Divided rugby league fell 25 years ago – but united has it conquered? by Steve Mascord.

[Perth Red]

Care to elaborate?

New owner Carlo LiViolsi guaranteed finances for all Toronto's costs and all English teams flights and accommodation...it wouldn't have costed the ESL a cent and the clubs voted them out purely for self preservation. How else would you explain it ?

It was a free kick into the richest sporting market in the world and they said "No Thanks, we'd prefer Liegh" !
It's the equivalent of me giving you a free lotto ticket and you saying " No thanks, the ticket will take up too much room in my wallet "

Toronto stopped paying players and bills, they were built on a pack of cards and contributed nothing to SL revenue through tv or anything else. No SL club was at risk of being relegated if Toronto were allowed in, so where was the risk for them? They looked at the bid and seriously questioned the overly optimistic revenue targets. David Argyle was still a co owner and was shown to be dodgy as hell.

“ However, our review of the club's recent submission identified a number of areas of concern, particularly regarding the aggressive revenue targets on which the financial forecasts are based.

"As part of our comprehensive investigation into this whole subject , Super League appointed an independent committee of sports industry experts, with representation from The RFL, to examine commercial opportunities for rugby league in Canada.

"Its findings were unanimous - that operating a team in a fiercely competitive North American sports market was non-strategic and added no material incremental revenue to Super League in the short or medium term."

It was an overwhelming vote of 8-4. Every club who has gone bust and been unable to fulfill fixtures has been great the same way, but we should have an exception for a far flung club with a chequered history?

its a real shame, they looked to be potentially the first genuine expansion club to be a success, but as with a lot in rl it was mostly just veneer. The crowds showed some level of interest and one day a succesful North American League may emerge With Toronto in it.

there was no request, bid or approach for any of the nth American teams you mentioned to join SL Or lower divisions to earn their place in SL.

if SL wanted to get serious about expansion, Toulouse, London and wales would be the areas I’d be admitting,

 

[taste2taste]

Toronto stopped paying players and bills, they were built on a pack of cards and contributed nothing to SL revenue through tv or anything else. No SL club was at risk of being relegated if Toronto were allowed in, so where was the risk for them? They looked at the bid and seriously questioned the overly optimistic revenue targets. David Argyle was still a co owner and was shown to be dodgy as hell.

“ However, our review of the club's recent submission identified a number of areas of concern, particularly regarding the aggressive revenue targets on which the financial forecasts are based.

"As part of our comprehensive investigation into this whole subject , Super League appointed an independent committee of sports industry experts, with representation from The RFL, to examine commercial opportunities for rugby league in Canada.

"Its findings were unanimous - that operating a team in a fiercely competitive North American sports market was non-strategic and added no material incremental revenue to Super League in the short or medium term."

It was an overwhelming vote of 8-4. Every club who has gone bust and been unable to fulfill fixtures has been great the same way, but we should have an exception for a far flung club with a chequered history?

its a real shame, they looked to be potentially the first genuine expansion club to be a success, but as with a lot in rl it was mostly just veneer. The crowds showed some level of interest and one day a succesful North American League may emerge With Toronto in it.

there was no request, bid or approach for any of the nth American teams you mentioned to join SL Or lower divisions to earn their place in SL.

if SL wanted to get serious about expansion, Toulouse, London and wales would be the areas I’d be admitting,

You always put forward a good argument and more often than not I agree with you but on this occasion we'll have to agree to disagree.

Toronto folded largely due to the obstacles thrown at them from Covid, LiViolsi came on board and guaranteed all finances moving forward. Yes there were risks but even if Toroto folded it wouldn't have costed the ESL anything.

The claim that Toronto wouldn't have added value to the ESL is bamboozling. A team that increases interest and exposes the ESL to a new television audience isn't of value ? Really ?

Despite the risks, the ESL arent in a position they can turn down a free ticket into the worlds richest sporting market.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

The NFL takes numerous games to London each year. These games draw sell-out crowds in huge stadia.

The London Broncos were lucky to draw a couple of thousand to their games when they were in Super League.

We need to crack the London market for the game to grow in England.

 

[Phil McGrawhan]

The NFL takes numerous games to London each year. These games draw sell-out crowds in huge stadia.

The London Broncos were lucky to draw a couple of thousand to their games when they were in Super League.

We need to crack the London market for the game to grow in England.

Baby steps please.
Logan first.
Singapore next.
London.
the world.( excluding Perth)
The Milky Way
The Universe .

 

[siv]

Baby steps please.
Logan first.
Singapore next.
London.
the world.( excluding Perth)
The Milky Way
The Universe .

Why stop there

We still have multi-dimensions to conquer

 

[MugaB]

Baby steps please.
Logan first.
Singapore next.
London.
the world.( excluding Perth)
The Milky Way
The Universe .

NIB logo will take over every facet of life before then

 

[Perth Red]

The NFL takes numerous games to London each year. These games draw sell-out crowds in huge stadia.

The London Broncos were lucky to draw a couple of thousand to their games when they were in Super League.

We need to crack the London market for the game to grow in England.

In their brisbane broncos/Richard Branson golden era broncos drew respectable 8k plus crowds. I remember being on the tube and seeing massive poster of Martin offiah with flames behind him advertising the broncos.
london actually have a half decent grassroots scene and has produced home grown talent. Problem with expansion clubs in SL is they require significant long term extra funding to get established, SL can’t afford to supply it and owners usually run out enthusiasm after a few years.
the new home ground of the broncos is arguably the best they have had and could finally provide them with a long term home that they can build a fanbase around. Need to get them back into SL though.

Always thought the RFL should try and get lottery funding to target the council estate areas of London. Knife and gang crime is rife with the kids in those areas and RL could provide the perfect vehicle to give kids something more productive to do with their time.

 

[Perth Red]

You always put forward a good argument and more often than not I agree with you but on this occasion we'll have to agree to disagree.

Toronto folded largely due to the obstacles thrown at them from Covid, LiViolsi came on board and guaranteed all finances moving forward. Yes there were risks but even if Toroto folded it wouldn't have costed the ESL anything.

The claim that Toronto wouldn't have added value to the ESL is bamboozling. A team that increases interest and exposes the ESL to a new television audience isn't of value ? Really ?

Despite the risks, the ESL arent in a position they can turn down a free ticket into the worlds richest sporting market.

Yeh no problem, I’m an expansionist and always gutted when a new club falls over. I’m probably one of the few people in the world that can say they saw Sheffield eagles play the perth reds lol

Would have been fascinating to see if wolfpack had a long term future in SL if covid hadn’t happened. One of those revolving doors moments!
Gutted Toulouse got relegated, Featherstone look very strong this year so hard to see them bouncing back up. Fingers crossed they do though.
personally I’d be happy to Leigh drop out and a 14 team SL comp with London, South Wales and Toulouse in it.

One day I’d love to see Cumbria back as well, just a shame there is no population centre big enough to sustain a SL club in the region, used to be a real RL talent production line.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Yeh no problem, I’m an expansionist and always gutted when a new club falls over. I’m probably one of the few people in the world that can say they saw Sheffield eagles play the perth reds lol

Would have been fascinating to see if wolfpack had a long term future in SL if covid hadn’t happened. One of those revolving doors moments!
Gutted Toulouse got relegated, Featherstone look very strong this year so hard to see them bouncing back up. Fingers crossed they do though.
personally I’d be happy to Leigh drop out and a 14 team SL comp with London, South Wales and Toulouse in it.

One day I’d love to see Cumbria back as well, just a shame there is no population centre big enough to sustain a SL club in the region, used to be a real RL talent production line.

The London Broncos need a ground in a centralised location. It would be great if the Brisbane Broncos used their wealth and connections to turn the London Broncos into a powerhouse.

 

[Phil McGrawhan]

Oh my
Looks like it’s meth o’clock .

 

[Canard]

The London Broncos need a ground in a centralised location. It would be great if the Brisbane Broncos used their wealth and connections to turn the London Broncos into a powerhouse.

London doesn't have a centralised sporting precinct like a Melbourne, so this would be of questionable benefit.

Further, when you consider the cost of land in Central London it makes this vision impossible. It would cost more then the Superleague combined wealth to even make it happen.

I think London should be a focus though, but at a much more realistic level

Something akin to what IMG are proposing

London identified by IMG as key in effort to transform rugby league

IMG have said success in London is high on their agenda when it comes to transforming rugby league’s long-term prospects

www.google.com

NFL do sell out 2 games in London, but RL is much higher participation, awareness and general understanding to the average Londoner (more so then a Victorian for example).

 

[Wb1234]

London doesn't have a centralised sporting precinct like a Melbourne, so this would be of questionable benefit.

Further, when you consider the cost of land in Central London it makes this vision impossible. It would cost more then the Superleague combined wealth to even make it happen.

I think London should be a focus though, but at a much more realistic level

Something akin to what IMG are proposing

London identified by IMG as key in effort to transform rugby league

IMG have said success in London is high on their agenda when it comes to transforming rugby league’s long-term prospects

www.google.com

NFL do sell out 2 games in London, but RL is much higher participation, awareness and general understanding to the average Londoner (more so then a Victorian for example).

Skolars ground I. White heart lane is well located and ideal for an upgrade

 

[Perth Red]

The London Broncos need a ground in a centralised location. It would be great if the Brisbane Broncos used their wealth and connections to turn the London Broncos into a powerhouse.

Their new ground, Plough lane stadium, is perfect for them. 9.2k all seating covered capacity, easy to get to in Wimbledon and good corporate facilities. Its finally a home they can build a long term fanbase at. But they can only do that in SL.

The original Brisbane Broncos ownership didn't work out sadly, but yes more investors with the guy that owns them would certainly help them get to where we need them to be.

AFC Wimbledon

footballgroundguide.com

 

[Pneuma]

Their new ground, Plough lane stadium, is perfect for them. 9.2k all seating covered capacity, easy to get to in Wimbledon and good corporate facilities. Its finally a home they can build a long term fanbase at. But they can only do that in SL.

The original Brisbane Broncos ownership didn't work out sadly, but yes more investors with the guy that owns them would certainly help them get to where we need them to be.

AFC Wimbledon

footballgroundguide.com

View attachment 69739

Here’s a list of all the gambling sites near the ground if you want a pint and a punt after the game!

British Casinos and Gambling in United Kingdom

www.casinocity.ltd.uk

 

[Dark Corner]

The NFL takes numerous games to London each year. These games draw sell-out crowds in huge stadia.

The London Broncos were lucky to draw a couple of thousand to their games when they were in Super League.

We need to crack the London market for the game to grow in England.

f**k London it's a third world country in a Modern City...they like Soccer and the odd NFL game.

 

[Pneuma]

f**k London it's a third world country in a Modern City...they like Soccer and the odd NFL game.

And bankrupt rugby clubs?

 

[Dark Corner]

And bankrupt rugby clubs?

And never liked League.

 

[Wb1234]

And never liked League.

Bit harsh

going back to the 1930s London has gotten excellent crowds to club games

super league doesn’t have the money or the desire to expand out of its tiny heartlands

expansion threatens their established clubs as the experience with Toronto showed

 

[Wb1234]

f**k London it's a third world country in a Modern City...they like Soccer and the odd NFL game.

 

[Perth Red]

Thats interesting, the Skolars have always been the quiet achievers of British RL! The group is ARC, mainly been in the fight game up to now, have 3 RL background staff/owners involved in the company.