Eels in the media

[Poupou Escobar]

Gutherson didn't win that finals match by himself. And Trbojevic has played in a winning origin series. So those stats or facts are pretty meaningless.

No player wins matches by himself, though it can appear so if you don't consider all the facts. Even Jason Taumalolo doesn't 'win' many matches single-handed these days. He must have become a worse player. Someone looking for a narrative might say he is not having a go now that his future is assured.

But I think it's obvious Tom Trbojevic is a better player than Gutherson. The fact he plays Origin (despite playing in an ordinary club side) is proof of that. The point though is that just being (or having) the better player doesn't guarantee the team will be better, especially under a salary cap. Tom Trbojevic has played 6 games against Parramatta for 4 losses. Gutherson has beaten Manly 5 times with only one loss. Despite being a worse player.

 

[I'm a loser baby...]

The other way of looking at the amount of touches he gets is that he has the highest involvement rate of those mentioned. If that leads to the highest of any positive stat, LB,s LBA's TA's, then I dare say that's a net positive.

I'd also add on the average meters run front that Gutho suffers there on lack of kick return meters, now it might be that he's just poor at returning kicks, or it might be that we have other guys who are much better at it. Or it also might be that he very very rarely drops the ball and merkins would rather kick to the likes of Fergo or Sivo

Run meters minus KR meters

Turbo 177.5 - 45 = 132.5
Tedesco 205 - 65.5 = 139.5
RTS 206.2 - 65.5 = 152.1
Ponga 127.9 - 39.4 = Pretty shit acttually

Gutho 161.5 - 40.3 = 121.2

So not all that far off Turbo and teddy.

It's a net positive if we're better off with him getting more ball at the expense of the halves but that's the question.
Yeah fair point on the run metres. Where he really lacks is line breaks. I'm not saying he's not a very good fullback but it's not a ridiculous suggestion.

 

[Noise]

Manly have some huge contracts in their roster, meaning the worst player in their top 17 has generally been worse than ours. That's why we win more games than them.

Do we? In 2017 we did, but not since then.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Over the past year we won more games than them (including finals), as well as over the past three, four and five years. Over the past two years we've won as many games as Manly.

 

[Noise]

Over the past year we won more games than them (including finals), as well as over the past three, four and five years. Over the past two years we've won as many games as Manly.

Huh? In 2019 we won 14 regular season games and finished on 30 points. Manly also won 14 regular season games and finished on 30 points. https://www.nrl.com/ladder/ We won 1 finals game. Manly also won 1 finals game. That equals the same amount of wins. How did we win more games than them in 2019?
In 2018 they won 1 more game than us. So over the past 2 years they have won more games than us.

 

[hineyrulz]

Huh? In 2019 we won 14 regular season games and finished on 30 points. Manly also won 14 regular season games and finished on 30 points. https://www.nrl.com/ladder/ We won 1 finals game. Manly also won 1 finals game. That equals the same amount of wins. How did we win more games than them in 2019?
In 2018 they won 1 more game than us. So over the past 2 years they have won more games than us.

But but stats!!

 

[strider]

Huh? In 2019 we won 14 regular season games and finished on 30 points. Manly also won 14 regular season games and finished on 30 points. https://www.nrl.com/ladder/ We won 1 finals game. Manly also won 1 finals game. That equals the same amount of wins. How did we win more games than them in 2019?
In 2018 they won 1 more game than us. So over the past 2 years they have won more games than us.

Cos we must have won more of them 4 pt games ... you know the ones where they are 4pts on the ladder instead of 2

 

[Noise]

Cos we must have won more of them 4 pt games ... you know the ones where they are 4pts on the ladder instead of 2

I hope we win some of those 4 pointers in 2020 too.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Huh? In 2019 we won 14 regular season games and finished on 30 points. Manly also won 14 regular season games and finished on 30 points. https://www.nrl.com/ladder/ We won 1 finals game. Manly also won 1 finals game. That equals the same amount of wins. How did we win more games than them in 2019?
In 2018 they won 1 more game than us. So over the past 2 years they have won more games than us.

I forgot they won a finals game this year because their win was shit and ours was awesome.

 

[Twizzle]

Guth did pretty well in the rep games at the end of the season and he was no 19 for SOO.

Regardless of what negative twist some may chose yo put on him, that's not too shabby.

You cant have rep players in too many spots, he'll do me for a FB.

 

[lingard]

So all stats are meaningless then?
And there is a general stat for all those things. It’s called wins

I think a lot of them are, yes. Not all. I think there is an absolute over-reliance on stats - not just in sport, but the world in general. I've seen so many instances where people quote stats that really don't mean a bloody thing. So maybe I'm biased. Also, I'm getting the strong impression that you won't agree with anything that I say. So, to save you the bother, let's just say that from now on anything I post, you don't agree with, and that'll save you a post.

 

[lingard]

No player wins matches by himself, though it can appear so if you don't consider all the facts. Even Jason Taumalolo doesn't 'win' many matches single-handed these days. He must have become a worse player. Someone looking for a narrative might say he is not having a go now that his future is assured.

But I think it's obvious Tom Trbojevic is a better player than Gutherson. The fact he plays Origin (despite playing in an ordinary club side) is proof of that. The point though is that just being (or having) the better player doesn't guarantee the team will be better, especially under a salary cap. Tom Trbojevic has played 6 games against Parramatta for 4 losses. Gutherson has beaten Manly 5 times with only one loss. Despite being a worse player.

So you agree with me?

 

[lingard]

Guth did pretty well in the rep games at the end of the season and he was no 19 for SOO.

Regardless of what negative twist some may chose yo put on him, that's not too shabby.

You cant have rep players in too many spots, he'll do me for a FB.

He'll do me for a fullback, too. But in an ideal world I'd have him at centre and someone like Ben Barba, at fullback. It's just a hypothetical discussion.

 

[Twizzle]

He'll do me for a fullback, too. But in an ideal world I'd have him at centre and someone like Ben Barba, at fullback. It's just a hypothetical discussion.

fair question for off season discussion, got any more ?

 

[Noise]

He'll do me for a fullback, too. But in an ideal world I'd have him at centre and someone like Ben Barba, at fullback. It's just a hypothetical discussion.

fair question for off season discussion, got any more ?

I don’t think he asked a question.

 

[Gary Gutful]

I love having Waqa and Jennings in the centres. I wouldn't f**k with that combo and thankfully I doubt BA will either.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

So you agree with me?

I disagree stats are meaningless. But if you believe rugby league isn't just about having the best fulback then I agree with you.

 

[Happy MEel]

I love having Waqa and Jennings in the centres. I wouldn't f**k with that combo and thankfully I doubt BA will either.

Spot on...and Guth is probably the ideal fullback to feed them good ball.

 

[Noise]

I love having Waqa and Jennings in the centres. I wouldn't f**k with that combo and thankfully I doubt BA will either.

I think we could prob mix up who plays inside and outside centre though.

 

[lingard]

I disagree stats are meaningless. But if you believe rugby league isn't just about having the best fulback then I agree with you.

It's about having the best inside centre, obviously.