End promotion and relegation

[Gobsmacked]

What next for Toulouse as they head for relegation from Super League?

The supposed promised land that Toulouse had been striving to reach for the best part of 20 years has almost come and gone in a flash.

www.loverugbyleague.com

 

[Perth Red]

Here you go you can now tell them what you prefer. SL review survey:

https://endeavoranalytics.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_2t6W0SEC2qDdP8y

 

[Gobsmacked]

Here you go you can now tell them what you prefer. SL review survey:

https://endeavoranalytics.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_2t6W0SEC2qDdP8y

Thanks, just did it .

Here you go you can now tell them what you prefer. SL review survey:

https://endeavoranalytics.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_2t6W0SEC2qDdP8y

Thanks. Just did it.

 

[Campion]

I guess they've got nothing Toulouse in their final game.

 

[Gobsmacked]

Here's a case for Promotion and Relegation:
Restrict it to the north of England, where they advocate for it.
North England a 10 team franchise block, then do whatever dumb shxt you want to do there and let the rest of the game move forward.

 

[Irish-bulldog]

Jesus I just watched my first super league game in ages and it was woeful, the Leeds game, was like watching D grade at Redcliffe, like 20 errors in the first half.
The standard has really dropped from when I remember watching it.

I really think the relegation system is killing the league, they don’t have enough money in the game for it, they are trying to keep championship teams alive , but your watering down the product. You don’t give teams a chance to get sponsorship dollars, supports and development of players.

I honestly think they need to focus on say 16 top teams across Europe, they need to bite the bullet and follow an NRL model.

 

[Perth Red]

Jesus I just watched my first super league game in ages and it was woeful, the Leeds game, was like watching D grade at Redcliffe, like 20 errors in the first half.
The standard has really dropped from when I remember watching it.

I really think the relegation system is killing the league, they don’t have enough money in the game for it, they are trying to keep championship teams alive , but your watering down the product. You don’t give teams a chance to get sponsorship dollars, supports and development of players.

I honestly think they need to focus on say 16 top teams across Europe, they need to bite the bullet and follow an NRL model.

Like nrl some games are good, some are bog avg. SL problem lies in revenue and the challenges of being up against soccer and union which are bigger and more national sports.

 

[Brian potter]

You can never do away with P&R in england for the simple reason it would destroy the game below super league and the game of RL isn’t strong enough to drive these fans away from the sport.

Plus there isn’t a magical number of new teams and fans from big cities like Liverpool, Manchester and Birmingham etc willing to join super league to take their place.

 

[Irish-bulldog]

You can never do away with P&R in england for the simple reason it would destroy the game below super league and the game of RL isn’t strong enough to drive these fans away from the sport.

Plus there isn’t a magical number of new teams and fans from big cities like Liverpool, Manchester and Birmingham etc willing to join super league to take their place.

What’s the answer then ? I’m concerned when this is the best of the best super league has to offer ? It’s a real problem,

2022 Super League Dream Team:​

1. Jai Field (Wigan)

2. Bevan French (Wigan)

3. Shaun Kenny-Dowall (Hull KR)

4. Tim Lafai (Salford)

5. Ken Sio (Salford)

6. Jack Welsby (St Helens)

7. Brodie Croft (Salford)

8. Alex Walmsley (St Helens)

9. James Roby (St Helens)

10. Mikolaj Oledzki (Leeds)

11. Chris McQueen (Huddersfield)

12. Liam Farrell (Wigan)

13. Morgan Knowles (St Helens)

 

[Brian potter]

What’s the answer then ? I’m concerned when this is the best of the best super league has to offer ? It’s a real problem,

2022 Super League Dream Team:​

1. Jai Field (Wigan)

2. Bevan French (Wigan)

3. Shaun Kenny-Dowall (Hull KR)

4. Tim Lafai (Salford)

5. Ken Sio (Salford)

6. Jack Welsby (St Helens)

7. Brodie Croft (Salford)

8. Alex Walmsley (St Helens)

9. James Roby (St Helens)

10. Mikolaj Oledzki (Leeds)

11. Chris McQueen (Huddersfield)

12. Liam Farrell (Wigan)

13. Morgan Knowles (St Helens)

The answer is that the sport accepts what it actually is and not something that it will never be i.e. a niche northern sport and not a summer alternative to the premier league played in big cities from Liverpool to London and Belfast to Bristol.

In short we need to strengthen what we’ve already got at all levels and target new untapped expansion areas within the periphery of the heartlands of the game.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

The answer is pretty simple. The only way out of the current situation is money. The easiest way for that money to come into the game is France. As Catalans got, give Toulouse a few years exempt from relegation to get established because it's for the strategic benefit of the game.

Will the addition of Toulouse alone get us a good French TV deal? Probably not, but it certainly helps more than them not being there, they are the fourth largest French city. Once Toulouse are in SL, we need French team number 3 working their way through the leagues. I would say critical mass would be 3 - 4 French clubs. But once we are there we will have the extra revenue and that will be to the benefit of all the English clubs too that made the sacrifice to allow this to happen.

BTW, I would afford London the same exemption if they are promoted for strategic growth reasons.

 

[England87]

100%.

The dream is a 12 team first division and a 12 team second division with 4 French clubs protected in the pyramid. 2 up and 2 down.

At this stage I would take two divisions of 10. With Toulouse at this stage in the second tier.

 

[Perth Red]

IF the SL actually had funding to invest in new markets and clubs then a 14 club, with goals to move to 16 clubs license system would be the best outcome.

Current 12 this year plus London and a Welsh club would be my choice for a variety of reasons. If Bradford ever got their sht back together they would be in and then either another french club or Newcastle would be possibilities for club 16.

Taking away the promotion dream is hard but it would at least give the next two leagues a clear and fair comp of PT clubs to play in. Most of these clubs draw less than 2k and realistically are never going to survive in SL, and if they do get there add very little in terms of value to SL. They could become feeder clubs to SL in terms of player development and be funded accordingly.

If a SL team can no longer maintain its license then an open tender process could be used to fill the spot.

 

[Gobsmacked]

IF the SL actually had funding to invest in new markets and clubs then a 14 club, with goals to move to 16 clubs license system would be the best outcome.

Current 12 this year plus London and a Welsh club would be my choice for a variety of reasons. If Bradford ever got their sht back together they would be in and then either another french club or Newcastle would be possibilities for club 16.

Taking away the promotion dream is hard but it would at least give the next two leagues a clear and fair comp of PT clubs to play in. Most of these clubs draw less than 2k and realistically are never going to survive in SL, and if they do get there add very little in terms of value to SL. They could become feeder clubs to SL in terms of player development and be funded accordingly.

If a SL team can no longer maintain its license then an open tender process could be used to fill the spot.

 

[Tigers1986]

IF the SL actually had funding to invest in new markets and clubs then a 14 club, with goals to move to 16 clubs license system would be the best outcome.

Current 12 this year plus London and a Welsh club would be my choice for a variety of reasons. If Bradford ever got their sht back together they would be in and then either another french club or Newcastle would be possibilities for club 16.

Taking away the promotion dream is hard but it would at least give the next two leagues a clear and fair comp of PT clubs to play in. Most of these clubs draw less than 2k and realistically are never going to survive in SL, and if they do get there add very little in terms of value to SL. They could become feeder clubs to SL in terms of player development and be funded accordingly.

If a SL team can no longer maintain its license then an open tender process could be used to fill the spot.

Crusaders had some potential before they gave up with the license system. I'd even go all in and try for Scotland and the disgruntled rugby folks, or Ireland, if they really wanted it that way.

16 team SL, running a super 8's type of system for P/R between Championship and SL.

 

[Gobsmacked]

Clearly broken system. Same club demoted every year and the same club wins every year
Liegh to be demoted and Saints to win.
How exciting

 

[Perth Red]

Clearly broken system. Same club demoted every year and the same club wins every year
Liegh to be demoted and Saints to win.
How exciting

I’d suggest it’s got a lot more to do with the big gap in salary cap spend and jnr investment than p&r!

watching the likes of tigers, titans, warriors and knights bumbling at the bottom year after year with no consequence is hardly exciting either I’d suggest

 

[Gobsmacked]

I’d suggest it’s got a lot more to do with the big gap in salary cap spend and jnr investment than p&r!

watching the likes of tigers, titans, warriors and knights bumbling at the bottom year after year with no consequence is hardly exciting either I’d suggest

If it has nothing to do with P&R....
Toulouse would be able to invest in juniors on an infinite timeline, sign players to long term deals and have long term lucrative sponsorship opportunities and media deals.

The clubs least likely to be demoted are more likely to attract good players on long term deals, better sponsorship, sell more tickets..... so on and so on.
So the best clubs just get better.

At least the Tigers can develop juniors and pathways for a long term strategy to get off the bottom- they've just created a 5 year coaching succession plan whereby Benji Marshall will be assistant to sheens for 2 years then take over from there.

I actually enjoy your rebuttals, every time you do it makes it even clearer how detrimental P&R is.

It will be scrapped for the last time.

 

[Perth Red]

Yeh it’s almost like the warriors, tigers and knights haven’t been sht for over a decade and haven’t had time to do all that before lol.

 

[Tigers1986]

Ladder positions refutes that. Knights were 7th last year, far from 'sht.' Tigers had plenty of 9-12 finishes as well. If you're going to spew off garbage, back it up.

P/R is an awful concept. As I've said, licences or a return of Super 8's is the way forward.