2019 Discussion

[OldPanther]

He’s kicked one 40/20 since 2016.

His kicking game is bomb after bomb, and they tend not to produce anything. His short kicking is almost non existent.

Now I’m willing to give the benefit of the doubt that this may be because of Hook, but it couldn’t be described as amazing.

It's clearly changed since Griffin left. We've seen it.

 

[franklin2323]

Cleary has an amazing kicking game. Can kick a 40/20. Has great length. Control. I'm not sure what's missing.

https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nr...category=kicking&sortBy=kickMetres&isAvg=true

Compare Maloney to Cleary. Both NSW halves both had the Griffin coaching.

Maloney more kicks a game ave. More forced line drop outs, More forced dropouts. Same ave kicks dead so far more work to do...but got 13 years to get there

 

[OldPanther]

https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nr...category=kicking&sortBy=kickMetres&isAvg=true

Compare Maloney to Cleary. Both NSW halves both had the Griffin coaching.

Maloney more kicks a game ave. More forced line drop outs, More forced dropouts. Same ave kicks dead so far more work to do...but got 13 years to get there

I would expect that considering who Maloney is. You don't put preference on your 20 year old over the 30 year old multiple premiership winner.

 

[billypilgrimnz]

That changed after Griffin was sacked. Someone posted the stats on his repeat sets and his strike rate has gone up massively and now they kick early a bit more and into corners etc.

That doesn't make an "amazing" kicking game. At all. In fact, I don't see much in Cleary's game that I would describe as "amazing"; the closest would probably be his defending, which is close to amazing for a half. The rest is shades of okay to solid.

 

[herbert henry1908]

Matty Johns turned Cronk into the half back he is today. Melbourne recruited him as a winger.

Johns said from his 1st meeting with Cronk that he “Wasn’t the most talented player” but he had an unbelievable work ethic and drive to be better.

Now he sees the same traits in Nathan only he’s “A huge talent”.

Now, I’m not saying that you and Unima aren’t amazing judges, but, I’ll take his and every other “actual experts” opinion over yours.

If Johns opinion was worth much then other experts would echo it. No one is mad enough to suggest he’ll be better than Cronk, other than Matt Johns.

I’m dubious about the claim of Cronk being recruited as a winger, where’d you hear that? I know he played inside centre in RU, but inside centre is like a second 5/8 in rugby.

 

[franklin2323]

He’s on an upgraded deal next year. The point is he’ll be under more scrutiny now he’s signed a big deal.

So he should be but so is Hunt, DCE etc it goes with the territory. The new deal doesn't mean he will suddenly play better. If he is the same by year 3 of 6 then we have issues

 

[herbert henry1908]

It's clearly changed since Griffin left. We've seen it.

It’s changed, but not enough to be described as amazing.

I’ll consider his kicking game to be good if he can reproduce it over a whole season.

 

[franklin2323]

I would expect that considering who Maloney is. You don't put preference on your 20 year old over the 30 year old multiple premiership winner.

nor should we but you also can't judge on what isn't there. So far he is very promising I'd rather have him then not but not at the level of some others

 

[OldPanther]

That doesn't make an "amazing" kicking game. At all. In fact, I don't see much in Cleary's game that I would describe as "amazing"; the closest would probably be his defending, which is close to amazing for a half. The rest is shades of okay to solid.

There isn't much in his game I'd call above average but his kicking is one.

 

[herbert henry1908]

So he should be but so is Hunt, DCE etc it goes with the territory. The new deal doesn't mean he will suddenly play better. If he is the same by year 3 of 6 then we have issues

Of course, my point is that people have lower expectations when there’s less scrutiny. Fan opinion of him will change unless he produces more now he’s on a big deal.

 

[OldPanther]

Of course, my point is that people have lower expectations when there’s less scrutiny. Fan opinion of him will change unless he produces more now he’s on a big deal.

So it should. Now that he's signed this he has to become the dominant half in my opinion.

 

[herbert henry1908]

I would expect that considering who Maloney is. You don't put preference on your 20 year old over the 30 year old multiple premiership winner.

Cleary was preferenced early in the season. Then I’d say Hook saw Maloney was better.

 

[OldPanther]

Cleary was preferenced early in the season. Then I’d say Hook saw Maloney was better.

After Nathan was injured it never went back. Can only venture as guess as to why. He didn't even take the goal kicking back straight away.

 

[unKwn]

If Johns opinion was worth much then other experts would echo it. No one is mad enough to suggest he’ll be better than Cronk, other than Matt Johns.

I’m dubious about the claim of Cronk being recruited as a winger, where’d you hear that? I know he played inside centre in RU, but inside centre is like a second 5/8 in rugby.

someone after the roosters Rabbitohs game on tv was praising Cronk saying something along the lines of "he started off as a winger of the bench" I'm pretty sure that's what they said

 

[herbert henry1908]

someone after the roosters Rabbitohs game on tv was praising Cronk saying something along the lines of "he started off as a winger of the bench" I'm pretty sure that's what they said

Well wingers aren’t really carried on the bench very often.

FWIW it says on his wiki that he started as an interchange utility. That seems more likely to me.

 

[herbert henry1908]

After Nathan was injured it never went back. Can only venture as guess as to why. He didn't even take the goal kicking back straight away.

When Nathan was injured our kicking game improved dramatically. Either Maloney wasn’t following Hooks game plan or Hook never instructed Cleary to kick a certain way.

I remember the Cownboys game in Townsville, Maloney put on a masterclass.

 

[Kilkenny]

I have no doubt Nathan Cleary will improve considerably in the next season or two and we will see a more complete player. Not likely to be a future immortal but will be invaluable for us in the next few seasons.

Like all half backs he needs the forward pack to do there job so hopefully our first choice forwards have a strong off season and are fit & ready to go in 2019.

 

[OldPanther]

When Nathan was injured our kicking game improved dramatically. Either Maloney wasn’t following Hooks game plan or Hook never instructed Cleary to kick a certain way.

I remember the Cownboys game in Townsville, Maloney put on a masterclass.

Yet you've said Nathan is the type of player to follow the coach's instructions. I think it's more likely Maloney has his own way of playing after being at 5 clubs and as experienced as he is.

 

[Kev07]

You can’t use a small sample to prove much. We need to see more to describe it as amazing.

Same could be said for Luai if most are pinning their hopes on 1 outstanding game he had

 

[OldPanther]

He has started better than Cronk did. The only question is the quality of development and work ethic. Recency bias is at play here I reckon. Cronk wasn't anything special when he started.