Crowd next Sunday, Bulldogs v Tigers at ANZ

[Saint Doc]

Once again, as I said, stats will tell you anything you want to hear. Please be clear I think the tigers are fantastically well supported. But i can't stand seeing people using stats to "prove" a point.

• Leading average home crowds in Sydney for three consecutive years

Thats great but does it tell you that 2006 was premiership afterglow? Does it tell you that among your main competitors for this title, the Dogs came last and had a tumultuous year? Does it tell you the Dragons moved away from Kogarah and there was a backlash among the fans and talks of boycotting ANZ? Does it say that some of your large crowds were at ANZ against Dogs, Souths, Dragons and Parra, who were co-tenants and whose members got in for free, effectively making it a jointly hosted game?

• Leading average away crowds in the NRL

Surprising and dont care enough to actually check it...but would be very surprised if true.

• Over 14.2 million TV viewers watched Wests Tigers on TV in 2008

So what? How many watched the dragons/dogs/parra/roosters? The number is irrevelvant without comparison. And obviously time slots and FTA vs pay tv makes this a stupid stat.

• Leading merchandise sales in Sydney

Again, that would be because you guys changed both home and away kits last year, whilst the dragons, eels, dogs, souths roosters panthers, sharks etc all stayed the same or virtually the same.

• Roy Morgan research shows Wests Tigers is the third most popular team in the NRL behind one-town teams Brisbane and Melbourne with 489,000 supporters

Use common sense. These polls are ridiculous to their sample size, and due to the fact they take into account nothing. Do you honestly think Melbourne are the 2nd most supported team in Australia?? No way in hell. But if a victorian gets a random call from mr roy or mr morgan asking which league team do you support, he'd probably say "Storm", despite not even knowing if they were a league or union team, or that there was a difference!!

I notice that stats regarding membership, or corporate support, or mentions in the press, or bottom line are not mentioned, all which could equally be used as "measures" of popularity.

If it helps you sleep at night thinking that the Tigers are the most popular team on the planet, then thats great. My point is that there is no way of measuring it, there are too many variables. But what can be seen is generally speaking the tigs, dogs, saints, and souths seem to be well supported at the moment, and the sharks, panthers, eels seem to be down the other end, with the roosters and manly somewhere in the middle.

 

[Saint Doc]

Just further to the ridiclousness of roy morgan stats (aside from my point about the Storm)...

I just went to their website to have a look. The last press release i can find is 2007

http://www.roymorgan.com/news/press-releases/2007/664/

The order then was broncos, storm, cowboys, dragons, tigers, eels, knights, bulldogs...

Ridiclous statitical anomolies include that compared to 2006, the roosters lost 106,000 fans, and the dogs lost 79,000 fans. This clearly shows that the sample size is so small, that a small change is blown out into a big change, For example, if they only surveyed 1000 people, then each person would represent 20,000 more. Therefore if in the sample of 2000 people, there were 4 less dogs fans, then that equals a reduction of 80,000. Common sense there is no way that many people decided to stop supporting those teams...they simply wernt asked.

Similarly, with what i was saying about how rubbish stats are, they did this for each team...check out the results for the dragons...

St George Illawarra Dragons supporters are:
• 47% more likely to agree “I consider myself a homosexual”;
• 28% more likely to have made a purchase from Priceline in the last four weeks;
• 26% more likely to have made a purchase from The Reject Shop in the last four weeks;
• 23% more likely to have made a purchase from Spotlight in the last four weeks;
• 21% more likely to agree “I regularly go to church or my place of worship”;
• 18% more likely to agree “I believe a percentage of everyone’s income should go to charities”;
• 15% more likely to have visited a RSL or Leagues Club in the last three months;
• 14% more likely to be aged 35-49;
• 12% more likely to agree “I don’t enjoy taking risks”; and
• 10% more likely to be female.

 

[Ladmate]

Once again, as I said, stats will tell you anything you want to hear. Please be clear I think the tigers are fantastically well supported. But i can't stand seeing people using stats to "prove" a point.



Thats great but does it tell you that 2006 was premiership afterglow? Does it tell you that among your main competitors for this title, the Dogs came last and had a tumultuous year? Does it tell you the Dragons moved away from Kogarah and there was a backlash among the fans and talks of boycotting ANZ? Does it say that some of your large crowds were at ANZ against Dogs, Souths, Dragons and Parra, who were co-tenants and whose members got in for free, effectively making it a jointly hosted game?

[/b]

Surprising and dont care enough to actually check it...but would be very surprised if true.



So what? How many watched the dragons/dogs/parra/roosters? The number is irrevelvant without comparison. And obviously time slots and FTA vs pay tv makes this a stupid stat.

[/b]

Again, that would be because you guys changed both home and away kits last year, whilst the dragons, eels, dogs, souths roosters panthers, sharks etc all stayed the same or virtually the same.



Use common sense. These polls are ridiculous to their sample size, and due to the fact they take into account nothing. Do you honestly think Melbourne are the 2nd most supported team in Australia?? No way in hell. But if a victorian gets a random call from mr roy or mr morgan asking which league team do you support, he'd probably say "Storm", despite not even knowing if they were a league or union team, or that there was a difference!!

I notice that stats regarding membership, or corporate support, or mentions in the press, or bottom line are not mentioned, all which could equally be used as "measures" of popularity.

If it helps you sleep at night thinking that the Tigers are the most popular team on the planet, then thats great. My point is that there is no way of measuring it, there are too many variables. But what can be seen is generally speaking the tigs, dogs, saints, and souths seem to be well supported at the moment, and the sharks, panthers, eels seem to be down the other end, with the roosters and manly somewhere in the middle.

You call 2006 a premiership hangover..but atleast we were good enough to win one that year. Get over it if he thinks Tigers and Bulldogs are the most supported team. Pissed off you sh*tty little 0 premiership side didnt make it?

 

[bobmar28]

Let kids in for $3 like AFL does would really boost the crowd.

 

[mattyg]

Tigers release a new jersey every freaking year...doesn't surprise me if they have sold more merchandise. Our jersey has stayed relatively the same for a long long time now. I've still got the 2004 jerseys which i wear regularly and theres hardly any difference between that and the current one, only a new sponsor and a different make in terms of material/fit.

 

[tiger_nick]

The Dragons have the highest number of season ticket holders, we have over 10,000.
Last year at Homebush hurt our home crowd average, and 2007 was a shocking year as we were horrible for the most part.

On pure numbers for home crowd averages, the Tigers have the most for the Sydney clubs.
I think the Dragons will hold the record for the Sydney clubs for this season come season end.

so what?

the tigers have made the finals ONCE in the last 19 years!! to say saints had a bad home crowd average in 2007 because they had a bad season is a massive cop out. maybe saints are only fair weather fans?

i keep hearing that the dragons have the biggest supporter base. crowd figures continue to show that this is a myth.

 

[tiger_nick]

You can get stats to back up whatever you want to say. Im not trying to say one has more fans than the other. But just to add some balance to the argument, two games this year can be compared:

Tigers vs Roosters at SFS, mutual home ground, 14,000
Dragons vs Roosters at SFS, mutual/shared event, 28,000

Score one to saints.

Tigers vs Knights Campbelltown 17,000
Dragons vs Knights Kogarah 14,000.

Score one to tigers.

Its pointless comparing other games at the moment. What is fair to say is that the Tigers and Bulldogs are probably the best home crowd drawers in Sydney, followed by probably Saints and Souths. In terms of fan base though i think its reversed.

One thing i will say about Saints is that I think we'd have very close to the highest average crowd for every game of the year (barring Brisbane due to their awesome home crowds). The Broncos, Storm, Dogs, Tigers, Souths, Parra, Manly, Newcastle, Gold Coast, Sharks, Roosters would all definately circle our game on their calendar as one of their 'blockbusters' for crowds, and Penrith, Cowboys, Warriors and Raiders certainly wouldnt be dreading the gate when we come to town. I think this is partly due to our excellent travelling, partly due to our wideranging fan base and partly due to rivallries built over so many years that encourage opposition fans out.

Rather than comparing lengths between Saints, Dogs and Tigers though, shouldnt we be asking where the 17,000 saturday night sharks crowds have gone, or why Parra struggle to fill and awesome all seater stadium, or why every penrith game is blinding with red seats?

in 2005 the tigers and cowboys played infront of 83,000
the dragons and cowboys played infront of 21,000

i guess that means the tigers are more supported then the dragons! makes about as much sense as comparing a regular game to a ANZAC day game.

 

[Brutus]

Yeah but the Anzac Day game this year wasn't as different because it was played with two other games as part of Super Saturday. Unlike being a one-off during a public holiday on a weekday.

 

[Paullyboy]

:lol::lol::lol:

Aren't you the bloke who compiles the crowd stats at rleague?

:lol: Keep up the good work.
.

No I'm not, I have no idea where you got that from.

As for the other posts, I actually live in Sydney now - but cant bring myself to change my location on here because I'd rather be in QLD, so there goes that argument as well.

The problem with the stats being thrown around is that half the Dragons games are played in Woollongong, I think in Sydney they would have more supporters than the Tigers.

 

[meltiger]

Hopefully he 'wings' it at the judiciary

Most definitly.

Media fully behind Ennis now, Robbie NEEDS both the Bulldogs & CvC games to prove who is the better player.

 

[Timmah]

Media might be behind Ennis (and rightfully so, he's been the better player so far this year), but Bellamy has publicly stated his support for Farah...

 

[meltiger]

Media might be behind Ennis (and rightfully so, he's been the better player so far this year), but Bellamy has publicly stated his support for Farah...

& the media, not coaches get players selected for rep duties.


Robbie will outplay him just like he does Smith. If I were Ennis I'd accept the suspension for this week ;-)

 

[TimmyB]

Media might be behind Ennis (and rightfully so, he's been the better player so far this year), but Bellamy has publicly stated his support for Farah...

Rightfully so? Bellamy realises a few admittedly excellent matches doesn't not overshadow 4 years of performance. It's not like Farah is playing poorly at all - he's still been one of our best.

Like MT says, wait until they face each other.

 

[meltiger]

^ As much as I love Robbie & desperately want him to get the jersey he should have had 2 years ago, on one hand I wouldn't mind if they rolled with Ennis.


Would mean the Tigers come to Olympic Park with Robbie to face a Storm side minus Smith

 

[Everlovin' Antichrist]

Media might be behind Ennis (and rightfully so, he's been the better player so far this year), but Bellamy has publicly stated his support for Farah...

errrr, Ennis isn't fit to lace Farah's boots.

Ennis is going well, but Robbie puts it there every single week and has done for 3 or 4 years now.

 

[Timmah]

Ennis has been around a few years as well, found his groove at Brisbane over the past two years and is now in vintage form at the 'Dogs, plus he's a top-notch goalkicker, something NSW lacks without Fitzgibbon.

 

[meltiger]

^ there is no doubting that Ennis is a quality player Tim, but the point about Robbie proving week in, week out that he is up there in the top 2-3 hookers in the game over a long period as EA, TimmyB and even the NSW coach all point out is a strong one.


It's great though for the game, it's going to come down to these two games, if Ennis outplays Robbie (I personally don't believe he will) over the next few weeks and gets the gig, then he's deserved it.

 

[hutch]

^ As much as I love Robbie & desperately want him to get the jersey he should have had 2 years ago, on one hand I wouldn't mind if they rolled with Ennis.


Would mean the Tigers come to Olympic Park with Robbie to face a Storm side minus Smith

which is another reason why origin should be played on stand alone weekends, along with rep games for other countries, but that is a different issue altogether!

 

[Everlovin' Antichrist]

Ennis kicked at 67% last season.

If that's top notch in the NRL these days, I'm Bourbon Beccy's next tampon.

 

[Timmah]

He's at 100% this season