world that the A-League is competing against - not the AFL and NRL - and this will define its long-term success.
 

Haffa

Guest
Messages
16,508
The A-League isn't even competing with the NRL for the majority of the season. It's growth isn't exactly taking anything away from either code. It's competing with cricket for viewers for the majority of the season and currently losing ratings to the Big Bash.

The MLS isn't even the 5th sports league in its own country. It's behind the NFL, NCAA Football, MLB, NBA, NHL at a minimum. The average ratings of the MLS have been steady for the past 10 years. How much of an impact does the MLS have on the beast that is the NFL?

ESPN2 Viewership
YEAR AVG.
2006 263,000
2007 289,000
2008 251,000
2009 290,000
2010 249,000
2011 238,000
2012 232,000
2013 197,000
2014 225 000

ESPN Deportes Viewership
YEAR AVG.
2013 32,000
2014 42,000
 

strong_latte

Juniors
Messages
1,665
To answer OP:

Australia has always been a xenophobic place (note I am not talking about racism here but rather a reluctance to accept that which is foreign), and you need only spend a bit of time abroad to realise that we as a people embrace change very reluctantly (if at all).

The stereotypes comes from ignorance about, and a lack of exposure to, football. For example, those Australians who say the game is boring often seem to be the ones who are more than happy to sit through hours of enthralling test cricket: they are purists who derive as much pleasure from a maiden over as a massive six because they deeply understand that sport and its nuances. In the same token, football purists understand that a 0-0 does not necessarily mean a game is boring and lacking in attacking intent. That perception will change as the Australian sporting public becomes further exposed to, and thus educated about, football.

Why I agree with Lemon Squash that football will become the number one football code in this century:

Relative growth
Football is the only one of the 4 football codes to have rapidly grown in popularity in the last 10 years. The NRL averages roughly the same range (14-16k) as it did a decade ago; Union's crowds/popularity/revenue has regressed enormously from those heady days of the 2003 RWC; and the AFL average has dropped 20% from its all time high of around 2006. Yes, people will point to the fact that both RL and AFL's media deals have doubled in the last decade to well over $200m each annually, but football has gone from $0 to $40m annually in that same timeframe and is looking at doubling that in the next rights deal. It may be behind but it's charting a more rapid trajectory.

Globalisation (Migration and FDI)
New migrants to the country are coming from parts of the world where either football or cricket are the number one sport (Asia).

Will adress the rest later but three points briefly:
1. Immigrants don't automatically watch soccer. I'm the child of Swedish immigrants who watch soccer (which is why I played it as a kid) but I don't like or enjoy the sport. Why? Because I grew up in a country with alternatives that I found more interesting and enjoyable.

2. Relative growth is "relative" because it's starting from a low base. Soccer remains a minor sport in this country and is currently losing ground to its main competitor cricket, who's growth rate is technically slower, but more significant all the same because it is already massive. Put it this way - a tech start up might grow at a rate of 300% for its first couple years, but you'd be kidding yourself if you thought that high growth "rate" made it a sure bet to take over Apple because their "rate" is only 2%.

3. Xenophobia is not what's a play with rejecting soccer and its cultural arrogance to suggest so. Just because the people of one country don't like an internationally popular sport doesn't mean they hate foreign things and if you really think that about Australia you're an idiot. It's the competitiveness of the market.

Countries like France, Germany and South Africa are good examples of countries that are afraid of foreign sports - all 3 have banned rugby league or union (in the case of Germany) throughout their histories because they feared what the games represented. Show me where and when soccer was ever banned in this country and maybe you might have the tiniest beginnings of a point, but in reality it's been the rugby codes (and generally league) that have suffered the most genuine prejudice in the world.
 
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BuffaloRules

Coach
Messages
15,454
Australians are supposedly cultural xenophobes and this is evidenced because they don't fawn over soccer...

Really?

What other parts of overseas culture do Australians reject?

Food? The Arts? Movies and TV?

What other widely played overseas sports are rejected? The Olympics? Golf? Tennis?

Also, Australians are some of the most widely traveled people you will find anywhere, so I don't see how that. goes hand in hand with cultural xenophobia...

No, on the contrary, the fact that Australia has four forms of professional football makes them more globally inclusive then most...
 

RoosTah

Juniors
Messages
2,257
Australians are supposedly cultural xenophobes and this is evidenced because they don't fawn over soccer...

Really?

What other parts of overseas culture do Australians reject?

Food? The Arts? Movies and TV?

What other widely played overseas sports are rejected? The Olympics? Golf? Tennis?

Also, Australians are some of the most widely traveled people you will find anywhere, so I don't see how that. goes hand in hand with cultural xenophobia...

No, on the contrary, the fact that Australia has four forms of professional football makes them more globally inclusive then most...

People who think Australia's lack of interest in soccer is symptomatic of "xenophobia" are resentful soccer bigots who hate mainstream Australian culture or simpletons who don't understand the meaning of the word.

I lived in Japan for several years and speak the language, and the Japanese follow soccer (and they call it "soccer" and not "football" for the record) after baseball, and so by the arguments put forward by some of the soccer bigots here you'd think Japan was a more inclusive and open society than Australia. After all, the Japanese like soccer, so they must be worldly and international, right? Not exactly...

I love the place and the people, but when you get past their welcoming demeanour there is a very powerful streak of xenophobia that is deep and even institutional. In fact I'd say you'd be hard pressed to find a more xenophobic country in the democratic world than Japan... the country effectively has a policy akin to the racial purity policies of Australia's past and marginalises foreigners' legal rights, making all sorts things much harder to do when compared to natural Japanese - and this goes for "foreigners" in the class of Koreans are already several generations removed.

I bring them up because I've had a long association with Japan, but there are plenty of soccer nations around the world that could hardly be more xenophobic if they tried - just look at the utter scum that is the Saudi Kingdom. Anyone who thinks them being a "soccer nation" makes them some how more open and tolerant than a country like Australia is - as I said before - a soccer bigot with no real understanding of the world.

Also, as a Union fan I just thought I'd touch on this reply to Strong_latte:

To answer OP:
Conversely, there is no discernible difference in the style of play between Aust/NZ RL and English RL that can be put down to culture, and it is laughable to think as such. The SL is only faster in play because they don't wrestle and there's just one referee; nothing to do with culture. In the past in Union, you could say that there was a split in style (e.g. UK "10 man rugby" vs Aust/NZ "running rugby") between the hemispheres owing to culture but now they have converged to result in a terribly conservative game, probably due to its professional status.

You know dick all about League and Union is all I can say...

There has been no convergence of styles in Union first up - the English still play a dull 10 man game, and Australia tries to run it every chance they get, but don't have the grunt up front to win enough games by getting the strike players in the right positions anymore. There has been a shift however, but it's simply been one of the total rugby of the All Blacks, against the grinding style of most of the north and the overly backs-focussed tactics of teams like Australia.

On the league front, Australia have dominated England for 50 years because England don't produce creative halves with the regularity that Australia does, and thus focus almost entirely on plodding the ball up. That is a result of the difference in both the climate and the cultures of the respective countries. The dreary English weather and pent-up social values aren't conducive to open play, while the flat tracks in Australia and more open and easy going attitude give far more freedom to move and creativity to halves, which is why our players try so many more tricks.

If you can argue that diving is culture, then so is Australia's greater focus on creativity. Tell me the last time you saw an England team produce tries like the Kangaroos put on in the World Cup final last year against credible opposition. They don't. England are plodding in League, Union and soccer, and countries like Australia and NZ are expansive and creative. That's just as much an expression of culture and more as something as geniused as diving.
 
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strong_latte

Juniors
Messages
1,665
So just to answer Sam's direct points to me:

@Strong Latte
- We do not have an "indigenous sports culture"; all our main sports were imported from the UK in the case of cricket and RL/RU, or Ireland in the case of Aussie Rules.
- Your depiction of football as being like McDonald's with minimal/token cultural variation is highly ignorant. In fact the sport acts as a medium through which different national cultures are strongly expressed. To give you some brief examples of this:

In what sense is our sports culture not "indigenous"? Was RU/RL imported from the UK? Sure. Was Australian Football influenced by the Irish? Sure. But in all three cases, and in particular with the Australian Football, Australians have been key in how the very rules and fundamental structure of the game has evolved.

I almost don't even want bother with the point on Australian Football, because the history of the game is well documented and the sport is known to have had Aborigianal influences as well as Irish immigrant ones, but if you think a sport with Aboriginal, Australian settler and Irish immigrant influences isn't a product of the Australian experiment, then you're being ridiculous (particularly given you then go on to argue that f**king diving is a cultural expression).

As for Rugby League, the sport may have originated in the UK, but it started out as an offshoot of Union and while the early changes were instigated up north, the majority of the modern era changes to the game have come from Australia. Those changes have fundamentally altered the nature of the game, and given it an increasingly Australian flavour, and that is quite different to a simple difference in style of play, and makes the game a genuinely Australian sport in a way that soccer can't be intrinsically German" for Germany (for instance) no matter how obsessed they get with it.

To take a linguistic analogy, Rugby League has become an Australian dialect of Rugby in effect - the base structure is there, but the language itself is actually quite different to where it began. Think of it as Portuguese is to Spanish; related but the differences are real and born out of a genuine and lengthy isolation and partial reinvention of the language.

By comparison, soccer in Italy is more like an accent of the English language; it has its own superficial characteristics that make it stand out, but there's nothing other than a few slang words and idioms that a speaker from another part of the Anglosphere wouldn't understand because it's grammatical architecture is almost entirely the same.

You could make similar points with Rugby Union, but not to the same degree as with League. All the same, Australia was a key pusher in the adopting the ELVs, rules that do alter the structure, and pace of the game.

The key point here is that in all cases to varying degrees Australians have altered the fundamental DNA of the other three codes of Football, and that is something you simply cannot say with soccer with any country other than England.

@Strong Latte
-> The genesis of Total Football in the 1970s came from a nation (the Netherlands) that was going through an intellectual revolution which saw a rejection of norms and constraints imposed by the mainstream.
-> Even diving is a representation of national culture. It was started, and is today most prevalent in, cultures where hoodwinking officialdom/authority is revered.
(There are far more examples of how football acts as a conduit for national [and regional] cultural expression. Countless books have been written on this subject.)
- Conversely, there is no discernible difference in the style of play between Aust/NZ RL and English RL that can be put down to culture, and it is laughable to think as such. The SL is only faster in play because they don't wrestle and there's just one referee; nothing to do with culture. In the past in Union, you could say that there was a split in style (e.g. UK "10 man rugby" vs Aust/NZ "running rugby") between the hemispheres owing to culture but now they have converged to result in a terribly conservative game, probably due to its professional status.

For all these I'll defer to RoosTah, as he's adequately debunked your failure to appreciate the tactical differences in Rugby League and Union. In particular, I'd argue that the concept of "Total Rugby" is just as valid a cultural expression of that sport as "total soccer" is for soccer and I don't get how you can just wash over that.
 
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WireMan

Bench
Messages
4,479
People who think Australia's lack of interest in soccer is symptomatic of "xenophobia" are resentful soccer bigots who hate mainstream Australian culture or simpletons who don't understand the meaning of the word.

I lived in Japan for several years and speak the language, and the Japanese follow soccer (and they call it "soccer" and not "football" for the record) after baseball, and so by the arguments put forward by some of the soccer bigots here you'd think Japan was a more inclusive and open society than Australia. After all, the Japanese like soccer, so they must be worldly and international, right? Not exactly...

I love the place and the people, but when you get past their welcoming demeanour there is a very powerful streak of xenophobia that is deep and even institutional. In fact I'd say you'd be hard pressed to find a more xenophobic country in the democratic world than Japan... the country effectively has a policy akin to the racial purity policies of Australia's past and marginalises foreigners' legal rights, making all sorts things much harder to do when compared to natural Japanese - and this goes for "foreigners" in the class of Koreans are already several generations removed.

I bring them up because I've had a long association with Japan, but there are plenty of soccer nations around the world that could hardly be more xenophobic if they tried - just look at the utter scum that is the Saudi Kingdom. Anyone who thinks them being a "soccer nation" makes them some how more open and tolerant than a country like Australia is - as I said before - a soccer bigot with no real understanding of the world.

Also, as a Union fan I just thought I'd touch on this reply to Strong_latte:



You know dick all about League and Union is all I can say...

There has been no convergence of styles in Union first up - the English still play a dull 10 man game, and Australia tries to run it every chance they get, but don't have the grunt up front to win enough games by getting the strike players in the right positions anymore. There has been a shift however, but it's simply been one of the total rugby of the All Blacks, against the grinding style of most of the north and the overly backs-focussed tactics of teams like Australia.

On the league front, Australia have dominated England for 50 years because England don't produce creative halves with the regularity that Australia does, and thus focus almost entirely on plodding the ball up. That is a result of the difference in both the climate and the cultures of the respective countries. The dreary English weather and pent-up social values aren't conducive to open play, while the flat tracks in Australia and more open and easy going attitude give far more freedom to move and creativity to halves, which is why our players try so many more tricks.

If you can argue that diving is culture, then so is Australia's greater focus on creativity. Tell me the last time you saw an England team produce tries like the Kangaroos put on in the World Cup final last year against credible opposition. They don't. England are plodding in League, Union and soccer, and countries like Australia and NZ are expansive and creative. That's just as much an expression of culture and more as something as geniused as diving.

Stick to the pointless Japan points bud. At least you know the subject.

You just guessed with all the northern hemisphere stuff, and got it badly wrong.

So just to answer Sam's direct points to me:



In what sense is our sports culture not "indigenous"? Was RU/RL imported from the UK? Sure. Was Australian Football influenced by the Irish? Sure. But in all three cases, and in particular with the Australian Football, Australians have been key in how the very rules and fundamental structure of the game has evolved.

I almost don't even want bother with the point on Australian Football, because the history of the game is well documented and the sport is known to have had Aborigianal influences as well as Irish immigrant ones, but if you think a sport with Aboriginal, Australian settler and Irish immigrant influences isn't a product of the Australian experiment, then you're being ridiculous (particularly given you then go on to argue that f**king diving is a cultural expression).

As for Rugby League, the sport may have originated in the UK, but it started out as an offshoot of Union and while the early changes were instigated up north, the majority of the modern era changes to the game have come from Australia. Those changes have fundamentally altered the nature of the game, and given it an increasingly Australian flavour, and that is quite different to a simple difference in style of play, and makes the game a genuinely Australian sport in a way that soccer can't be intrinsically German" for Germany (for instance) no matter how obsessed they get with it.

To take a linguistic analogy, Rugby League has become an Australian dialect of Rugby in effect - the base structure is there, but the language itself is actually quite different to where it began. Think of it as Portuguese is to Spanish; related but the differences are real and born out of a genuine and lengthy isolation and partial reinvention of the language.

By comparison, soccer in Italy is more like an accent of the English language; it has its own superficial characteristics that make it stand out, but there's nothing other than a few slang words and idioms that a speaker from another part of the Anglosphere wouldn't understand because it's grammatical architecture is almost entirely the same.

You could make similar points with Rugby Union, but not to the same degree as with League. All the same, Australia was a key pusher in the adopting the ELVs, rules that do alter the structure, and pace of the game.

The key point here is that in all cases to varying degrees Australians have altered the fundamental DNA of the other three codes of Football, and that is something you simply cannot say with soccer with any country other than England.



For all these I'll defer to RoosTah, as he's adequately debunked your failure to appreciate the tactical differences in Rugby League and Union. In particular, I'd argue that the concept of "Total Rugby" is just as valid a cultural expression of that sport as "total soccer" is for soccer and I don't get how you can just wash over that.

None of your sports talked about in this thread are indigenous.

The idea rugby league in aus is a different sport but soccer around the world is just a different accent of the English game is wrong.



Basically the answer to the thread question is aus sport is a bubble, especially in Sydney. That is not a bad thing, it is just the way it is.

The two posts I quoted give a good example of this.
As soccer gets into this bubble more the locals will wake up to just how stupidly big the sport can be.
If aus actually got the world cup, there would be a lot of very surprised people.
The arguments about stadiums within the NRL community that have been going on for years would end in a second because one guy at Fifa said so...
 

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