Cronulla resigned to losing Kade Snowden to Newcastle Knights with Nathan Tinkler tak

[Russell Crowe's Band]

yeah. need points cap.

dunno about 15000 tho reefy. you could sign heaps of players with 15000 points and the most expensive chips being 100.

so what are cronulla doing to stop the rumoured loss of

Snowden
vave
Mannah
??

 

[perverse]

the only reason i don't really endorse a points cap is that it literally makes it impossible to retain home grown talent. i still think clubs should be rewarded for producing their own. i also don't think all international players have equal value. for example, Junior Sau would take up as much space as Justin Hodges under the cap. clearly these players are not of equal value.

 

[Noname36]

The problem with a points cap is that it wouldn't take into account a player's value off the field in terms of marketing, leadership, etc. For example, a player like Kurt Gidley would be worth a heap of points to Newcastle, but not many to any other. A points cap has potential, but it would have to be heavily looked into.

 

[carcharias]

someone should audit shubert.

How the fug some teams are getting away with it is astonishing.

 

[blacktip-reefy]

The points cap will work under a commission. A panel would decide on a players value & it is based soley on game performance. Discounts would apply to local juniors.
Aslo the points rating panel would be have set criteria on how to value a player. The panel would be perhaps 10 people. They would value each player. The top & bottom value would be disgarded & the remainder averaged out.
Oh, & there is too many zero's on my figure. 1500 which should equate to around 30 players @ 50 points.

 

[kurtz]

points based cap of 15000 points to each club & players points are out of 100.
20 points = rookie
100 points = consistent Internation/origin player
75 points = +60 first grade games etc.

then clubs can pay whatever they want to anybody. As long as they start the year under the points cap.

I agree that this is the way to go. Clubs should be allowed no more that 150 international players each.

 

[Special K]

You would need independent rep coaches though. Say if you are Tim Sheens and want to re-sign Lawrence and you have a tour coming up as Aus coach - you wouldn't pick him until after he re-signed. Or if you are bidding against say the Sharks who couldn't fit (an example do not go crazy) another Aus player into the squad and you want Luke Douglas you would pick him.

 

[blacktip-reefy]

Ratings all happen during the season & are released @ the end of the season, so there is no mid season transfers or negotiations. It would make it hard if not impossible for rep coaches to rort the system.
If your teams cap increases during the year, that should be the goal. If you don't import any players & your teams cap has built up & is over 1500, then you dont have to shed any players. This encourages junior development & loyalty from the clubs.
It also opens the possibility of player trades bewtween clubs.

 

[Bastard Squad]

Bennett move could impact on Snowden
BY MICHAEL CARAYANNIS
14 Apr, 2011 04:00 AM

OUTGOING St George Illawarra coach Wayne Bennett’s decision to sign a four-year deal with Newcastle could have ramifications on the playing roster of the Dragons and Cronulla.

Both clubs have been monitoring Bennett’s decision closely with key personnel affected by the move to the Knights.

Sharks coach Shane Flanagan said his club was none-the-wiser if Bennett’s move to the Knights would help or hinder their pursuit to re-sign representative prop Kade Snowden.

Snowden had all but agreed to a contract extension with the Sharks before mining magnate, and Bennett’s new boss, Nathan Tinkler made an audacious bid for his services.

But Bennett is known to not pay over-the-top prices for players, particularly prop forwards, so the incoming coach could overrule Tinkler’s ambition to move Snowden back to the club where he made his NRL debut.

‘‘Nothing has happened there,’’ Flanagan said.

Full Story

 

[Russell Crowe's Band]

who knows

just hope he continues his good form

we nee dto fire the f**k up and win this game. its skywalker vs jabba the hut here

 

[perverse]

edit - derp.

i still think the less fiscal clubs are going to be hurt by a points based system. when a bloke like Chris Lawrence is worth less under a cap than a bloke like Junior Sau, then the system is flawed. Chris Lawrence, in this situation, is going to go to the highest bidder every time... as most teams, especially rich teams, will be killing to get this "bargain buy"... and will throw big money to do so. conversely, a bloke like Sau who is a regular international is going to be worth too much compared to what he offers relative to his cap value, and would probably be literally forced out of the NRL because of his poor value... or at best a desperate team will pick him up for unders and no-one wins. the poor teams will still end up with the dregs, so to speak. there is no good, scientific baramoter to "rate" the players. stats are no good. rep games are no good. peoples personal opinions are certainly no good.

 

[blacktip-reefy]

edit - derp.

i still think the less fiscal clubs are going to be hurt by a points based system. when a bloke like Chris Lawrence is worth less under a cap than a bloke like Junior Sau, then the system is flawed. Chris Lawrence, in this situation, is going to go to the highest bidder every time... as most teams, especially rich teams, will be killing to get this "bargain buy"... and will throw big money to do so. conversely, a bloke like Sau who is a regular international is going to be worth too much compared to what he offers relative to his cap value, and would probably be literally forced out of the NRL because of his poor value... or at best a desperate team will pick him up for unders and no-one wins. the poor teams will still end up with the dregs, so to speak. there is no good, scientific baramoter to "rate" the players. stats are no good. rep games are no good. peoples personal opinions are certainly no good.

Thats rubbish.
Why would Sau be disadvantaged because he plays for some remote island? Obviously a player playing for a winning New Zealand outfit wouldbe capped higher than his opposing player.
If benji is the bench mark at 100 then Lockyer is only worth 95.
You are going on about semantics. The valuation of the players would have to follow a model that takes ALL things in perspective. Much like the judging of a surf contest.
Junior Sau or any other player , like Lwrence would be capped at what they are worth from a rort free system.
Then any club can pay what they want. All clubs are then limited to what they can spend because they cant go over the points cap, meaning player talent is spread even better than the current salary cap, which have the f**k rorted out of it by the likes of Tinkler.

 

[perverse]

Thats rubbish.
Why would Sau be disadvantaged because he plays for some remote island? Obviously a player playing for a winning New Zealand outfit wouldbe capped higher than his opposing player.
If benji is the bench mark at 100 then Lockyer is only worth 95.
You are going on about semantics. The valuation of the players would have to follow a model that takes ALL things in perspective. Much like the judging of a surf contest.
Junior Sau or any other player , like Lwrence would be capped at what they are worth from a rort free system.
Then any club can pay what they want. All clubs are then limited to what they can spend because they cant go over the points cap, meaning player talent is spread even better than the current salary cap, which have the f**k rorted out of it by the likes of Tinkler.

no, it's not rubbish, clearly you didn't understand it. what chance has Sau got of getting a decent paycheque when he is an inferior player to many other players that would be worth less than him under the points system? he would represent terrible value under the points system, and would likely have to accept low pay in order to find a club willing to accomodate his bloated cap weighting relative to his playing ability.

that's my question... and you didn't answer it. the rich clubs would get all of the "value buys", that is players that are worth more in reality than they are under the points system, and players that ARN'T worth their weighting in the points system, like Sau, would find it very difficult to to find employment at a reasonable rate because they arn't a good value proposition under the cap. if rich clubs are able to pay whatever they want, then they are going to get the rub of the green under your system every time. the system guarentees it.

you say im arguing semantics, which is fair bollocks because coming up with a viable system to actually weight players appropriately is really the crux of the issue. i'm not convinced such a system exists, and until i see one that i can't poke holes in i won't be convinced. assigning an arbitrary number to every player that is supposed to represent their value relative to their peers accurately and reliably enough to stake the integrity of the competition on isn't easy.

 

[Dragon Slayer]

Anyone know for sure if our offer is $300,000?

Or is it lower.

Seriously if we forked out $400,000 on Ben Ross why can't we at least offer $350,000 to $375,000 for Snowden who is a far superior prop.

We are talking about a possible Australia International this year and next year for sure.

 

[blacktip-reefy]

You know what , it could be a really bad system. Even if it is, its a hundred times better than a salary cap which clearly does not work & can be rorted. It cannot control Tinkler type people. EG. Sudeenly all the Snowdens, all 50 of them, are employed on $250k per year by a contractor, to a contractor , to a sub commpany to a company that Tinkler own , but is not a director of.
The only problem is not really a problem. Its the criteria for calculating a plyers worth in points , for the cap.

But let me get your strange example correct.

How can Sau get a pay cheque because he is an inferior player, to another player, who is worth less than him under the points system.

1. That does not compute. An inferior player would be on less points than Sau.
You also seem to keep thinking along the lines of money. Money is irrelevant under a points system. A rookie with potential who has nice hair & the chics dig could get paid 2 million if he brought the people through the gates. But he is still a rookie & worth 25 points.
On the other hand, the best player in the world, Marshall, would finally be able to get paid what he is worth, around $2 million a season & he can get all the endorsements he likes.

 

[BatteredFlake]

As a leveler,salary cap system without the draft, is a joke. A points system would have to be a better system . I just wonder though if it wouldnt go the same way as the draft if legally challenged by some player that wanted to go to a club that didnt have enough points left to accomodate him. I always thought that the court ruling on the draft did more damage to rugby league than anything else.

 

[PJ]

If Vave and Mannah are leaving along with Snowden then imo Duoglas would be mad to stay.

 

[blacktip-reefy]

We have apparently signed a high profile centre for next year. I can only think maybe Champion?
Tits have swung into full rebuild mode & are talking to everybody front row related , even Tandy. But apparently Tits are close to signing Champion, aparently.
So if Vaves, Manna & Snowden are off contract & Dougy, expect them all to get approached by the Tits.

 

[Russell Crowe's Band]

according to the fluff forum were chasing some bloke named gleeson from the UK. he might be the centre

we need to sign these fowards up asap.

 

[carcharias]

o oh ...cooper???