Rumoured and Confirmed signings - Part 4

[Kilkenny]

The reason it is set up how it is, is to protect the innocent. The principle is that it is better to have some guilty go free than even a single innocent locked up.

I understand and am fine with the presumption of innocence I am just not so comfortable with the assumption that just because you are found by a Judge, Magistrate or Jury to be ‘Not Guilty’ it doesn’t automatically follow you didn’t commit the crime, rather in some circumstances based on all the available evidence there may be grounds for an alternative verdict of ‘Not Proven’. There is a distinct not so subtle difference.

 

[OldPanther]

I understand and am fine with the presumption of innocence I am just not so comfortable with the assumption that just because you are found by a Judge, Magistrate or Jury to be ‘Not Guilty’ it doesn’t automatically follow you didn’t commit the crime, rather in some circumstances based on all the available evidence there may be grounds for an alternative verdict of ‘Not Proven’. There is a distinct not so subtle difference.

Yes and the difference is you get to be labelled as whatever the accusation is for the rest of your life even though it couldn't be proven. It's a nightmare of an idea.

Also It empowers false accusations to a massive degree as well.

 

[franklin2323]

He has 59 tries in 139 games = 0.43 a game

Blake has 37 tries in 95 games = 0.38 a game

Walker only has 5 tries in his last 29 games, 0.17 a game.

On top of this Walker played with a better halfback than we have.

And Blake is a much better defender. Not sure this is an upgrade.

What is the try assist difference though? This year 4-1 Walkers way.

Can't find the career but I would think atleast 2-1. So adding that too it

 

[Kilkenny]

Yes and the difference is you get to be labelled as whatever the accusation is for the rest of your life even though it couldn't be proven. It's a nightmare of an idea.

Also It empowers false accusations to a massive degree as well.

We’ll agree to disagree on the ‘doctrine of not proven”.

 

[Kilkenny]

I found it rather odd in the official press release from Panthers referring to the release of RCG the quote referring to Matt Cameron as being our General Manager.

I thought Gus held the position of General Manager and that the position was made redundant meaning it no longer exists and industrially isn’t there a statutory time period by which the position cannot be reinstated.

 

[OldPanther]

We’ll agree to disagree on the ‘doctrine of not proven”.

We'll have to. I could never agree with it and think it's unethical.

 

[franklin2323]

I found it rather odd in the official press release from Panthers referring to the release of RCG the quote referring to Matt Cameron as being our General Manager.

I thought Gus held the position of General Manager and that the position was made redundant meaning it no longer exists and industrially isn’t there a statutory time period by which the position cannot be reinstated.

Wasn't Gus General Manager of footy? A slight difference might be enough

 

[mxlegend99]

I am well aware this is a the Rumoured & Confirmed signings thread but just on the theme of signing dickheads there are degrees of criminality and to that degree what Russell Packer was convicted of and did a relatively small amount of jail time for was at the higher end of the scale. What Dylan Walker was charged with and ultimately found ‘not guilty’ was at the lower end of criminality albeit is was DV related which is not a good thing. Not making excuses for Dylan Walker but sadly the reality is some woman have the living daylights beaten out of them day in and day out. There was no suggestion of anywhere near that level of violence in the Walker situation and I think from memory he was alleged to have pushed his partner during a verbal type argument. Hopefully he learnt a valuable lesson from his experience and is a better person and husband for it.

I agree to be honest. It's not acceptable. Especially not for anyone we would want associated with our club... but it's nowhere near as bad as your usual domestic violence cases get. Although many of these cases probably start out small too.

I know a few women who have been on the receiving end of far worse than that... multiple times and while they will talk big about how much of an asshole he is, how theyre not putting up with it anymore etc. They nearly always go back to them and defend his actions as either not that bad, or an isolated incident, or even that they deserved etc. and believe it won't happen again.

Chances are we probably all know people like this... and it's infuriating how often their are no consequences for the peoole who do it... atleast not until it's too late.

 

[herbert henry1908]

What is the try assist difference though? This year 4-1 Walkers way.

Can't find the career but I would think atleast 2-1. So adding that too it

Because Walker has been playing some 5/8

If you compare them as centres there’s very little difference in attack, and Blake is clearly a better defender.

There’s no real upgrade here.

 

[Port Panther]

We have gone back to being a Parramatta junior club , they only need to enquire about one of our players and we have no issue in handing them over . How many players have been let go this season and previous to western Sydney rivals ?
But fear not everyone we have got Api coming lol and don't forget Burton will be here to carry the load . What a basket case at the moment , Cleary making Hook look like a coaching god . Penrith ''you lose , you get nothing , good day sir ! .

 

[OldPanther]

We have gone back to being a Parramatta junior club , they only need to enquire about one of our players and we have no issue in handing them over . How many players have been let go this season and previous to western Sydney rivals ?
But fear not everyone we have got Api coming lol and don't forget Burton will be here to carry the load . What a basket case at the moment , Cleary making Hook look like a coaching god . Penrith ''you lose , you get nothing , good day sir ! .

Someone might be able to correct me but it seems we needed someone to take these guys due to the salary cap.

 

[Kilkenny]

Wasn't Gus General Manager of footy? A slight difference might be enough

I think we all know they are effectively now doing the same job albeit it is a play on words and technically based on Industrial Law you can’t make someone redundant the one minute only to hire someone in the same position the next minute.

I don’t care one way or the other I just hope Matt Cameron is up to the task because we need someone with half a brain to run the football department because if O’Neill, Fletcher and Cleary are running the show we are in trouble.

 

[Kilkenny]

Someone might be able to correct me but it seems we needed someone to take these guys due to the salary cap.

That’s the ‘media spin’ being dispensed by the brains trust of O’Neill, Fletcher & Cleary.

The previous General Manager of Football assured us we were salary cap neutral through till end of 2020.

Believe who you want to believe, at the end of the day perhaps the truth lays somewhere in between the two camps.

 

[OldPanther]

That’s the ‘media spin’ being dispensed by the brains trust of O’Neill, Fletcher & Cleary.

The previous General Manager of Football assured us we were salary cap neutral through till end of 2020.

Believe who you want to believe, at the end of the day perhaps the truth lays somewhere in between the two camps.

I can't say I know where my opinion falls on this. Each scenario is possible and both parties would have reasons to fudge their stories.

 

[franklin2323]

Because Walker has been playing some 5/8

If you compare them as centres there’s very little difference in attack, and Blake is clearly a better defender.

There’s no real upgrade here.

You play 5/8th because you have skills. So he must of had a good run of try assists a few years back or why move him. I will see if Nrl.com has something from a few years back

 

[franklin2323]

That’s the ‘media spin’ being dispensed by the brains trust of O’Neill, Fletcher & Cleary.

The previous General Manager of Football assured us we were salary cap neutral through till end of 2020.

Believe who you want to believe, at the end of the day perhaps the truth lays somewhere in between the two camps.

Both can be true though. If you are happy with the squad then we probably could keep everyone... If you want some new blood then you need cap space

 

[franklin2323]

I think we all know they are effectively now doing the same job albeit it is a play on words and technically based on Industrial Law you can’t make someone redundant the one minute only to hire someone in the same position the next minute.

I don’t care one way or the other I just hope Matt Cameron is up to the task because we need someone with half a brain to run the football department because if O’Neill, Fletcher and Cleary are running the show we are in trouble.

Matt Cameron is the reason I was sure that Gus should go. Very successful with Parra and lower grade coach

 

[Kilkenny]

I can't say I know where my opinion falls on this. Each scenario is possible and both parties would have reasons to fudge their stories.

Absolutely, we’ll never know the truth.

What we do know thou, is Gus Gould was undermined in his pursuit of a new head coach after the Chairman saw fit to force the sacking of Anthony Griffin to bring his mate back. From that point forward Gould’s position at the club was untenable and it was only a matter of time before he had to leave the club. I’m surprised it took as long as it did, and dragged on into this current season.

We’ll never know for sure whether the supposed handshake deal with Wayne Bennett would have eventuated and even if it did we could never be sure whether he could have done better with our then roster he would have inherited. My gut feeling is he given his long term success as a coach he would have got more out of our squad than Ivan has and we wouldn’t be going thru the total rebuild we are now under Ivan.

Look it’s history now, but our Chairman is out of his depth and that is a fact whether you are in the Gould camp or not.

 

[Kilkenny]

Matt Cameron is the reason I was sure that Gus should go. Very successful with Parra and lower grade coach

Happy days. If he is good at what he does and make a fist of being our General Manager I will be thrilled as we all will be. We just need to accept he will not have the political clout that Gus did and therefore further funding for the likes of Stadium upgrades, continued development of our academies in Western NSW and the corporate dollars that Gus brought in may not be achieveable.

 

[Kilkenny]

Both can be true though. If you are happy with the squad then we probably could keep everyone... If you want some new blood then you need cap space

100%.

I agree DWZ, Blake, RCG and perhaps other’s were stagnating at our club and there were off field issues as well which doesn’t help so I am accepting of the fact it was probably best to let them leave and we can bring in some fresh faces.