Denver Broncos News

[shiznit]

Interesting to read an ESPN article about bold moves each AFC team should make this offseason...

For the Raiders it said to give up 2 first rounders for Von Miller's franchise tag.

I'd be down with that.... He's well worth that IMO...

I could imagine having him with Mack and Aldon Smith... That's some scary shit if your a QB.

 

[Firey_Dragon]

Interesting to read an ESPN article about bold moves each AFC team should make this offseason...

For the Raiders it said to give up 2 first rounders for Von Miller's franchise tag.

I'd be down with that.... He's well worth that IMO...

I could imagine having him with Mack and Aldon Smith... That's some scary shit if your a QB.

Von Miller won't be going anywhere, he'll get an exclusive franchise tag if they don't secure his contract in time. No chance Elway lets any other team get a look at him. After SB48 defence was the focus, Miller is the glue that holds it all together.

 

[Firey_Dragon]

Nothing to do with Jackson I think. When you have room to add a former first round pick for sweet f**k all, you generally do it. Cross your fingers and hope his knees hold up.

Like the article says, low cost/low risk/high reward.

It's still a cap hit in a roster that will be very tight given the players about to hit FA. It's a signing you take most times, no doubt. They aren't short in that area though, which is why it's a move that could indicate some expected departing players.

 

[zombie jesus]

It's still a cap hit in a roster that will be very tight given the players about to hit FA. It's a signing you take most times, no doubt. They aren't short in that area though, which is why it's a move that could indicate some expected departing players.

Assuming they signed him for the vet minimum for one year. That's $840k including the maximum signing bonus.

Then there's the discount for 1-year vet minimum contracts bringing his cap number down to $680k.

And they can carry him up until the eve on the season before anything over the $80k signing bonus is guaranteed.

So at best, you've got a rotational DL who can contribute for less than $700k, at worst you've got $80k in dead money.

Chump change when you're dealing with a $155m salary cap.

 

[shiznit]

Von Miller won't be going anywhere, he'll get an exclusive franchise tag if they don't secure his contract in time. No chance Elway lets any other team get a look at him. After SB48 defence was the focus, Miller is the glue that holds it all together.

Yeah I thought that it was a no brainer he would get the exclusive tag also.... I didnt really understand why anyone would want to go with the non-exclusive tag.

But apparently teams choose to use the non-exclusive tag as a sign of good faith to the player. so I guess you risk pissing him off if you put the exclusive tag on him because he may want to test his full value on the market. It's also a lower cap number too...

 

[nick87]

Never understand teams not persuing players on non exclusive tags
i go back to Dez Bryant and D Thomas, and think to myself why wouldnt a team like NE give up 2 picks that are going to be no earlier than 29th in the draft to get Brady an absolute stud WR

I get cap implications and Dez has red flags etc... but ignoring that, just player to player... you wont get players as good as Dez with the picks NE has. They have a need, he would go a long way to delivering 2-3 more rings for the franchise... its a no brainer to me if you can make the contract work. But the moment those tags go on, teams run away as if 2 first round picks with a 50% or more BUST rate is better than a 100% stud rate.

Crazy.

If Von Miller gets the non exclusive tag, same deal. Why wouldnt a team like the Cardinals, who are an elite pass rusher away give up the 29th pick in this draft, and the 30th? 31st? 3nd? 2017 first rounder for Von Miller?
Crazy

 

[shiznit]

Never understand teams not persuing players on non exclusive tags
i go back to Dez Bryant and D Thomas, and think to myself why wouldnt a team like NE give up 2 picks that are going to be no earlier than 29th in the draft to get Brady an absolute stud WR

I get cap implications and Dez has red flags etc... but ignoring that, just player to player... you wont get players as good as Dez with the picks NE has. They have a need, he would go a long way to delivering 2-3 more rings for the franchise... its a no brainer to me if you can make the contract work. But the moment those tags go on, teams run away as if 2 first round picks with a 50% or more BUST rate is better than a 100% stud rate.

Crazy.

If Von Miller gets the non exclusive tag, same deal. Why wouldnt a team like the Cardinals, who are an elite pass rusher away give up the 29th pick in this draft, and the 30th? 31st? 3nd? 2017 first rounder for Von Miller?
Crazy

I suppose it's difficult because they need to have the cap space to be able to offer a contract that the current team won't be able to match.

So using your example... Would the Cards be able to offer him something the Broncos couldn't match... Normally at that end of the draft teams don't have much space in the cap.

The Raiders and the Jags have 70+ million in space... So they could potentially offer a rediulously front loaded contract which the Broncos might struggle to match...

The jags have some nice picks too....

 

[nick87]

Yeah obviously the cap stuff matters but teams dont even consider it, ignoring the cap , once the tag is applied, everyone just backs off

But check this out
http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/tools/roster/arizona-cardinals/

Looking at that, the Cardinals COULD cut Washington (going to happen), Redding (going to happen), Ellington (they love David Johnson as a 3 down back and could draft a cheaper back up late), and restructure a few deals (Carson, Veldheer, PP etc) and create the cap space to make that kind of move

Teams can ALWAYS create space to do that kind of thing, you can move money, it costs you down the line but for a team in a win now window with a 33-34 year old QB, that's fine... if Von Miller hit FA, a team like the Cards would absolute make those moves to try and get Von, im sure of it.
My point is the moment that tag goes on, the moment they have to give up 2 picks, they just throw their hands up and say "oh well" because the NFL values first round picks too highly. It's a group think mentality, that some how 2 late first round picks are more valuable than Von Miller, and they arent.

 

[shiznit]

Yeah true... I suppose teams do make it work under the cap... Look at Mami last season with Suh...

I suppose it comes down to the price... You need to give up 2 first round picks... Which even late in the first round... They should be starters and contributors... And then there's the salary hit on top of that...

It has to be a REAL special player to pay that kinda price.... That's 2 potential starters and with the type of salary needed to beat out Denver.... Probably 2 or 3 very good free agents...

Miller is worth it IMO... But there wouldn't be many others....

 

[Firey_Dragon]

Assuming they signed him for the vet minimum for one year. That's $840k including the maximum signing bonus.

Then there's the discount for 1-year vet minimum contracts bringing his cap number down to $680k.

And they can carry him up until the eve on the season before anything over the $80k signing bonus is guaranteed.

So at best, you've got a rotational DL who can contribute for less than $700k, at worst you've got $80k in dead money.

Chump change when you're dealing with a $155m salary cap.

Ah gotcha. I always forget even on shitty contracts they can strip it all away at the last minute. $80k is nothing. $840k not so much considering the amount of talent the Broncos have hitting FA (Miller, Osweiller, Jackson, Trevathan, Marshall, Bruton Jr etc). They need all the space they can get.


It's a good safety net, I just hope it isn't a sign that they're thinking that Jackson may move on.

 

[nick87]

It has to be a REAL special player to pay that kinda price.... That's 2 potential starters and with the type of salary needed to beat out Denver.... Probably 2 or 3 very good free agents...

That's what im saying though. I dont think it should be a "REAL special" player to justify it. I think the NFL completely over-values draft picks. Take a look through any draft you like and aside from (irconically) the Miller draft, which was STACKED in hindsight, there is ALWAYS way more busts than hits.

I mean pick a team, and for our purposes i take Philly. Would i trade Nelson Agholar and #13 this year for Dez? Of course. That's what it would have cost us to get him.

In 2 years time i bet you look back at the Cardinals picks this year and next and say "oh yeah, those two for Von Miller would be the trade rape of the century"

That's the reality of what middle to late picks actually are. Teams seem to value those late picks like they can find steals and get pro bowlers with those picks, it just doesnt happen that often. I often wonder if you put an NBA GM into an 2-3 NFL teams, who werent afraid to take on "bad contracts" for assets/picks, or move picks for a bonafide star, if it wouldnt completely revolutionize the way teams value picks and players etc.

As many people have said, the NFL is probably the most conservative league in the world. Even guys like Chip Kelly get beaten into submission by it's group think.

 

[shiznit]

That's what im saying though. I dont think it should be a "REAL special" player to justify it. I think the NFL completely over-values draft picks. Take a look through any draft you like and aside from (irconically) the Miller draft, which was STACKED in hindsight, there is ALWAYS way more busts than hits.

I mean pick a team, and for our purposes i take Philly. Would i trade Nelson Agholar and #13 this year for Dez? Of course. That's what it would have cost us to get him.

In 2 years time i bet you look back at the Cardinals picks this year and next and say "oh yeah, those two for Von Miller would be the trade rape of the century"

That's the reality of what middle to late picks actually are. Teams seem to value those late picks like they can find steals and get pro bowlers with those picks, it just doesnt happen that often. I often wonder if you put an NBA GM into an 2-3 NFL teams, who werent afraid to take on "bad contracts" for assets/picks, or move picks for a bonafide star, if it wouldnt completely revolutionize the way teams value picks and players etc.

As many people have said, the NFL is probably the most conservative league in the world. Even guys like Chip Kelly get beaten into submission by it's group think.

Yeah I can understand your draft pick argument... But you also need to remember your not just giving up those 2 picks... Your giving up those 2 picks on top of paying a contract which from all reports... Is going to need to be above the $100M mark and probably more than $20M per season if your going to try and go higher than what Denver would bid.

with that type of money... You could bring in 2 or 3 premium free agents.... And keep your 2 first rounders.

And it's hard to compare it to the NBA as they have max deals... If NBA players were allowed to earn as much money as they liked I doubt many GMs would make half the moves they do.

 

[legend]

I think Clady, Jackson and Trevathan go, Ware restructures his contract and the Broncos keep Miller and Osweiler. Barrett and Ray should continue to improve and aren't expensive at the moment.

Not sure on Bruton but I hope he stays.

 

[18to87]

I have accidentally purchased 2 copies of the Sports Illustrated Commemorative Super Bowl Edition. If anyone is interested I will be happy to send on to you at cost. It was $12.99 + $4.99 shipping (USD) plus Australia Post costs. It is currently at my US Box so I should have it in ~2 weeks. PM if you would like to reserve.

 

[18to87]

Mag has been reserved.

Anyway, what a day for the Broncos...

- Jackson gone to Jax for massive money
- Trevathan as suspected has gone to the Bears
- Patriots and others rumoured to be after CJ Anderson (but Broncos can match)
- Donald Stevenson signed to be a backup tackle 3 years $14 million (but KC replaces him with Schwartz!)

...and of course the big news...

- Brock bolts for Houston. Elway has already taken a swipe at him and it sounds like Brock started ignoring calls from Denver and teammates 2 weeks ago.

Now the rumours:
- Broncos already rumoured to have called LA and Miami. Elway probably did due diligence with 15 teams.
- RG3 not an option according to Mike Klis
- A trade for Kap is the big rumour. The guy that broke the news for Kap demanding a trade has come out and said it will happen today or tomorrow.

Stay tuned!

 

[legend]

New look team for 2016 that's for sure. Plenty of cap space too! Trade for Joe Thomas and Kap and I'm a happy man.

 

[legend]

So far this off-season, we have lost:

Peyton Manning
Brock Osweiler
Ryan Harris
Danny Trevathan
David Bruton
Malik Jackson
Aaron Brewer
Owen Daniels
Louis Vasquez

:shock::shock::shock:

I don't expect Ronnie Hillman and Evan Mathis back either.

 

[Tom155]

So far this off-season, we have lost:

Peyton Manning
Brock Osweiler
Ryan Harris
Danny Trevathan
David Bruton
Malik Jackson
Aaron Brewer
Owen Daniels
Louis Vasquez

:shock::shock::shock:

I don't expect Ronnie Hillman and Evan Mathis back either.

Yep so far only ins are Stephenson & Sanchez.

Going to be a completely different team next season, hopefully it works out.

Apparently Arizona has offered Mathis a 2 year deal.

 

[legend]

We'd better draft well or it will be a 6-10 season and a high draft pick in 2017. Starting D still looks strong and if Barrett and Ray come on strong, we should be fine on that side of the ball.

I wonder what will happen with Vernon Davis now Owen Daniels is gone?

 

[shiznit]

We comin' for you Denver!!

Von Miller & Demarcus Ware beware...

There is a new force in the AFC West...