WWE Money In The Bank *Spoilers*

[Whos Ya Daddy]

If Hart isn't a massive star than there are only 3: Hogan, Austin, Rock. You could argue for Cena but he has been smashed over so hard and still hasn't got there.

 

[Big Pete]

Aye, to me a massive star means household name which all three were.

If we're talking stars then I can understand including Hart. Angle's more iffy because he was only the star of the company for a three month period in 2001. Every other time he was putting others over.

Bryan could definitely achieve that level if the WWE desired. Whether the WWE would be succesful is another question.

 

[Whos Ya Daddy]

Why does Bryan Danielson get held to such a high standard. He needs to suck McMahon's dick and become all gimmick like Hogan/Rock/Austin just so he can win the WWE title? That's a cop out. Have you had a look at McMahon recently? He is so jacked up on steroids I don't think he has an undamaged brain cell left. If you think that's what makes a great champion than there is no hope.

This is not some boring tactician like Dean Malenko. This is the biggest independent star in the world. When he got fired everyone went nuts. There is no one in the company who deserves the belt more than him. There is no one in the company who can go with him in the ring. There is no one in the company with a more loyal fan base than him. In fact he should have been given the Punk program and be feuding with Cena right now. Why put over a guy who is about to go on a hiatus?

As for Wade Barrett. He is not fit to tie Dragon's boot laces.

 

[Big Pete]

Why does Bryan Danielson get held to such a high standard. He needs to suck McMahon's dick and become all gimmick like Hogan/Rock/Austin just so he can win the WWE title? That's a cop out. Have you had a look at McMahon recently? He is so jacked up on steroids I don't think he has an undamaged brain cell left. If you think that's what makes a great champion than there is no hope.

This is not some boring tactician like Dean Malenko. This is the biggest independent star in the world. When he got fired everyone went nuts. There is no one in the company who deserves the belt more than him. There is no one in the company who can go with him in the ring. There is no one in the company with a more loyal fan base than him. In fact he should have been given the Punk program and be feuding with Cena right now. Why put over a guy who is about to go on a hiatus?

As for Wade Barrett. He is not fit to tie Dragon's boot laces.

Sorry to break this to you but EVERYONE thinks Austin/Hogan/Rock were great champions. Figures don't lie.

 

[Whos Ya Daddy]

Sorry to break this to you but EVERYONE does not.

But as usual you are making assertions that I didn't argue. I was pointing out that McMahon hammering you over does not define whether one was a great champion or not.

 

[Whos Ya Daddy]

Safe money certainly suggests Del Rio wins it, even though it does seem a little redundant considering he qualified as no. 1 contender last night on the Raw taping. But considering Rock/Cena is essentially a lock for the WWE championship (the right move) I think a delayed MitB cash in would just result in a huge mess and needs to be performed quickly. Ideally, I would have had Mysterio cash it in and save the WWE Championship from Punk and in the process set up a big Mysterio/Cena clash at SummerSlam but with the new stip added to the match I can just see somebody like ADR cash it in on Cena post-match leading to a program where surprise surprise Cena comes out on top.

Smackdown is certainly trickier. I like Rhodes but this paper bag bit is getting stale, it should have been used at best as a two week bit before moving on and giving him a serious feud BUT this is the WWE we're talking about. They milk bits until they turn into powder. Now can I get a 'Damn' in here? Barrett to win and insert himself into the main event picture, where he belonged in the first place.

As for Bryan, normally I'd say great in-ring competitors don't make for great WWE champions but in a day and age where Swagger, Miz and Ziggler have had championship reigns it really wouldn't matter. His WWE career has been stagnant for about 8 months now after a good start where they basically dedicated an entire show to him and had him star in the second biggest show of the year.

If it was me, I'd be setting up a Christian/Bryan feud for SummerSlam. Imagine just how good that match would be if given time.

If you are going to continue to just make up assertions that I didn't say I might as well quote you and call you on your shit.

That right there is why I will never agree with you on anything. Being a great in-ring competitor holds a wrestler back from becoming a great champion? Well no wonder he won't make a great champion then.

We could debate that point but what really pisses me off is that you celebrate it. That's whats wrong with the industry. Fans like you.

 

[Big Pete]

Sorry should have been clearer, when I referred to EVERYONE I meant those who had achieved something of note in the biz. They'd all admit all three were major success' as champs.

And no of course not otherwise Michaels would be the ultimate champion of all time when in reality he was one of the worst draws in history.

An abundance of charisma is what it takes. Bryan isn't a slouch but he isn't on the level Hogan, Austin or Rock were or Cena is.

Considering he's only been booked as a mid-carder in the past few months giving him the MitB briefcase would be a disservice to him and the company.

 

[Big Pete]

If you are going to continue to just make up assertions that I didn't say I might as well quote you and call you on your shit.

That right there is why I will never agree with you on anything. Being a great in-ring competitor holds a wrestler back from becoming a great champion? Well no wonder he won't make a great champion then.

We could debate that point but what really pisses me off is that you celebrate it. That's whats wrong with the industry. Fans like you.

No being over solely for being a great wrestler and nothing else is what holds you back.

Look at Hart and Benoit.

The whole package is needed.

Bryan doesn't have a look.

Doesn't have the neccesary charisma.

But it's okay, he can be the best independant wrestler of all time and entertain the thousands.

In the major leagues it's all about the millions.

 

[Whos Ya Daddy]

No being over solely for being a great wrestler and nothing else is what holds you back.

Look at Hart and Benoit.

The whole package is needed.

Bryan doesn't have a look.

Doesn't have the neccesary charisma.

But it's okay, he can be the best independant wrestler of all time and entertain the thousands.

In the major leagues it's all about the millions.

I look at Hart and Benoit and I see two great careers. Not as strong technically as many would have you believe but great workers no doubt. I don't see how that comparison is pouring shit on anyone. There is a difference between Danielson and these guys though. He's much better in every aspect. If there isn't a solid title run for a guy like that when you have imposters winning the belt who have been in the industry 5 minutes than that's f**ked up.

The look is everything that is wrong with wrestling. Vince McMahon's homosexual body fetish. The only time Ric Flair had anything near the look is when he was jacked up on steroids during his brief WWF run. With the exception of Scott Steiner roid apes can't wrestle to save their life. If HHH had to wrestle a 60 minute iron man match with Davey Richards they would have to carry his ass out on a stretcher.

The best thing the WWE did for pro wrestling in the last decade was not pick up Danielson's contract in 2003 and bury him. We got to see something amazing. I don't care if he never wins another match. He's a legend and I can look the other way whilst he tries to make some bank. Just don't tell me that you can't take him seriously.

 

[Big Pete]

If there isn't a solid title run for a guy like that when you have imposters winning the belt who have been in the industry 5 minutes than that's f**ked up.

And there it is.

Nobody is disagreeing with you that Bryan deserves a solid run with the title. What Marshall and I are objecting to is giving him a championship run cold with little to no build up. Does that really benefit anybody other than us diehards who know how well Bryan can go? Of course not. I'm with you, I'd love to see Bryan break the mould and get to wrestle his own style and make his own statement as a performer and instead of the WWE meeting him halfway I'd like to see them pour their money into him (and other mid-carders too that they have forgotten for I Love New York rejects) to at least make him a credible main eventer in the major leagues and thus to all. However in the present they need to start building him. Giving him the MitB would just cheapen a hard-fought championship win.

The other point we disagree on is him being a potential megastar but that seems to be more a disagreement on the definition. I reserved the title for the cream of the crop while you lowered the bar to include the likes of Hart and co.

 

[pennywisealfie]

you know what would be epic? If Daniel Bryan was in ROH. They would have to change the name to OMG! coz i would jizz in my pants.

 

[Scott Gourley's Lovechild]

Daniel Bryan reminds me alot of Lance Storm. Great athlete, and can carry anyone to a good match. But like Storm, his personality and ability to connect with the mainstream crowd is what will keep him away from the top title picture.

 

[RedVDave]

Daniel Bryan reminds me alot of Lance Storm. Great athlete, and can carry anyone to a good match. But like Storm, his personality and ability to connect with the mainstream crowd is what will keep him away from the top title picture.

"If I can be serious for a minute"

f**k Storm was awesome so underratted.

 

[Big Pete]

He was basically the only reason to tune into WCW 2000.

Unless you enjoyed car wrecks.

 

[Manurewa_Marlins]

Not everyone has to be the Rock, Hogan and Austin. Sure you need your megastars, but you also need your workhorses in the midcard - this is what made mid 90s WCW so awesome. For all the Hogans, Nash, Goldbergs and Stings you had Malenko, Benoit, Guerrero and Jericho. For every Lugar you had Mysterio, and for every Warrior you had Page. You need a balance. Danielson provides that balance in the midcard, the issue comes with the booking, the PPV structure and its impact on storylines/pushes etc, too many titles, the psuedo-split that still exists, and the way the WWE runs guys' momentum into the ground without looking to the future. Because whilst Cena and Orton were getting over in 05, they had Triple H and the Undertaker still clinging on to what stardom they still had, without paying any attention to the undercard. As a result, we've got those four still on top, with shit all in the midcard. Punk had one of the best fueds in recent times when he copied the ROH run with Raven on Smackdown with Jeff Hardy, and it got both over BIG time. Then nothing happened. They lack the planning and long term thinking.

 

[Big Pete]

Danielson provides that balance in the midcard

Nobody said otherwise.

the issue comes with the booking, the PPV structure and its impact on storylines/pushes etc, too many titles, the psuedo-split that still exists, and the way the WWE runs guys' momentum into the ground without looking to the future.

Agreed.

As a result, we've got those four still on top, with shit all in the midcard. Punk had one of the best fueds in recent times when he copied the ROH run with Raven on Smackdown with Jeff Hardy, and it got both over BIG time.

I really enjoyed that storyline as well but apparently it didn't draw that well. Which is a damn shame because that was the last time Smackdown actually came across as a good show.

 

[Big Pete]

BUMP

Cena/Punk has been great largely because the WWE have trusted Punk to do his thing and McMahon has followed his lead. Cena has had his good and bad moments and right now it will come down to the quality and finish of the match. We all know the WWE should let Punk win, the challenge would be to still let Cena look strong for his Mania showdown with The Rock while giving the fans what they want. Apparently Colt Cobana will be at the PPV so I wouldn't be surprised to see him get involved.

Orton/Christian IV as good as these matches have been there's just no way that Christian will or should go over after the pathetic build. I expect a good match and hopefully both will move onto better matches at SummerSlam.

Raw MitB - Why haven't they shown concern for Punk potentially stealing their prize away? Build up has been generic, typical Mario Kart 'I'ma gonna win' type promos that have grown tired after 8 MitB matches. Should still be a decent spotfest.

Smackdown MitB - More generic, lesser match. Feh.

Henry/Show - Creative have done a great job of building Henry as a monster but I suspect this will be the dud of the night.

Kelly/Brie - Piss break.

 

[Manurewa_Marlins]

I'd rather Cabana not get involved at have Punk win the belt and psuedo-leave. Have him cut nWo-style promos, whereby he "itnerupts" the Raw broadcast, show him in Japan defending the belt, in ROH defending the belt, have him shoot all over the WWE, getting huge acclaim from fans. Push him to other media etc. Then you have Del Rio win the MITB, and challenge Punk to come back, call him chicken etc. Have him destroy everyone in his path, hell, have him invent his own "WWE championship", have him call himself the best wrestler in the world. This would piss Punk off in storyline, because Punk is huge on tradition and huge on being the best.This could go on for three or four months, in the lead up to Survivor Series, Punk returns and loses to a bullshit decision, you could have Vince pull a 'screwjob'. Punk wins the Rumble, challenges Del Rio at Wrestlemania.

 

[DB]

Someone brought up that Cabana should have come out as Punk's Jewish lawyer during the Negotiations segment.

 

[Chanandalar]

Punk has gotten Cabana over simply by mentioning his name twice