2014 Playing Roster

[Gary Gutful]

I don't think he crowds the halves, I think it's more so been the fact not just the halves but everyone thinks s**t I've got nothing here, I'll give it to Jarryd to try and create some magic.

Exactly. At times we look like an under 8s team handing the ball to our best player. It must give Jarryd the squirts.

 

[Pazza]

We'll lose a fullback for the third year in a row if Hayne is allowed to play wherever he wants. If he wants to play fullback then he shouldn't crowd the halves.

We haven't had a fullback for a while now because we haven't had the class in the halves to use a good fullback and we have no running threats on the edges to manipulate the defensive line. That might change this year with Norman, Tanginoa and Edwards.

But I can still see hayne's ball playing ability being a huge benefit to this football team. Especially on long shifts from one side of the field to the other with Hayne coming in as 2nd or 3rd receiver with options to run, kick, pass etc play wat he sees.

 

[spiderdan]

I don't think speed over more than forty metres is that important anyway. Sometimes it comes up and looks impressive but even for outside backs there are more important qualities than 100m speed.

I reckon Smith is still quick over 40m, at least for a second rower. Otherwise he would never have played centre in the NRL.

i think he's so-so speed wise and a bit better than so-so for a second rower (even over 40m).

being as good a one on one defender as he is (i'd say easily in the top 3-5 in the nrl) he is worth giving a starting spot to but he hasn't been able to hit the ball at any speed running at half gaps for a long while now. the bloke is a freakin juggernaut and should be able to at least dent a defensive line and be able to get an offload or two away each game. if he played to his potential and strenghts he'd be a possible origin selection. unfortunately in offence he doesn't play the way he could.

 

[The EELiminator]

he hasn't been able to hit the ball at any speed running at half gaps for a long while now

nobody in our team has been able to hit the ball at speed for a long while now because its either been thrown over their head or at their bootlaces or the ball took so long to get to them the defence was in their face befure they caught it

 

[lingard]

I think that will be the best approach to try and get as much go-forward as possible.

I don't think Sandow or Kelly are capable of handling half of the ball-playing duties and I don't want to see our fullback come in and be a ball-player any more, it's hindered our attack for far too long and the ways to combat this is to either: Move Hayne in the halves, but that has been shunned by Arthur stating that Hayne will play fullback so the only other option is to have a predominantly ball-playing forward on the field.

As for your Peats in Origin quote. You're either being extremely optimistic OR you're saying that Foran will never play.

If Norman is as good as I think he is, and either Sandow or Kelly play well enough, Hayne won't need to come in much at all. He's been doing it through necessity I think. Because our halves have been shit for the past four or so years. You don't see Hayne 'crowding' the halves when he plays rep football. Because he doesn't have to.

 

[phantom eel]

Yep. If for some reason you're not seeing much ball during a game, talented players/high-earners will naturally come in from their backline positions to get more involved in the play.

It may not have only been due to poor halves - the dummy half service may also be a factor in quality ball never really getting out to centres, wingers, and fullback. It will be interesting to see if Peats can be an improvement on Keating there, or whether that might have been more a factor of continued poor go forward among the forwards? Either way, hopefully it's been fixed and we can see some improvement this season.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

It may not have only been due to poor halves - the dummy half service may also be a factor in quality ball never really getting out to centres, wingers, and fullback. It will be interesting to see if Peats can be an improvement on Keating there, or whether that might have been more a factor of continued poor go forward among the forwards? Either way, hopefully it's been fixed and we can see some improvement this season.

I think dummy half would have been a massive factor, and not necessarily because Keating couldn't pass long from the ground (because he could).

The reason our backs have had no room is because our forwards haven't been rolling the defensive line backwards. I think a big reason for this is that the teams with the best go forward make use of option runners off the dummy half, and ours (Keating) hasn't been able to play that style - committing the markers and hitting the right runner.

I actually think Keating had a decent running game, but the role of the hooker has moved away from a bloke who just runs the ball when there's an opportunity and otherwise just passes to the halfback. These days the hooker needs to be a playmaker and he needs to be engaging defenders (usually the markers) on just about every tackle.

 

[The Elephant In The room]

If Norman is as good as I think he is, and either Sandow or Kelly play well enough, Hayne won't need to come in much at all. He's been doing it through necessity I think. Because our halves have been shit for the past four or so years. You don't see Hayne 'crowding' the halves when he plays rep football. Because he doesn't have to.

Some of that is because he's usually catching a cold on the wing.

 

[oldmancraigy]

I think dummy half would have been a massive factor, and not necessarily because Keating couldn't pass long from the ground (because he could).

The reason our backs have had no room is because our forwards haven't been rolling the defensive line backwards. I think a big reason for this is that the teams with the best go forward make use of option runners off the dummy half, and ours (Keating) hasn't been able to play that style - committing the markers and hitting the right runner.

I actually think Keating had a decent running game, but the role of the hooker has moved away from a bloke who just runs the ball when there's an opportunity and otherwise just passes to the halfback. These days the hooker needs to be a playmaker and he needs to be engaging defenders (usually the markers) on just about every tackle.

Keating was fairly instrumental in stopping any roll forward our props might have otherwise been achieving.

Sure, he could pass long from the ground, but not with any pace, and with little accuracy.
Because his passing wasn't great, he got into the habit of standing up before passing - which stops forwards in their tracks.
And because he got into the habit, he then got into the habit of taking a couple of steps before passing, so that he could get a bit more power into his pass. Which gave the defence time to get up in the grill of the halves.
And because he was so slow, his running game was easily nullified by 1 marker, giving the other marker the chance to attack the close runners, stopping the forwards in their tracks yet again.


There's a very good reason that, at just 27 years of age, and being an excellent defender, Matt Keating isn't playing either FG in Australia, nor Superleague in England. He chokes an attack to death.

 

[yy_cheng]

Keating was fairly instrumental in stopping any roll forward our props might have otherwise been achieving.

Sure, he could pass long from the ground, but not with any pace, and with little accuracy.
Because his passing wasn't great, he got into the habit of standing up before passing - which stops forwards in their tracks.
And because he got into the habit, he then got into the habit of taking a couple of steps before passing, so that he could get a bit more power into his pass. Which gave the defence time to get up in the grill of the halves.
And because he was so slow, his running game was easily nullified by 1 marker, giving the other marker the chance to attack the close runners, stopping the forwards in their tracks yet again.


There's a very good reason that, at just 27 years of age, and being an excellent defender, Matt Keating isn't playing either FG in Australia, nor Superleague in England. He chokes an attack to death.

This. Am so glad he is gone

 

[I bleed blue & gold]

Keating was fairly instrumental in stopping any roll forward our props might have otherwise been achieving.

Sure, he could pass long from the ground, but not with any pace, and with little accuracy.
Because his passing wasn't great, he got into the habit of standing up before passing - which stops forwards in their tracks.
And because he got into the habit, he then got into the habit of taking a couple of steps before passing, so that he could get a bit more power into his pass. Which gave the defence time to get up in the grill of the halves.
And because he was so slow, his running game was easily nullified by 1 marker, giving the other marker the chance to attack the close runners, stopping the forwards in their tracks yet again.


There's a very good reason that, at just 27 years of age, and being an excellent defender, Matt Keating isn't playing either FG in Australia, nor Superleague in England. He chokes an attack to death.

Well said, OMC.

 

[Eelementary]

If Norman is as good as I think he is, and either Sandow or Kelly play well enough, Hayne won't need to come in much at all. He's been doing it through necessity I think. Because our halves have been shit for the past four or so years. You don't see Hayne 'crowding' the halves when he plays rep football. Because he doesn't have to.

For what it's worth, I agree with this.

 

[Eelementary]

Keating was fairly instrumental in stopping any roll forward our props might have otherwise been achieving.

Sure, he could pass long from the ground, but not with any pace, and with little accuracy.
Because his passing wasn't great, he got into the habit of standing up before passing - which stops forwards in their tracks.
And because he got into the habit, he then got into the habit of taking a couple of steps before passing, so that he could get a bit more power into his pass. Which gave the defence time to get up in the grill of the halves.
And because he was so slow, his running game was easily nullified by 1 marker, giving the other marker the chance to attack the close runners, stopping the forwards in their tracks yet again.


There's a very good reason that, at just 27 years of age, and being an excellent defender, Matt Keating isn't playing either FG in Australia, nor Superleague in England. He chokes an attack to death.

I tend to agree.

Matt Keating is a wonderful bloke and a tough defender, but he had many glaring issues in his technique that stunted our attack.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

It was neither his passing technique nor his foot speed that brought Keating undone - it was his lack of speed between the ears.

 

[Eels Dude]

It was neither his passing technique nor his foot speed that brought Keating undone - it was his lack of speed between the ears.

This is pretty much true too. Too many times he would pass left when he should have been passing right which stunted the attack, and too many times he would do his double pump and take an absolute age just to pass to front rower to hit the ball up.

 

[spiderdan]

mk also wasn't helped during his time by many of our forwards standing flat footed waiting for the ball instead of running onto passes. plenty of times we were sacrificing 2-3m on plays as well as a quick play the ball from forwards standing there like they were in u7s being handed the ball before they would run.

 

[Eelementary]

It was neither his passing technique nor his foot speed that brought Keating undone - it was his lack of speed between the ears.

I agree with you.

On many occasions, I saw Matt Keating make the wrong decision. He didn't seem able to count the numbers and make the right decisions.

I also saw him throw some good, long passes straight off the ground.

But he was inconsistent and it cost us.

 

[The Elephant In The room]

It was neither his passing technique nor his foot speed that brought Keating undone - it was his lack of speed between the ears.

I don't know if it was his own decision or a coaching plan, but I thought over the last couple of years that MK tried to model his game more and more on Cam Smiths game, with the shuffle out of dummy half to try and interest some defenders. Done right, it's much better than simply passing off the ground, but MK didn't have the awareness or the skill to make the right decision and hit the right ball runner.

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

It was neither his passing technique nor his foot speed that brought Keating undone - it was his lack of speed between the ears.

I dunno. Maybe he had some great mental reactions, but just couldn't convince any part of his body to act in accordance.....

Seriously, though I suspect that he's a little short in each of the attributes have mentioned (except defence). Add these together and that's why he just doesn't quite cut it. You get away with ordinary foot speed for instance, if you excel in other areas, but he didn't excel in any, though I think he was 'competent' in most.

 

[Avenger]

Matt Keating is a very decent man. Incidentally his brother is too. However they were the most overrated brothers to play for our club since the Emery brothers. Many will say what about the Witt brothers? Well Steve never played first grade. The closest was the old 7's tournament. Michael was just ok and never really rated that high. That is why we cut his contract short and released him to Manly.