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Willie Tonga signs with Pirtek Parramatta Eels

Eels Dude

Coach
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19,065
As long as Burt's fit and still up to it you have to find a role for him in the side. He's just invaluable and brings that steady head that we don't have otherwise. You're not going to get that from Sandow, Hayne or Roberts no matter how talented they are.
 

Suitman

Post Whore
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55,475
As long as Burt's fit and still up to it you have to find a role for him in the side. He's just invaluable and brings that steady head that we don't have otherwise. You're not going to get that from Sandow, Hayne or Roberts no matter how talented they are.

A steady head on the wing isn't going to counter balance anything done in the spine.

Suity
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
88,440
A steady head on the wing isn't going to counter balance anything done in the spine.

Very true, which is why I wouldn't just 'find a role for him'.

Burt either plays fullback or he plays for Wenty. On the wing he manages to be ineffective while simultaneously wasting his kicking and support games.
 

Eels Dude

Coach
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19,065
A steady head on the wing isn't going to counter balance anything done in the spine.

Suity

It doesn't matter what position he plays more what he actually brings to the first grade side leadership wise. As much as I think Hindy is a legend Burt is the smarter footballer.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
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88,440
who is better qualified Poupou?

Someone who gives us a lot more metres on exit sets, can stop opposing wingers one-on-one, especially on his line, and who will contest the high ball when isolated out there on the wing.

For all their lack of experience I'd say Sio, Morgan, Loko and Esi Tonga are all likely to do these things better than Luke Burt. Even Jordan Atkins is better at this stuff.
 
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Suitman

Post Whore
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55,475
It doesn't matter what position he plays more what he actually brings to the first grade side leadership wise. As much as I think Hindy is a legend Burt is the smarter footballer.

That may be so, but Kearney has shown a pretence to plan for the future.
Burt won't be a part of that future, (sadly, the ship has sailed), so steady heads aren't needed on the wing.
I'd rather see the likes of Sio and Esi given chances and the the whims of Roberts, Sandow and Hayne take their place.

Suity
 

Eels Dude

Coach
Messages
19,065
That may be so, but Kearney has shown a pretence to plan for the future.
Burt won't be a part of that future, (sadly, the ship has sailed), so steady heads aren't needed on the wing.
I'd rather see the likes of Sio and Esi given chances and the the whims of Roberts, Sandow and Hayne take their place.

Suity

Well that's true. At the end of the day the coach has the say and nobody can argue about Sio and Esi getting a go because they are both young and talented. Just my personal opinion that you need smart footballers in the side too and Burt is one of the smartest in the game that is invaluable so as long as he can still hack first grade he should be there.
 

Pazza

First Grade
Messages
9,334
Someone who gives us a lot more metres on exit sets, can stop opposing wingers one-on-one, especially on his line, and who will contest the high ball when isolated out there on the wing.

For all their lack of experience I'd say Sio, Morgan, Loko and Esi Tonga are all likely to do these things better than Luke Burt. Even Jordan Atkins is better at this stuff.

Burt is very capable in all the skills you have mentioned, while he might not have the ability to power run the ball out of our own end. There is no better player in our team darting out of dummy half off a quick play the ball. Burt has been in FG since 1999 and has played over 200 games under 4 different coaches. There is a reason for this and i am 100% confident that he will have a role in the FG team next year.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
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88,440
Burt is very capable in all the skills you have mentioned, while he might not have the ability to power run the ball out of our own end.

Not true. He won't contest the high ball, and he's a liability defending on his line.

There is no better player in our team darting out of dummy half off a quick play the ball.

True, but you want wingers who will make ground regardless of how quick the preceding play-the-ball. Because more often than not it's going to be slow.

Burt has been in FG since 1999 and has played over 200 games under 4 different coaches. There is a reason for this and i am 100% confident that he will have a role in the FG team next year.

So am I - he's in the 25 man squad for a reason, and I even suspect Kearney will at least give him first shot at wing next year (and maybe he deserves it).

I'm just saying if it were up to me I wouldn't let the distant past (in footballing terms) dictate how I pick my team. The coach has to be loyal to the team first, even if that means being disloyal to individual players.
 
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oldmancraigy

Coach
Messages
11,741
It doesn't matter what position he plays more what he actually brings to the first grade side leadership wise. As much as I think Hindy is a legend Burt is the smarter footballer.

Burt might be smarter, but he's a far worse leader.

To use a harsh phrase: Burt is a "loser".
Now let me explain: Burt is a guy who looks good when everyone else in the team is setting the platform for him. But he is NOT the kind of guy who can change a game on his own. If things are going badly, Burt is the kind of player who makes the bad play and tends to stuff up in those scenarios.

When the challenge seems insurmountable, guys like this tend to fold.

I'd much rather Hindy's leadership - when things are tough he's always chasing the break, cleaning up in the in-goal and generally tackling everything that moves.
Hayne is another guy who is always 'johnny on the spot' when things aren't working - and always trying to 'step up' and make a play.


In the argument as to where Burt will play: should be interesting to see what happens. He's not needed for his goal kicking, which seriously hampers his overall value to the team - if we needed his goal kicking, we then try to accomodate his strengths (general kicking and support).
But without the goal kicking we don't need to 'force him' into the lineup - so it becomes a question as to whether we want a winger who doesn't make meterage out of dummy half; doesn't contest bombs; and doesn't tackle his opponent.
For mine, having seen him play one game in first grade, Sio should be the first winger picked - the only specialist wingers we have are Burt, Sio and Atkins. Sio provides more than the other 2 in the context of what we need for the TEAM next season.

I'd probably have Burt on the left wing for his outstanding ability to get across the stripe (W Tonga should create quite a lot for him)
 
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2,376
Out of curiosity, how many players are left from the Brian Smith days?
Obviuosly Hindy, Burt and Ben Smith, I cant be bothered looking it all up..

Given that these three are "senior" players, theres probably an argument that the culture change that we are needing wont be complete (for good or bad) until those players have moved on, (again for good or for bad).
 

Eels Dude

Coach
Messages
19,065
Out of curiosity, how many players are left from the Brian Smith days?
Obviuosly Hindy, Burt and Ben Smith, I cant be bothered looking it all up..

Given that these three are "senior" players, theres probably an argument that the culture change that we are needing wont be complete (for good or bad) until those players have moved on, (again for good or for bad).

You can add Fuifui to that list but it's a bit irrelevant as it's been 5 and 1/2 years since the Brian Smith days. The reason why there's only four of them left is because the rest have retired or moved on. I don't see how the Brian Smith days are relevant at all considering he's been our most successful coach since Jack Gibson, therefore no need for a culture change. You always need senior players too and senior players come from being at the club a long time.
 

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