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2019 Federal Election

Gronk

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77,904
Well Independents are free to vote for what they like on any given legislation. Hence why they're called Independents I guess. On the opposite side of the scale, Labor would never vote for the Coalition to form Government, but they vote with them plenty of times on various legislation.

I was referring to who they would choose to form a Government only, which is what I thought the premise of your question was.

Well the process that ensued to form the Gillard Government when it fell 72/72 at the election meant that 4 crossbenchers were needed to guarantee supply. Of the six independents, only two sided with the LNP and only won of the 4 that went with Gillard was a Green. It was Wilkie, Oakshot and Windsor that allowed the GIllard to take the gig. The latter two being discontent former Nationals.

This current Government has burned many bridges to this point. Nobody should count their chickens before they hatch.
 

Chipmunk

Coach
Messages
17,409
Well the process that ensued to form the Gillard Government when it fell 72/72 at the election meant that 4 crossbenchers were needed to guarantee supply. Of the six independents, only two sided with the LNP and only won of the 4 that went with Gillard was a Green. It was Wilkie, Oakshot and Windsor that allowed the GIllard to take the gig. The latter two being discontent former Nationals.

This current Government has burned many bridges to this point. Nobody should count their chickens before they hatch.

Oakeshott and Windsor both learnt the hard way what happens when you decide to choose the other mob who 80 per cent of your electorate would never consider voting for. The same would happen to Katter, Sharkie and Phelps if they decided to vote in a Labor Government very much against their Electorates wishes. I'd suggest if Wilkie voted in a Coalition Government he'd be in the same boat.Katter was smart enough to know this, which is why he is still around and Oakeshott and Windsor were sent packing. Of course if you only want the job for three years and then get out, it wont matter too much.
 

Gronk

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77,904
Oakeshott and Windsor both learnt the hard way what happens when you decide to choose the other mob who 80 per cent of your electorate would never consider voting for. The same would happen to Katter, Sharkie and Phelps if they decided to vote in a Labor Government very much against their Electorates wishes. I'd suggest if Wilkie voted in a Coalition Government he'd be in the same boat.Katter was smart enough to know this, which is why he is still around and Oakeshott and Windsor were sent packing. Of course if you only want the job for three years and then get out, it wont matter too much.
Not sure what you mean by choosing the other mob, as they were both independents in the 2010 election. Oakeshott had been an independent since 2002 and Windsor since1991.

I think you are underestimating the electorate these days. My electorate (Phelps) and Warringah if Steggal wins are seen as a breath of fresh air. The sensible centre cutting through the engrained agendas that come with the coalition. These small L liberals are emerging as viable independents to the traditional blue ribbon electorates. Accordingly there would be zero backlash for these ladies if they had to side with labor to form a government. Having said that, whilst they would guarantee supply, labor wont get dodgy laws through if they need their support.

Anywhoo, could all be a moot point if labor wins by 12 seats as current polling suggests. Then we’ll all be talking about the senate. Half of them are up for re-election. So from 1July we could have a vastly different looking senate.

https://www.aph.gov.au/Senators_and_Members/Senators/Senators_by_service_expiry_date
 

Chipmunk

Coach
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17,409
Not sure what you mean by choosing the other mob, as they were both independents in the 2010 election. Oakeshott had been an independent since 2002 and Windsor since1991.

I think you are underestimating the electorate these days. My electorate (Phelps) and Warringah if Steggal wins are seen as a breath of fresh air. The sensible centre cutting through the engrained agendas that come with the coalition. These small L liberals are emerging as viable independents to the traditional blue ribbon electorates. Accordingly there would be zero backlash for these ladies if they had to side with labor to form a government. Having said that, whilst they would guarantee supply, labor wont get dodgy laws through if they need their support.

Anywhoo, could all be a moot point if labor wins by 12 seats as current polling suggests. Then we’ll all be talking about the senate. Half of them are up for re-election. So from 1July we could have a vastly different looking senate.

https://www.aph.gov.au/Senators_and_Members/Senators/Senators_by_service_expiry_date

What I mean in the Oakeshot and Windsor case is that less than 20 per cent of their two electorates voted Labor or another left leaning candidate. I think it was 12% in one of those electorates . They were staunch conservative seats and 80 odd per cent of voters clearly didnt want Labor being in Government. Both electorates clearly benefited under a Labor Government, but the electors in those two electorates clearly weren't pleased with Oakeshot and Windors choice.

I agree with you that Wentworth is definitely a bit different and I'd probably say that they wouldn't be too fussed if Phelps chose Labor to form Government unlike the other electorates that I mentioned.

I don't think Zali Steggal is a snowballs chance in hell of winning Warringah. I wouldnt take too much notice of 'opinion polls' arranged by GetUp that's for sure.

We're still 4 weeks away from the election and anything could happen, but I'd be surprised if Labor didn't win. It's theirs to lose. However, I expect the 'expert polls' to close considerably to almost 50/50 come election time. I don't expect it to be that close though.

With redistributions the current state is 73 Coalition, 72 Labor and 6 Green/Independent in the new 151 seat parliament. I can see the Coalition picking up 5 seats, but I can also see them losing another 10 without Labor even trying too hard.

Senate result will be interesting. The Green vote has really fallen away in every state election held since the last Federal Election and I believe the Greens have a Senator up for re-election in each State.
 

Gronk

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77,904
What I mean in the Oakeshot and Windsor case is that less than 20 per cent of their two electorates voted Labor or another left leaning candidate. I think it was 12% in one of those electorates . They were staunch conservative seats and 80 odd per cent of voters clearly didnt want Labor being in Government. Both electorates clearly benefited under a Labor Government, but the electors in those two electorates clearly weren't pleased with Oakeshot and Windors choice.

I agree with you that Wentworth is definitely a bit different and I'd probably say that they wouldn't be too fussed if Phelps chose Labor to form Government unlike the other electorates that I mentioned.

I don't think Zali Steggal is a snowballs chance in hell of winning Warringah. I wouldnt take too much notice of 'opinion polls' arranged by GetUp that's for sure.

We're still 4 weeks away from the election and anything could happen, but I'd be surprised if Labor didn't win. It's theirs to lose. However, I expect the 'expert polls' to close considerably to almost 50/50 come election time. I don't expect it to be that close though.

With redistributions the current state is 73 Coalition, 72 Labor and 6 Green/Independent in the new 151 seat parliament. I can see the Coalition picking up 5 seats, but I can also see them losing another 10 without Labor even trying too hard.

Senate result will be interesting. The Green vote has really fallen away in every state election held since the last Federal Election and I believe the Greens have a Senator up for re-election in each State.
It was a ReachTel poll. GetUp paid the bill, but you’re drawing a long bow to suggest that a company like ReachTel or Ipsos or even NewsPoll fudge results. If so, then ReachTel’s business would pretty much grind to an immediate halt

https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6000354272001

By the way SkyNews use ReachTel in the normal course of business too.

https://www.pollbludger.net/2018/06/03/reachtel-52-48-labor-54-46-liberal-braddon-52-48-lnp-longman/
 

Chipmunk

Coach
Messages
17,409
It was a ReachTel poll. GetUp paid the bill, but you’re drawing a long bow to suggest that a company like ReachTel or Ipsos or even NewsPoll fudge results. If so, then ReachTel’s business would pretty much grind to an immediate halt

https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6000354272001

By the way SkyNews use ReachTel as a normal course of business too.

https://www.pollbludger.net/2018/06/03/reachtel-52-48-labor-54-46-liberal-braddon-52-48-lnp-longman/

'Expert Polls' i find never seem to get it right on a marginal seat basis and your article is a prime example. Coalition 54-46 over Labor in Braddon and 52-48 in Longman turned out to be just farcical. If anything the vote was completely the opposite. I take all opinion polls, whether Newspoll or whoever, with a grain of salt during an election period. They rarely get it right for some reason. Maybe people lie in polls. Who knows.

Ironically I think Liberal will probably win Braddon (and perhaps Bass) this time around.

Also, No one pays for a report that doesn't give them the answer they want to hear.

I'd be surprised if Steggal even gets the second most votes in Warringah. The difference between Wentworth and Warringah would be the number of left leaning votes. Phelps only just won Wentworth in the end by a small number of votes, in an area where I'd say there is a considerably more left leaning voters than the Northern Beaches.

I think for Steggal to win Warringah, she would have to get every single non-Liberal preference vote before Abbott and I don't think that will happen.
 

Gronk

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77,904
This is today’s front page courtesy of the Murdoch press. Bottom of the barrel scare campaign.

F926DBA5-D847-4DD9-9B5E-08817EE3215F.jpeg
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
79,024
Hell yeah!! ... there should be more frontpages bagging the f**k out of ScoMo's church
 

strider

Post Whore
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79,024
Was was partly joking ... news limited are clearly manipulative pricks .... but so are every other media outlet, maybe just a bit less
 

Bandwagon

Super Moderator
Staff member
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45,406
'Expert Polls' i find never seem to get it right on a marginal seat basis and your article is a prime example. Coalition 54-46 over Labor in Braddon and 52-48 in Longman turned out to be just farcical. If anything the vote was completely the opposite. I take all opinion polls, whether Newspoll or whoever, with a grain of salt during an election period. They rarely get it right for some reason. Maybe people lie in polls. Who knows.

Ironically I think Liberal will probably win Braddon (and perhaps Bass) this time around.

Also, No one pays for a report that doesn't give them the answer they want to hear.

I'd be surprised if Steggal even gets the second most votes in Warringah. The difference between Wentworth and Warringah would be the number of left leaning votes. Phelps only just won Wentworth in the end by a small number of votes, in an area where I'd say there is a considerably more left leaning voters than the Northern Beaches.

I think for Steggal to win Warringah, she would have to get every single non-Liberal preference vote before Abbott and I don't think that will happen.

Newspol has proven to be fairly accurate over the years on a national basis, but any pol on an individual seat basis should be taken with a grain of salt, they're generally fairly poor indicators.

For mine, barring any disaster from either side, I think the current polling will tighten a little, but I still see it as 51/51.5 - 48.5/49 come the last week. The whole shebang has an "electorate has made up it's mind " feel about it.
 

Bazal

Post Whore
Messages
103,586
I was assuming she kept her maiden name - otherwise they r f**kin lunatics

Well to be fair who said they were even married? The dude is only ever referred to as the kids father, not anyone's husband.

Anyway if his name is classified and his image isn't, it's probably not to protect his identity. More than likely it's because he works on particular classified assignments. Like guarding the Royals, or serving in active SAS units where there aren't technically supposed to be any active SAS units.
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
79,024
Well to be fair who said they were even married? The dude is only ever referred to as the kids father, not anyone's husband.

Anyway if his name is classified and his image isn't, it's probably not to protect his identity. More than likely it's because he works on particular classified assignments. Like guarding the Royals, or serving in active SAS units where there aren't technically supposed to be any active SAS units.
Good point .... a story about bastard children
 

Chipmunk

Coach
Messages
17,409
Well to be fair who said they were even married? The dude is only ever referred to as the kids father, not anyone's husband.

Anyway if his name is classified and his image isn't, it's probably not to protect his identity. More than likely it's because he works on particular classified assignments. Like guarding the Royals, or serving in active SAS units where there aren't technically supposed to be any active SAS units.

Would there be times when SAS Units technically aren't supposed to be somewhere? I'm sure they're technically not supposed to be anyway, ever! They are after all an attack force, rather than a defence unit of anything.
 

Bazal

Post Whore
Messages
103,586
Would there be times when SAS Units technically aren't supposed to be somewhere? I'm sure they're technically not supposed to be anyway, ever! They are after all an attack force, rather than a defence unit of anything.

Well, in ostensibly friendly countries for starters.

Or any sovereign, "unoccupied" nation where other people's military is not supposed to be going. Like the secret US missions into Laos before and during the Vietnam War that totally never even happened until oops, sorry, yeah they totally did

Or stuff like THIS

Anyway that's only one of quite a few reasons someone's name might be classified.
 
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