2010 Crowd Watch

[big_matt]

View attachment 2352


Wouldn't exactly call that 'no change' (especially if you take '95 out).

The total crowd figures are very misleading (given that new teams have been added in recent years etc which add to the totals). Average attendance at games are the best indicator, and looking at the figures I dont see a significant shift for a long long time (maybe a thousand or two either way).

Not convinced by the 05 "sydney teams were doing well" argument either. One of the GF teams was from townsville, a smaller market.

Anyway I'll rest my arguement there, because I just dont see in the figures a significant crowd improvement over the last 15 years but other people do. It's all valid though.

 

[DINGb@T]

Wouldn't turn my nose up at that either...

 

[big_matt]

By the way average crowd the year before super league was 11,400. Av crowd the year after (98) was 11,000, which is very little change. Two years after super league (99), the av crowd had jumped to 14,000 (almost 3k more than the year before superleague).

So I still don't think super league drove that many people away (or not as many as the media would have you believe). The effect it has was obviously the administration struggle which I accept crowds would be affected slightly in the years going forward.

 

[big_matt]

View attachment 2353

Wouldn't turn my nose up at that either...

That graph says that in the last 15 years (timeframe I referenced in my posts) crowds have gone from over 14k to just under 16k, including a drop for 3 of the last 4 years after 05. Again, I don't see that as a huge jump. If anyone thinks that is a huge jump I respect their opinions though.

I'd like to see that graph go from 0 on the y axis though. It only ranges from about 12k at the bottom to 16k. It does show the big jump in crowds straight after superleague though, when supposedly half the fans had stopped going to games.

 

[Moffo]

stfu timmy

i think people are spanking their rods a bit with predictions for the dogs and cronulla games. can't see them getting near what some people are suggesting

 

[Timmah]

By the way average crowd the year before super league was 11,400. Av crowd the year after (98) was 11,000, which is very little change. Two years after super league (99), the av crowd had jumped to 14,000 (almost 3k more than the year before superleague).

It's quite clear you're here as an AFL advocate.

Your background knowledge of league is laughable given you're referencing 97-98 crowds in relation to SL. While 97 was the year SL's comp took place, the s**t hit the fan in 1995 when they announced it. That is where the drop occured in crowds, not in 1997-98 as you've stated.

If you think league crowds aren't steadily increasing then it's clear what your purpose is here. And if it's what I think it is, don't let the door hit your arse on the way out.

 

[Perth Red]

Alot has to do with our inability to control the media imo. Why did the Eels game get so many? Because the newspapers hyped it up as a must attend event. Until we can get them back on side and getting joe public excited about RL little will change.

Also it seems Sydney folk are a bit more apathetic about attending games week in week out than other cities for a variety of reasons, I'm sure and given that is where majority of our clubs are this also impacts.

Would be interesting to do a survey of people who claim to be fans but don't attend games as to why. Might give some evidence that we can then use to change things around.

 

[Moffo]

i dont go as much as id like because:

a) its so f**king expensive
b) i hate to say this, but the atmsophere at your average game is not always super. i am not talking about our big/showcase games....but i think the NRL could do a lot more at times to turn your week in and week out game into an event

 

[elbusto]

That graph says that in the last 15 years (timeframe I referenced in my posts) crowds have gone from over 14k to just under 16k, including a drop for 3 of the last 4 years after 05. Again, I don't see that as a huge jump. If anyone thinks that is a huge jump I respect their opinions though.

I'd like to see that graph go from 0 on the y axis though. It only ranges from about 12k at the bottom to 16k. It does show the big jump in crowds straight after superleague though, when supposedly half the fans had stopped going to games.

AFL troll - all of them are obsessed with attendance figures - you stick our like a very sore thumb.

 

[big_matt]

It's quite clear you're here as an AFL advocate.

Your background knowledge of league is laughable given you're referencing 97-98 crowds in relation to SL. While 97 was the year SL's comp took place, the s**t hit the fan in 1995 when they announced it. That is where the drop occured in crowds, not in 1997-98 as you've stated.

If you think league crowds aren't steadily increasing then it's clear what your purpose is here. And if it's what I think it is, don't let the door hit your arse on the way out.

So it seems like on these boards you aren't allowed an opinion if its not what you agree with? I never said crowds didnt decrease in 95. I was just pointing out (with FACTS) that crowds bounced back straight after super league finished.

I'm not an AFL fan. Can't stand the sport. But I also can't stand people in league sticking their heads in the sand and claiming everything to do with league is amazing or exceptional. The way the game is run has major flaws. To me, going from 14,300 to 16,000 in just over 15 years is not significant crowd increases at all. Again, if you think that's a massive achievement in 15 years then fair play. I don't.

Is anyone allowed to express valid concerns about our game on here? Seems like unless you are jumping up and down saying "aren't league crowds impressive" then you must be an AFL fan.

Its laughable that a "moderator" tells you to leave the boards if you argue based on facts that crowds havent seen a substantial improvement. Hilarious.

 

[Timmah]

So it seems like on these boards you aren't allowed an opinion if its not what you agree with? I never said crowds didnt decrease in 95. I was just pointing out (with FACTS) that crowds bounced back straight after super league finished.

I'm not an AFL fan. Can't stand the sport. But I also can't stand people in league sticking their heads in the sand and claiming everything to do with league is amazing or exceptional. The way the game is run has major flaws. To me, going from 14,300 to 16,000 in just over 15 years is not significant crowd increases at all. Again, if you think that's a massive achievement in 15 years then fair play. I don't.

Is anyone allowed to express valid concerns about our game on here? Seems like unless you are jumping up and down saying "aren't league crowds impressive" then you must be an AFL fan.

Its laughable that a "moderator" tells you to leave the boards if you argue based on facts that crowds havent seen a substantial improvement. Hilarious.

:lol: Playing the opinion card again. You're allowed to say what you like, I'm allowed to disagree with it. And another moderator swipe? Play the ball not the man if you think the facts are on your side.

The reason I've taken you on is because I've found you to lack a bit of education on the history of RL given you wish to pass comment on its success or failure in the crowd department. This was evidenced in you saying 96-98 crowds weren't that different before the jump up in 1999, completely ignoring the 1995 increase which defied the point you were trying to make about "SL not really driving people away".

I'm a huge league supporter (as you might have guessed), and I can tell you unequivocally that I don't think league's crowds are amazing OR exceptional, but they are steadily improving. It's not an overnight process and there's no single correct way to go about it either.

No-one said anything about not voicing concern. Your overwhelming negativity is where myself and one or two others are taking issue - fostering a negative attitude about the current situation definitely isn't the way to improve things, I know that much.

 

[big_matt]

:lol: Playing the opinion card again. You're allowed to say what you like, I'm allowed to disagree with it. And another moderator swipe? Play the ball not the man if you think the facts are on your side.

The reason I've taken you on is because I've found you to lack a bit of education on the history of RL given you wish to pass comment on its success or failure in the crowd department. This was evidenced in you saying 96-98 crowds weren't that different before the jump up in 1999, completely ignoring the 1995 increase which defied the point you were trying to make about "SL not really driving people away".

I'm a huge league supporter (as you might have guessed), and I can tell you unequivocally that I don't think league's crowds are amazing OR exceptional, but they are steadily improving. It's not an overnight process and there's no single correct way to go about it either.

No-one said anything about not voicing concern. Your overwhelming negativity is where myself and one or two others are taking issue - fostering a negative attitude about the current situation definitely isn't the way to improve things, I know that much.

ok it seems you have decided my league education isn't good enough. I'll have to take that on board as you've also decided you know more. I never mentioned anything about what happened in 95 but you have stated that I did and that I am wrong about the reasons for it (despite the fact I didnt state any reasons for that year).

The point I made was that with crowds taking a huge jump in 98, clearly there were not thousands and thousands of people who left the game for good. If anything, the figures indicate crowds went up a bit straight away after all the turmoil over the few years struggle. I stand by that, and it's why I don't see superleague as the reason crowds didnt increase significantly over the last decade.

The fact crowds went down in 2 of the last 4 years says to me they are not 'steadily improving' by any definition. I'd love to see a 20k average as much as anyone but we wont get there unless we look at why we've never really seen an uptake in numbers and what we can do to address that.

Again, I am a full storm member and have been for years. So why are you painting me as an AFL fan that hates league and wants to see league fail?

 

[elbusto]

ok it seems you have decided my league education isn't good enough. I'll have to take that on board as you've also decided you know more. I never mentioned anything about what happened in 95 but you have stated that I did and that I am wrong about the reasons for it (despite the fact I didnt state any reasons for that year).

The point I made was that with crowds taking a huge jump in 98, clearly there were not thousands and thousands of people who left the game for good. If anything, the figures indicate crowds went up a bit straight away after all the turmoil over the few years struggle. I stand by that, and it's why I don't see superleague as the reason crowds didnt increase significantly over the last decade.

The fact crowds went down in 2 of the last 4 years says to me they are not 'steadily improving' by any definition. I'd love to see a 20k average as much as anyone but we wont get there unless we look at why we've never really seen an uptake in numbers and what we can do to address that.

Again, I am a full storm member and have been for years. So why are you painting me as an AFL fan that hates league and wants to see league fail?

BS - you are an AFL troll. Its obvious. Oh by the way I am Mohammed Ali as much as you are a member of the Melbourne Storm.

We have seen your likes too many times before.

 

[Timmah]

ok it seems you have decided my league education isn't good enough. I'll have to take that on board as you've also decided you know more. I never mentioned anything about what happened in 95 but you have stated that I did and that I am wrong about the reasons for it (despite the fact I didnt state any reasons for that year).

The point I made was that with crowds taking a huge jump in 98, clearly there were not thousands and thousands of people who left the game for good. If anything, the figures indicate crowds went up a bit straight away after all the turmoil over the few years struggle. I stand by that, and it's why I don't see superleague as the reason crowds didnt increase significantly over the last decade.[/QUOTE]

The whole point is that 95 is where the decline started and as such statistics relating to that year MUST be used in the assessment of crowd figures. To NOT do that is indicating a lack of education about the history of Super League and everything that surrounded it.

The fact crowds went down in 2 of the last 4 years says to me they are not 'steadily improving' by any definition. I'd love to see a 20k average as much as anyone but we wont get there unless we look at why we've never really seen an uptake in numbers and what we can do to address that.

Then put forward a suggestion instead of engaging in negative and attacking opinions on the code!

Again, I am a full storm member and have been for years. So why are you painting me as an AFL fan that hates league and wants to see league fail?

I haven't mentioned AFL since before you indicated you don't like AFL, again, don't lie.

 

[clarency]

ok it seems you have decided my league education isn't good enough. I'll have to take that on board as you've also decided you know more. I never mentioned anything about what happened in 95 but you have stated that I did and that I am wrong about the reasons for it (despite the fact I didnt state any reasons for that year).

The point I made was that with crowds taking a huge jump in 98, clearly there were not thousands and thousands of people who left the game for good. If anything, the figures indicate crowds went up a bit straight away after all the turmoil over the few years struggle. I stand by that, and it's why I don't see superleague as the reason crowds didnt increase significantly over the last decade.

The fact crowds went down in 2 of the last 4 years says to me they are not 'steadily improving' by any definition. I'd love to see a 20k average as much as anyone but we wont get there unless we look at why we've never really seen an uptake in numbers and what we can do to address that.

Your problem is that a negative attitude is one of the larger problems in what can slow down any league.

While a sensible and intelligent approach is always the best qualities to have... might being positive be another?

 

[big_matt]

Your problem is that a negative attitude is one of the larger problems in what can slow down any league.

While a sensible and intelligent approach is always the best qualities to have... might being positive be another?

I accept being negative doesn't help, and I am not trying to be overly down on the code (although I accept it has clearly come across that way in my posts). I just don't see the need to get excited about something that to me is not there.

When I look at the crowd figures I can't see great improvement. That's the only point im really making. If there was real significant improvement there I'd be as excited as anyone else, and if the crowds start to rise now year on year then I'll be very happy.

 

[Timmah]

I think a lot of people are just excited about the quality of the league at the moment and some of the epic crowds we had last year by our own standards - do you have any idea how much hype the Dogs/Eels prelim generated last year?

 

[big_matt]

I think a lot of people are just excited about the quality of the league at the moment and some of the epic crowds we had last year by our own standards - do you have any idea how much hype the Dogs/Eels prelim generated last year?

I do, and I was asking earlier in the thread how we can get those 80k people to turn up week and week out. That would be fantastic for the game.

I also think its great people are getting excited. The quality is exceptional, and I don't take it for granted the players I get to watch week in week out at the storm.

Let's call a truce though mate. I don't see a significant crowd improvement and you do. I think the a-league is poor quality and you don't. All good though.

 

[big_matt]

BS - you are an AFL troll. Its obvious. Oh by the way I am Mohammed Ali as much as you are a member of the Melbourne Storm.

We have seen your likes too many times before.

Check the thread history on here. There are plenty posts by me just after I came back from supporting Storm at the grand final. Here is an example:

http://forums.leagueunlimited.com/showthread.php?t=346709

There are also a few threads where you are agreeing with me and quote my posts on why storm is important for the NRL, like this one:

http://forums.leagueunlimited.com/showthread.php?t=346709&page=10

But yea, all part of my plan to fool people that I'm not an AFL fan :lol:

 

[RufusRex]

Eels vs Dragons, Parramatta: 17000
Broncos vs Cowboys, Suncorp: 28000
Bulldogs vs Knights, ANZ: 14500
Sharks vs Storm, Toyota: 6000
Panthers vs Raiders, CUA: 15500
Titans vs Warriors, Skilled: 17000
Rabbitohs vs Roosters, ANZ: 21000
Tigers vs Sea Eagles, SFS: 13000