News Do you care if Israel Folau returns to the NRL?

[The_Frog]

How is this an argument for signing Folau?

Well they've bowed to a social media campaign. The bad press and social media noise, and likely worse, will happen whether he posts further or not. Malcolm Knox is a more eloquent writer than I. Read his article above. Empowered by this, there will be other agendas for the baying mob. This to me isn't good for our society in general. As he says, Folou is finished. If he's lucky Catalans might let him play and maybe he could play rugby in France but he's now basically an exile as a footballer in his homeland.

 

[AJB1102]

No, not like it has. I don't suppose he counted on MSM plastering it all over their publications hundreds of times ensuring widespread dissemination.

Social media is kinda widespread already. He didn't slip a bible verse into someone's DMs which the tele then got a hold of and exposed.

 

[Rugged Rigid Robust Roy]

bible lovers are the new persecuted Christians..

 

[Valheru]

It's a thing because what he said was discriminatory. That's a fact, it's not up for debate. Saying someone is going to hell because they're gay is discrimination based on their sexuality. And it can cause harm.

Suggesting we suppress no speech is ridiculously stupid.

Was it really though? is merely saying something discriminatory?

The meaning according to Oxford is

the practice of treating someone or a particular group in society less fairly than others

https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/american_english/discrimination

Treating and fairly being the operative words in the above. It's not as if hell is a real place and even if it were he isn't the one determining who goes there.

To me treating someone differently or unfairly is tangible i.e. not giving them a job, not allowing them an education or else wise persecuting them in some way.

Now I don't particularly like the fact that people who have such opinions can hide behind religion in an attempt to validate their point of view but if Folau was to be refused employment by the NRL based on a religious belief, does that not fit the definition of discrimination as per above?

 

[Foreign Legion]

What's the big issue? We have Snoop dog singing about drugs, cops and chicks.... all in a bad way and now he's doing menu log like a "Gee" if snoop can sell take out izzy can play NRL

Seems to me that a lot of people have been brain washed by the LGBTQ movement.

 

[The_Frog]

Now I don't particularly like the fact that people who have such opinions can hide behind religion in an attempt to validate their point of view but if Folau was to be refused employment by the NRL based on a religious belief, does that not fit the definition of discrimination as per above?

They haven't refused him based on his religion, or else they'd have to refuse literally hundreds of others. They've refused him because of the trouble they believe his participation would bring to them and the game.

 

[The_Frog]

bible lovers are the new persecuted Christians..

Use to be blacks, then it was gays, now it's the devout. Who will it be next?

 

[Valheru]

They haven't refused him based on his religion, or else they'd have to refuse literally hundreds of others. They've refused him because of the trouble they believe his participation would bring to them and the game.

Yes well that's true or at least that is the line the NRL would take.

As it stands they haven't actually refused his registration at all, the dragons have declined to sign him which is their right.

 

[Bazal]

Was it really though? is merely saying something discriminatory?

The meaning according to Oxford is

the practice of treating someone or a particular group in society less fairly than others

https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/american_english/discrimination

Treating and fairly being the operative words in the above. It's not as if hell is a real place and even if it were he isn't the one determining who goes there.

To me treating someone differently or unfairly is tangible i.e. not giving them a job, not allowing them an education or else wise persecuting them in some way.

Now I don't particularly like the fact that people who have such opinions can hide behind religion in an attempt to validate their point of view but if Folau was to be refused employment by the NRL based on a religious belief, does that not fit the definition of discrimination as per above?

It would be a matter for a legal decision but precedent would likely say no, because it's easily demonstrable that it was a result of his actions, not his beliefs. Plenty of other Christians are playing the game without issues.

For example (as a blunt example) you couldn't just not show up to work for a month and, when asked about it, say "oh I had a religious festival". You could easily be sacked for that because there are absentee procedures to follow, for example. You may have protection to believe and even practice your religion, but in this case your actions are unacceptable to the business.

But as I said it would be an interesting case because it comes down to the agreed policies as against the Act.

 

[Exsilium]

Use to be blacks, then it was gays, now it's the devout. Who will it be next?

Bald people.

 

[The_Frog]

Yes well that's true or at least that is the line the NRL would take.

As it stands they haven't actually refused his registration at all, the dragons have declined to sign him which is their right.

Way to dodge a bullet. It does seem odd that the Dragons board agreed to investigate signing him and sent the coach to meet with him, but didn't consider the likely backlash. I'd guess there was a phone call made.

 

[Valheru]

It would be a matter for a legal decision but precedent would likely say no, because it's easily demonstrable that it was a result of his actions, not his beliefs. Plenty of other Christians are playing the game without issues.

For example (as a blunt example) you couldn't just not show up to work for a month and, when asked about it, say "oh I had a religious festival". You could easily be sacked for that because there are absentee procedures to follow, for example. You may have protection to believe and even practice your religion, but in this case your actions are unacceptable to the business.

But as I said it would be an interesting case because it comes down to the agreed policies as against the Act.

Very good point.

I guess the counter to that would be that you are referring to someone's actions whilst employed. This is slightly different in that he was punished by then employer and is seeking new employment.

Having said that, in the example you give the prospective employer could ring the previous employer for a reference check and decline employment based on that incident.

 

[Perth Red]

bible lovers are the new persecuted Christians..

Can we feed them to the drop bears?

 

[Perth Red]

Was it really though? is merely saying something discriminatory?

The meaning according to Oxford is

the practice of treating someone or a particular group in society less fairly than others

https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/american_english/discrimination

Treating and fairly being the operative words in the above. It's not as if hell is a real place and even if it were he isn't the one determining who goes there.

To me treating someone differently or unfairly is tangible i.e. not giving them a job, not allowing them an education or else wise persecuting them in some way.

Now I don't particularly like the fact that people who have such opinions can hide behind religion in an attempt to validate their point of view but if Folau was to be refused employment by the NRL based on a religious belief, does that not fit the definition of discrimination as per above?

Id say yes. I think if you publicly single out a group of people who have a very long history of persecutions and mistreatment and say who they are is evil, that its the work of the devil and that they are going to hell unless they stop being who they are and become who he/the bible/ his religion wants them to be then thats a very clear cut case of persecution. The definition of treating is "the manner in which someone behaves towards or deals with someone or something". Clearly through his language and behavior posting this is what he is doing.
And again whilst any sensible person knows man made constructs such as gods, devils, hell and heaven are made up, that doesnt stop this type of behavior fueling ongoing persecutions of a group of people by providing legitimacy that they are somehow abnormal, deviant or sinners. The good thing to come out of it is the decent people of the world standing up in greater and greater numbers and saying this isnt ok anymore regardless if you want to hide your homophobia behind the veil of a fictional book.

 

[Perth Red]

Use to be blacks, then it was gays, now it's the devout. Who will it be next?

Yeh its terrible how persecuted minority groups are now no longer being persecuted. What a world we live in!

 

[The_Frog]

single out a group of people

say who they are is evil

Now you're making things up.

 

[The Rosco]

Id say yes. I think if you publicly single out a group of people who have a very long history of persecutions and mistreatment and say who they are is evil, that its the work of the devil and that they are going to hell unless they stop being who they are and become who he/the bible/ his religion wants them to be then thats a very clear cut case of persecution. The definition of treating is "the manner in which someone behaves towards or deals with someone or something". Clearly through his language and behavior posting this is what he is doing.
And again whilst any sensible person knows man made constructs such as gods, devils, hell and heaven are made up, that doesnt stop this type of behavior fueling ongoing persecutions of a group of people by providing legitimacy that they are somehow abnormal, deviant or sinners. The good thing to come out of it is the decent people of the world standing up in greater and greater numbers and saying this isnt ok anymore regardless if you want to hide your homophobia behind the veil of a fictional book.

. . . . . He didn't SINGLE them out. Far from it..
In his quoting of the bible ( someone else's words, not Izzy's ) the thieves, adulterers, Fornicators, drunks, idolaters, and others are all listed as going to hell. Long bow to draw saying he singled out the gays when in fact they were in a group of 7 or 8 others.
If you see the bible as a fictional book, why the hell would you be SO wound up by anything it says ?
But do rant on.

 

[The_Frog]

Having said that, in the example you give the prospective employer could ring the previous employer for a reference check and decline employment based on that incident.

That would hold true had he not taken them to court and received a settlement. If they'd acted impeccably they would not have had to pay him a cent.

 

[Zadar]

. . . . . He didn't SINGLE them out. Far from it..
In his quoting of the bible ( someone else's words, not Izzy's ) the thieves, adulterers, Fornicators, drunks, idolaters, and others are all listed as going to hell. Long bow to draw saying he singled out the gays when in fact they were in a group of 7 or 8 others.
If you see the bible as a fictional book, why the hell would you be SO wound up by anything it says ?
But do rant on.

what I do find amusing is the amount of people we all know that don’t believe in the “fictional book” who then go out and buy Christmas gifts for their families and friends.

 

[AJB1102]

what I do find amusing is the amount of people we all know that don’t believe in the “fictional book” who then go out and buy Christmas gifts for their families and friends.

Christmas is a commercial holiday now not a religious observance.