Did Elliott have a parting shot at supporters ?

[woodgers]

I'd still like to see him there. You have to roll the dice when you aren't fancied to win a finals game and take the game to the opposition. I would prefer to go into the 1st final with all out attack and go for broke than play conservative like we always do and lose 20-18 or similar. Currently, I can see that happening regardless of who we play.

I don't think we will be out to Melbourne in round 1. I cannot see the Eels beating the Cowboys in NQ. The Cows had a good result yesterday and will want to save some face at home in the final game. Plus they have some boppers like Webb, Tronc, Scott, O'Donnell and even Southern. The Eels have no go forward. If we can do our job on Saturday night then we will have the Dogs because they will either beat the Panthers or Melbourne will beat Manly at home. 1 of those 2 will happen so the Raiders have to win and hope for the Eels to trip up which is likely.

 

[aussies1st]

Zillman still managed 2 tries in that thrashing by the Knights, that takes some effort and shows hes more than ready for FG.

 

[azza]

I wouldn't say he is "more than ready for first grade" - his positional play at fullback was clearly something that needed work when he last played in firsts.

However I do agree that he probably offers more than most of our other players in his ability to create something out of nothing; whether that ability immediately shows itself in first grade remains to be seen. It took Carney a fair amount of time to make the jump, although I get the feeling Zillman will adapt quicker. Obviously with Schif there, he would have to play off the bench in all likelihood so that will not put the same pressure on him as would be the case at fullback.

Elliott won't play him this year, though.

 

[Chachi]

Bringing in Zillman now could either be a masterstroke or a complete disaster.

For once I agree with Phil Gould in that the competition this year has been very even (apart from the Storm) and often entertaining, but pretty low on consistent quality from all other teams. The Storm are far from unbeatable, yet they have been dominant through the brilliance of a couple of players (particularly Inglis and Smith, but you could add Webster, Slater and maybe Geyer and Hoffman on their day). This tells me that the premiership is up for grabs for anyone willing to throw the dice and have a crack with something different - ala the Tigers last year.

As reasonable as Frawley was on Saturday, it was an absolute joke that he got a call up over Zillman who I would say is clearly the best player in the whole of Premier League. Our team is not picked on form, it is picked on someones opinion of who will be the "safest" option. If Lomu wasn't injured he'd probably still be there over Tilse and if Kahler wasn't injured earlier then Thurling would never have got a crack. Bloody Josh Miller only got a run after everyone else dropped dead last year.

Zilly is not going to win us the comp, but he could provide the spark open up the game and release the potential of Carney, Graham and Mogg. It's not going to happen, but IMO it would have been nice to see and quite entertaining rather than "Jason Smith predictable". I'd love to be proven wrong, but I ain't holding my breath.

 

[Raider_69]

his positional play at fullback was suspect because frankly, he is not a fullback, his talent allows him to do a good fill job of that position in PL but he will always be found out at Fullback in NRL level IMO, his size is not helpful for a fullback either

He is a half and thats exactly where he should be playing next season in FG
id play him from the bench, with Dobbo and Carney starting, it gives us many options and given he can fill in anywhere in the backline, it covers us for injurys aswell. Zillman was our MOTM in that thrashing for the knights, the only shimmering light of a dog ordinary game... he showed enough in that game to warrent more game time then he has gotten

Whats his tally from the last 4 games? 13 tries or something?

 

[azza]

It's very easy to say "he isn't a fullback, he is a half and so should be playing there" - in fact, that was the view I held for awhile, but now I'm not so sure. You need to take into account the balance of the team. It normally isn't a good idea to have two halves whose strengths are their running games, and that is the case with both Zillman and Carney. I suspect this is why we may see Dobson in the 7 at some stage next year - the need for an organisational half. Then again, in PL I would often see Carney do a pretty good job of organising the team around him, but I don't think that talent has transferred into firsts as yet, it's more his runnin game which has shone. I don't think playing Zillman from the bench is an ideal long term option, either.

I guess we need to be wary of not putting Goodwin on the outer either, certainly looks a fine prospect.

 

[Raider_69]

indeed azz
which is why id lean to Goodwin as fullback next year
Dobson at half organising things, Carney at 5/8th feeding the backs with long balls and taking the line on himself

and then Zillman eased into FG via the bench in a Bowen style halfback role, where he roams around with no real set in stone. Eventually once he finds his feet, he will be starting 5/8th. And i imagine Carney's organisational skills will as you say eventually come to the fore in FG and he will take over as Half, probably pushing Dobson to another team... some hard decisions are going to have to be made in the next 3-4 years

Carney, Zillman, Dobson and Herbert (gone abit off the boil as of late) are all vying for 2, maybe 3 positions in FG. Perhaps even Josh McCrone if he comes on quickly

 

[woodgers]

So basically some people are ruling him out as a potential fullback due to the fact that 1 game he played in firsts, the team got belted and his positional play wasn't the best so strike it off the list forever.

Fantastic.

Play him at halfback I say. Carney can organise and is more of a passing half than a running 1.

 

[greeneyed]

As Woodgers has said, anyone who has seen anything of Carney in PL will know that Carney is not simply a "running" half... he is damn good at organising too. His passing game is brilliant... his kicking game is superb... it might not all be showing in first grade yet, but anyone who has seen Carney in action knows he is the complete player and will show it in first grade.... Put Zillman beside him in the halves now, and we have the makings of a Premiership winning side, IMO.

Dobson is fine... but I don't think he's the most talented of the crop of up and coming players.... Herbert at hooker... Carney and Zillman in the halves and Goodwin at fullback are the future of the club IMO.

 

[Bay56]

I agree with the "roll the dice" theory and I also would prefer to see Zillman in a halves role rather than FB.

I've seen enough of both Zillman and Goodwin to know which one will be better suited to FB and which one at 6 or 7.

As far as going past round one of the finals .... well we can go with the 'tried and proven' Withers or roll it with Zillman. Zillman will attract far more attention of the defence in one game than Withers will in a whole season .. and the fact is we only have one shot at it. If that, at the very least, results in gaps for others such as Carney we will be on a winner.

 

[Walt Flanigan]

I agree with the "roll the dice" theory and I also would prefer to see Zillman in a halves role rather than FB.

I've seen enough of both Zillman and Goodwin to know which one will be better suited to FB and which one at 6 or 7.

Have you seen much of Dobson though? This guy is gonna make a killer halfback, Alfie style in my opinion. I'd rather Zillman at fullback or in the centres.

 

[azza]

So basically some people are ruling him out as a potential fullback due to the fact that 1 game he played in firsts, the team got belted and his positional play wasn't the best so strike it off the list forever.

Fantastic.

Play him at halfback I say. Carney can organise and is more of a passing half than a running 1.

I don't know what's happened to you in recent times Woodgers but geez you've become a master at misquoting people. When did I ever say I ruled him out as a potenital fullback? All I said was is that his positional play needed work.

Additionally, I have not ruled out Carney as an organisational half. In fact I did say his performances in PL indicate he has organisational ability. It's just not the part of his game that has showed through in firsts as yet.

 

[skeepe]

If Jason Smith's knees don't recover in time, Zillman will play five-eighth against the Sharks - if his hamstring recovers in time.

 

[Sydney_Raider]

If Parra win on Friday night it becomes a bit of a nothing game (apart from momentum in to finals), why not name Zillman on the bench (5 man if necessary) and make a final decision on Saturday.

I hope 2007 sees Goodwin at fullback, Zillman and Carney in the halves and then let form dictate it from there on. After watching Withers, I am hoping Dunneman can offer something at hooker.

 

[peter_raiders]

In 2007 for the fullback/halves/hooker positions we have Goodwin, Zillman, Carney, Dobson, Dunneman and Withers all vying for spots. The only certainties are Carney, Withers and Dunneman IMO. That leaves the fullback spot and perhaps a place on the bench open. Dobson isn't coming back here for nothing so i suspect he'll get the bench position which leaves Zilly at fullback. Goodwin will be at the Roosters before we know it unless Henry pairs Zillman in the centres with Graham? I dunno if that would work i haven't seen enough of him, but gee i can't wait til '07.

That's a whole other story but. Time to smash the Sharks this week.

 

[woodgers]

Why Dunny-man Peter?

I don't reckon he'll be in the mix. He'll come here and will be seen as frequently as Nathan Barnes was!

 

[woodgers]

I don't know what's happened to you in recent times Woodgers but geez you've become a master at misquoting people. When did I ever say I ruled him out as a potenital fullback? All I said was is that his positional play needed work.

Additionally, I have not ruled out Carney as an organisational half. In fact I did say his performances in PL indicate he has organisational ability. It's just not the part of his game that has showed through in firsts as yet.

:lol: I guess I did!

I was thinking about what most people have been saying about Zillman when I wrote that, not bagging you. I was also just giving my thoughts on Carney rather than responding to anyone. Either way i'll be sure to read things twice before I respond now although a large majority of stuff written on here is painful to read once at best!

 

[azza]

Woodgers - just take anything Tokyo_Raider says with a pinch of salt and you'll be right, my friend :lol: .

 

[peter_raiders]

Why Dunny-man Peter?

I don't reckon he'll be in the mix. He'll come here and will be seen as frequently as Nathan Barnes was!

I hope that's the case. But why would they pay a 30+ year old the big bucks and bring him back from the UK to play PL? He's the most experienced half so he'll be in the mix for sure i just hope that all the young halves get a chance.

 

[Dave Q]

Just dropped in from souths, although the sharks have accredited me below. Elliot is desperately sought after at Penrith. They want him yesterday.

And good luck in the finals lads.