A CC / North Shore Bears team will be a financial power houseYet you want to put a CC side in?
A CC / North Shore Bears team will be a financial power houseYet you want to put a CC side in?
Agree there has been ongoing financials issuesI think there’s a few. Corporates, is there a big enough fanbase in either of the two cities, does Australian tv want another nz club given how poorly warriors rate? There’s plenty of advantages as well but that last one will be the decider given how media still controls nrl decision making.
A CC / North Shore Bears team will be a financial power house
theres an identity to being from WA. Do people across the South Island of nz identify themselves in the same way? Not to mention theres 2.2mill in perth and 200k in rest of WA so we’re not exactly reliant on attracting people from everywhere in same way. I would not be suggesting we play games in Albany and Geraldton lol.
Sounds exactly like a "warrior", do you want another similar mascot, personally i liked the south island scorpion angle (scorpion king also played by the rock aka voice of maui)Riffing on the "Te Waipounamu" name for the South Island, what about a greenstone fish-hook as a logo motif?
It also feeds into the Maori legend that Maui (yep, same demi-God as the guy in the Moana movie) "fished up" the north island.
The North Island being Te Ika a Maui ("The fish of Maui" Wellington the head, Northland the tail - it does look like a stingray...) - and South Island being "Te Waka a Maui" - Maui's canoe in that legend.
What’s the radius of that 1mill? Time and again it shows that once you go past 40-50km fron the stadium chances of fans attending in meaningful numbers are virtually zero.On two of the positives/negatives:
Stadium: The Christchurch stadium might be years away, it's should have been done years ago. The official date has been pushed back to 2025 but with they way they're squabbling down there it will likely be later. As for the negatives of the Caketin, I actually find it pretty decent - the round shape doesn't really matter as in most areas you're actually pretty close.
Population: Wellington's population seems to be a bit underestimated in this thread. The main region totals up to about 400K and if you add in the Hurricanes boundaries then the population is reaching near 1m. The new team just needs to get that support (so basically look at what the Hurricanes do and do the opposite).
One thing they should do no matter where they are based is get Steve Tew (former NZ rugby CEO) to run it so we can try and avoid the kind of idiocy that goes on with the Warriors.
Fright hell no that gives me a frightSounds exactly like a "warrior", do you want another similar mascot, personally i liked the south island scorpion angle (scorpion king also played by the rock aka voice of maui)
Or the Southern Orcas, even Wellington Fright (bat mascot)
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Going off these projections, having a second NZ team in the south of Auckland, encompassing waikato & bay of plenty is probably the way to go
I think this is a great thread (lets hope it does not get ruined).
NZ is very interesting as there is no particular location that can you can confidentially say "yes thats it". It also presents RL with an enormous opportunity. If for example the AFL had the footprint RL has in NZ they would be milking it for every cent. AFL will probably never have that chance so it shows how much potential growth RL can have. In fact the whole of the south pacific is RL's to grow into, sort the Origin eligibility stuff and watch Fiji, Samoa, Tonga reach their true potential. Something Union in the islands would not be able to match, anyway thats another discussion.
Now in the short run the NRL along with NZRL, ARL, Warriors etc need to sort pathways/juniors. In the long run for a Kiwi team to have a better chance for success will have to include a majority of local juniors. Not all but a majority would have to be, takes away the concern of homesick Aussie's.
Having being fortunate to have spent a wee bit of time in South island (heading back to QT in the NewYear) I can't see any potential for a team at present in Christchurch. Won't have the corporate support either and just because Union seems to be a bit on the nose does not mean they will just take up supporting RL. South island will need more time but that new stadium coming can only be a positive for RL in the long run. Few clients that I know that run pretty significant businesses in South island also share the view. The Crusaders maybe the version of Storm in NZ but they are also struggling for corporate partners etc. These guys are always getting hit up to sponsor/come to events for the Crusaders.
Both the Warriors and NZRL recommend any new team in NZ to be in a different location to the Warriors. I can see the positives of 2 teams in the biggest market. Game every week during the season at the biggest market in country. However it's the set up of Auckland that discourages a second Auckland team. League is strong in the West/South of the city. As poster mentioned earlier north shore is union heartland similar to what the north shore is here in Sydney. So a team in North harbour for me would not work. Having another team at Mt Smart would cannibalise the Warrior's support.
The safest bet at present which may not the popular bet would be Wellington. Yes it may have a smaller city population than Christchurch but this potential team will be getting most of its support initially at least from the Hutt/Porirua etc.. The surrounding area's have a bigger population (Wellington Region 527K) than Christchurch and have lots of Maoris and Polynesian's and good rail links to the cake tin. I think Chalmers in his Orca's bid had plans for a training base to be located in the Hutt.
Anyway an interesting discussion good to get the input from Kiwi's too.
That’s what lead me to start this thread, a lot of talk about NZ2 but everyone seems to have a different idea on what the best model is. There is no slam dunk solution and I don’t think if the “heartland” guaranteed success option that some people seem to think it is as opposed to Perth (without getting in to that argument).
Timing will be interesting, if Perth get team 18 then Auckland 2 could be an option if Warriors really excel in the meantime. Likewise if some grassroots work is done in Christchurch and Wellington it would improve their chances of being viable. It will be interesting to see if the NRL put their money where there mouth is after promising to go after Union in NZ.
I would love to see NZ 2 and even 3 down the line. Honestly if we are going to grow the game per se, there isn’t really great options in Australia outside of Perth (Adelaide yes but I think I’d prefer a relocation, Brisbane 3 maybe, Melbourne 2 not really) and the economies in other Pacific countries are just not there. The challenges will be great - (where do you put the extra team or teams, would they have enough corporate support) but there is potential
Agree with that, if NRL was to really take off in NZ I don’t think 3 is out of the question in the medium/long term. Slightly OT but having a ‘NZ Cup’ to run alongside NSW & QLD Cups would be great one day but would require a lot of work & investment to get there obviously.
the biggest issue I can see is the $’s. It’s getting increasingly expensive to run an nrl club, and even with a significantly increased grant clubs are now expected to spend millions on development, womens development etc etc. we are at the point where clubs need to be able to generate around $15-20mill from football operations and any other sources, mostly still pokies for Australian clubs.
this cost will exclude lots of options where there isnt a signifcant fanbase and corporate level of support (or a pokie den).
not sure what the nrl can do about that other than either adopt the afl grant system or somehow cap overall expenditure of clubs to slow down the arms race. If they do that it would open up a lot more options to be viable.
The NRL will need a minimum of 4/5 clubs if they are serious about having anything more than a token presence in the NZ market. Exactly how you’d spread those 3/4 new clubs is debatable (though Christchurch and Wellington would be a given), but 4/5 is the minimum you’d need to achieve anything close to market coverage in NZ.Agree with that, if NRL was to really take off in NZ I don’t think 3 is out of the question in the medium/long term. Slightly OT but having a ‘NZ Cup’ to run alongside NSW & QLD Cups would be great one day but would require a lot of work & investment to get there obviously.
Nz2 rank far ahead of Perth on just about all metricsThat’s what lead me to start this thread, a lot of talk about NZ2 but everyone seems to have a different idea on what the best model is. There is no slam dunk solution and I don’t think if the “heartland” guaranteed success option that some people seem to think it is as opposed to Perth (without getting in to that argument).
Timing will be interesting, if Perth get team 18 then Auckland 2 could be an option if Warriors really excel in the meantime. Likewise if some grassroots work is done in Christchurch and Wellington it would improve their chances of being viable. It will be interesting to see if the NRL put their money where there mouth is after promising to go after Union in NZ.