2025 Ashes Tour

[jim_57]

good point! Traditionally they did pay France last. Just thought playing them first would create more media and hype for the England games.

Doubt we’d get 5 games but ideally they’d play NZ before they go and France before or after England games. If done well we could have a decent international season.

England V Australia x3
Pacific Cup - NZ, Tonga & Samoa tri-series.
Pacific Bowl - PNG V Fiji 2-3 game series.
WCQs - France, Cook Islands, South Africa & Jamaica.

Just need some warm ups and one-off tests to beef it up a bit more. France should be trying to playing both England & Australia before/after WCQs.

 

[taste2taste]

WCQs - France, Cook Islands, South Africa & Jamaica.

geeez it would be disappointing if the Cook Islands qualify ahead of one of those countries. They are a heritage team that adds zero to international footy.

 

[Billythekid]

Doubt we’d get 5 games but ideally they’d play NZ before they go and France before or after England games. If done well we could have a decent international season.

England V Australia x3
Pacific Cup - NZ, Tonga & Samoa tri-series.
Pacific Bowl - PNG V Fiji 2-3 game series.
WCQs - France, Cook Islands, South Africa & Jamaica.

Just need some warm ups and one-off tests to beef it up a bit more. France should be trying to playing both England & Australia before/after WCQs.

Looks good. I still don’t love the tri series format, think I prefer when there is an even amount of teams so everyone plays each week. Though Tonga, Samoa, NZ is a pretty awesome prospect.

 

[Perth Red]

Looks good. I still don’t love the tri series format, think I prefer when there is an even amount of teams so everyone plays each week. Though Tonga, Samoa, NZ is a pretty awesome prospect.

Id have a 4 nations with
NZ, PNG, Samoa and Tonga
Then a tri nations with France (if Aus dont want to play them), Fiji and Cook Is.

We need to start supporting France better imo.

That'd give 4 games a weekend plus womens games.

 

[Billythekid]

Id have a 4 nations with
NZ, PNG, Samoa and Tonga
Then a tri nations with France (if Aus dont want to play them), Fiji and Cook Is.

We need to start supporting France better imo.

That'd give 4 games a weekend plus womens games.

It would be nice to see France supported and included more I’m just not sure how likely it is. Logistically and financially I assume it’s a lot more of an investment to involve France in these tournaments and I’m not sure if they really add much interest. Really what France needs is a second ESL team, regular international games against England and to be included whenever teams tour the NH.

I do hope we start seeing PNG featured against the big teams more often especially if they actually get an NRL team. We should be pushing to get them up amongst the top tier nations essentially.

I’ll also be honest and say I’m not sure how I really feel about promotion and relegation in international tournaments outside of the World Cup. Is this a thing that happens in a lot of international sports?

 

[Wb1234]

It would be nice to see France supported and included more I’m just not sure how likely it is. Logistically and financially I assume it’s a lot more of an investment to involve France in these tournaments and I’m not sure if they really add much interest. Really what France needs is a second ESL team, regular international games against England and to be included whenever teams tour the NH.

I do hope we start seeing PNG featured against the big teams more often especially if they actually get an NRL team. We should be pushing to get them up amongst the top tier nations essentially.

I’ll also be honest and say I’m not sure how I really feel about promotion and relegation in international tournaments outside of the World Cup. Is this a thing that happens in a lot of international sports?

England regularly belt them by 50 plus which is a shame

With relegation Catalans couldn’t focus on French juniors which now they can under the new system

Toulose might be in super league next year as their is talk of expanding to 14 teams if the tv deal is decent

 

[Billythekid]

England regularly belt them by 50 plus which is a shame

With relegation Catalans couldn’t focus on French juniors which now they can under the new system

Toulose might be in super league next year as their is talk of expanding to 14 teams if the tv deal is decent

So I’ve just looked back at the fixtures. Since 2016 they’ve played each other just 7 times (less than once a year).Thats not a huge amount IMO. They’re all essentially one ofmatches as well.

These are the results FYI:
40-6
36-6
44-6
30-10
42-18
64-0
40-8

Not that bad IMO. With a second team in the ESL and a bit more of an opportunity maybe they could become a bit more competitive.

Truth is France playing the in the SH is always going to be sporadic at best and simply isn’t how they’re going to develop. I’m not saying it shouldn’t happen or won’t help but the way forward for France is in the NH.

 

[Wb1234]

So I’ve just looked back at the fixtures. Since 2016 they’ve played each other just 7 times (less than once a year).Thats not a huge amount IMO. They’re all essentially one of matches as well.

Sometimes it’s not even a proper England team but England knights are an amateur team

France has a long way to go to be competitive

But your right about png they are close to top level now

 

[Matt_CBY]

2016 was the last time the Kangaroos were in England and 2017 the last time the two teams played. Way too long

Kangaroos played in England in 2022 just not against England.

 

[Matt_CBY]

Although capacity is another 15k more than Elland Road, St James' Park in Newcastle maybe a bit too ambitious, especially if Australia is leading 2-0 after the 2nd test).

What do you mean “if”?

I think you meant when.

 

[jim_57]

geeez it would be disappointing if the Cook Islands qualify ahead of one of those countries. They are a heritage team that adds zero to international footy.

Still wouldn’t surprise me if this ‘World Series’ just ends up being 2 games with the winner of each qualifying. Hopefully it’s a full 4 nations play each other once and top 2 qualify.

 

[Last Week]

It would be nice to see France supported and included more I’m just not sure how likely it is. Logistically and financially I assume it’s a lot more of an investment to involve France in these tournaments and I’m not sure if they really add much interest. Really what France needs is a second ESL team, regular international games against England and to be included whenever teams tour the NH.

I do hope we start seeing PNG featured against the big teams more often especially if they actually get an NRL team. We should be pushing to get them up amongst the top tier nations essentially.

I’ll also be honest and say I’m not sure how I really feel about promotion and relegation in international tournaments outside of the World Cup. Is this a thing that happens in a lot of international sports?

France only have themselves to blame. They hardly put their best foot forward.

Honestly seems like they're more interested in strengthening their clubs for the Super League than their local and national team.

 

[Billythekid]

France only have themselves to blame. They hardly put their best foot forward.

Honestly seems like they're more interested in strengthening their clubs for the Super League than their local and national team.

Is that really wrong of them? That’s probably where the money is and long term that’s how you make the national team more competitive.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Is that really wrong of them? That’s probably where the money is and long term that’s how you make the national team more competitive.

He's also referring to three different entities. Toulouse, Catalans and the French national team all have their own goals. As do Penrith, Storm and the Kangaroos.

As it stands, there are around 15-20 professional French players in Superleague. If Toulouse get in, that will grow to a pool of around 25-30 over time. Critical mass for a competitive national team at the top level would be about 50 pro players because that gives you squad depth and probably some options in key positions.

It's fantastic that England play France every year. It's also fantastic that we have a nation sit out of the Pacific Championships and tour England every year, now we just need every touring nation stopping in France whilst in Europe. Get them to the table more often, get Toulouse into Superleague and look at tapping into some French Polynesian talent and France will improve along with the rest of the nations.

 

[Wb1234]

Maybe if the French union didn’t ban rugby league their team would still be strong

Or making Les Catalans and Toulose pay for the travel and accomodation for all Travelling teams including refs whilst also ensuring they don’t get relegated or get promoted

 

[Perth Red]

Aus should play nz in perth as a warm up and england warm up game against france in France.

 

[adamkungl]

A lot of people hoping for an old style tour with a bunch of mid-week club games is straight delusion. Kangaroos won't pay for a whole second squad to go over, and no clubs will let their players do 2 games in a week on rep duty. So we can scratch that idea.

I'd love to see:
* Aus v NZ standalone Oct 17.
* Aus tour warm up-game Oct 25.
* 3 matches v England. Nov 1, 8, 15. A London game is a must. Every game should be targeting 40k minimum crowds.
* Later kick-offs in England so Australia can watch at 7am instead of 2am. The organisers rarely seem to consider this for some reason.


Hard to go wrong with that as a basic setup. Some of the details could be interesting. The obvious one is the warm-up game. I think its important that France get top tier games but I don't think it will happen for 2 reasons. It is expected that such a game would be a flogging played in front of a 4 figure crowd, and there is little appetite for that among anyone except die-hards. On the other hand a game vs Wigan or St Helens would satisfy the nostalgia crowd and likely pull 20,000 fans. The other reason is that France need to fly to Australia for the "World Series" repechage qualifiers, which means the timelines would struggle to line up.

I expect we'll see Australia play a club side, if a warm up game happens. It's not my favourite idea but it will put enough money in the bank to keep these events on the calendar. If the RFL have any decency about them England will play France as their own warm-up the week before they jet off to the World series.


The other detail I'm hopeful about, which is more controversial and pie-in-the-sky/hasn't really been discussed, is reviving Australia-A while the Kangaroos are on tour. I'd very much like to see an Australia-A fill the bye weeks of the Pacific Cup. It keeps the Australian team in the public eye in prime time here, and gives the competing tournament teams an extra game. And I have little doubt that they could sell enough tickets to make it worthwhile, assuming an 'A' team doesn't have the same match payments as a full Kangaroos test team.

Samoa v Australia-A @ Western Sydney
NZ/PNG v Australia-A @ Gold Coast/Townsville
Tonga v Australia-A @ Brisbane

A-teams are typically unpopular among Rugby League fans as we have a tendency to turn up our noses at anything less than the best, but its an established concept in sports with far more successful international scenes than ours so personally I think its a foolish attitude.

 

[Perth Red]

Aus played NZ in Perth on their way to England in 2016. Successful game with WA govt paying hosting rights and a sell out crowd of 20k at HBF park. They should do same again on way next year.

 

[jim_57]

The other reason is that France need to fly to Australia for the "World Series" repechage qualifiers, which means the timelines would struggle to line up.

Is that confirmed?

If not I get the feeling it will just be France play Jamaica in England and Cook Islands play South Africa in Australia, winners progress, minimum money spent.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

A lot of people hoping for an old style tour with a bunch of mid-week club games is straight delusion. Kangaroos won't pay for a whole second squad to go over, and no clubs will let their players do 2 games in a week on rep duty. So we can scratch that idea.

I'd love to see:
* Aus v NZ standalone Oct 17.
* Aus tour warm up-game Oct 25.
* 3 matches v England. Nov 1, 8, 15. A London game is a must. Every game should be targeting 40k minimum crowds.
* Later kick-offs in England so Australia can watch at 7am instead of 2am. The organisers rarely seem to consider this for some reason.


Hard to go wrong with that as a basic setup. Some of the details could be interesting. The obvious one is the warm-up game. I think its important that France get top tier games but I don't think it will happen for 2 reasons. It is expected that such a game would be a flogging played in front of a 4 figure crowd, and there is little appetite for that among anyone except die-hards. On the other hand a game vs Wigan or St Helens would satisfy the nostalgia crowd and likely pull 20,000 fans. The other reason is that France need to fly to Australia for the "World Series" repechage qualifiers, which means the timelines would struggle to line up.

I expect we'll see Australia play a club side, if a warm up game happens. It's not my favourite idea but it will put enough money in the bank to keep these events on the calendar. If the RFL have any decency about them England will play France as their own warm-up the week before they jet off to the World series.


The other detail I'm hopeful about, which is more controversial and pie-in-the-sky/hasn't really been discussed, is reviving Australia-A while the Kangaroos are on tour. I'd very much like to see an Australia-A fill the bye weeks of the Pacific Cup. It keeps the Australian team in the public eye in prime time here, and gives the competing tournament teams an extra game. And I have little doubt that they could sell enough tickets to make it worthwhile, assuming an 'A' team doesn't have the same match payments as a full Kangaroos test team.

Samoa v Australia-A @ Western Sydney
NZ/PNG v Australia-A @ Gold Coast/Townsville
Tonga v Australia-A @ Brisbane

A-teams are typically unpopular among Rugby League fans as we have a tendency to turn up our noses at anything less than the best, but its an established concept in sports with far more successful international scenes than ours so personally I think its a foolish attitude.

Surely Kangaroos v France can sell-out Catalans home ground of around 15k. The French were pulling 10k v Wales there a decade ago