Expansion success...

[clarency]

Yet again the Rebels lost in the S15's.... by a lot.

I don't follow union (domestic, that is) but I'm wondering how much support they're going to get if they continue losing. Granted they have had some close matches; they don't have those long-term supporters that will stick by them regardless...

Or maybe length of time has nothing to do with it?

Next is of course AFL. The only people who think these new teams will be successful are the AFL admin. The comp is set to significantly drop in quality as Gold Coast are set to be highly unsuccessful, and with the current form of the GWS, Sheedy will be happy he accepted the job as he will soon have the title as the coach with the longest losing streak.

How confident are you that 2 new teams in the NRL won't dilute the quality of the competition?

I remember reading an interview of Bennett a while back regarding what he thought of expansion and the risk of it on the comp as a whole was all he talked about. The fans on the other hand, seem to be busy arguing over who should get in...

Just a thought.

 

[Red Bear]

There might be a minor hit as places open up, but it should also stop the flow of players to england. The standard generally catches up eventually

 

[CC_Roosters]

There might be a minor hit as places open up, but it should also stop the flow of players to england. The standard generally catches up eventually

And that will help everybody including the SL, clubs there will stuggle to get a quick fix NRL player and have to focus more on domestic talent. Granted Leeds, Wigan, Saints and now harlequins have brought the focus back to young british talent now.

 

[Lambretta]

Expansion would have slowed the tide of players going to England, but the English decided to do that themselves some time ago.

The Super League knew that the import situation was a problem and they have looked to set caps on imported player numbers and then looked to improve the development programes the clubs are running. This is great for the European game and long term will benefit international games.

Expansion here will affect the quality of the games, but only in the short term. One of the biggest problems our comp faces at the moment is that alot of players who are good squad men - and equal to alot of other players in talent - just miss out on selection and then end up in the wilderness that reserve grade football has become. For most, slogging it out playing for lower grade teams, without a proper route into first grade means that leaving the game is usually their only option. In our game there is only really first grade or Under 21's these days and it's becoming an issue. When clubs need to draw on experience in times of injury crisis, they have nowhere to go.

Another two clubs will mean that fewer players go to England, but also there will be better player retention as a greater % of players will be on the verge of first grade and will therefore wait for their chance.

The one problem it will create is in the halves. We have untold numbers of good 2nd rowers in our game, many of whom cant get a game, but there is a lack of quality halves. I'm not sure if anyone else noticed in the Parra / Penrith game last night - both sides were screaming out some quality play making behind the forwards. Penrith got their points off intercepts and hard working forwards. But apart from kicks - they looked bereft of ideas in attack at times. Parramatta were just bereft of ideas of any kind from their halves. A greater number of teams will just mean less quality in the halves. Something we can't afford unless we can sort out the reserve grade issue and get some quality of experience in our 2nd tier.

 

[Perth Red]

I'd take Finch and Dobson as our half back pairing if we were kicking off next season.

 

[Lockyer4President!]

Union in Australia just doesn’t have the playerbase to compare with the other major footy codes. When they add news teams they have to use players that weren’t good enough and/or take good players from the other teams. The ARU basically crippled the Reds when the Force came in.

We also have big advantages over the AFL as we have the national U20’s comp developing players, we have NZ/the south pacific/the UK to draw from and we have expats overseas or playing other codes. Not to mention that NSW/QLD are growing faster & and have more people than Vic/WA/SA.


Obviously the comp quality will be diluted when you add two new teams but it won’t last and within a short while we’ll have WA giving us more players aswell… It’s not really an issue.

 

[Perth Red]

Consider this, last year Storm lost 1/3rd of their starting team. They had to find a number of new players to replace some very good players. They didn;t raid other teams, they didn;t sign English SL players or even bring older players back. I have just watched a young Storm team tear the Titans to pieces. Anyone who suggests there isn't enough talent around to make up another two teams is kidding themselves.

 

[RHCP]

The idea that their is a lack of quality halves idea is a complete myth.

Sam Williams was one of the Raiders standout players and can't crack the side this weekend. Jarrod Mullen, Jamie Soward, Mitchell Pearce, Trent Hodkinson and Johnathan Thurston were all the best or up there with the best for their respective sides, and that's without even mentioning the contributions internationals like Darren Lockyer, Cooper Cronk, Benji Marshall or Scott Prince, or exciting debutantes Beau Henry and Daly Cherry-Evans.

Yes, there are plenty of teams with crap halves, but their are just as many teams with crap outside backs or crap forwards.

Of the eight games played on the weekend, 5 halves received maximum points (Mullen, Pearce, Soward, Thurston, McCrone) and 3 others received one point (Henry, Cronk, Kris Keating). That's at least one in every game. I'd hardly call that a lack of quality halves.

I have just watched a young Storm team tear the Titans to pieces. Anyone who suggests there isn't enough talent around to make up another two teams is kidding themselves.

This.

 

[Billythekid]

The AFL struggle for juniors because they only get players from Australia. The NRL attracts players from Australia, NZ and the pacific islands (plus a few from the northern hemisphere).

Union struggles because it has hardly any juniors in Australia and thier are bigger teams overseas for overseas players to go too.

The NRL is in a much better position than both comps to expand and maintain the quality of the comp.

 

[Nugby]

I don't follow union (domestic, that is) but I'm wondering how much support they're going to get if they continue losing. Granted they have had some close matches; they don't have those long-term supporters that will stick by them regardless...

Or maybe length of time has nothing to do with it?

Next is of course AFL. The only people who think these new teams will be successful are the AFL admin.

One thing to keep in mind is that new AFL Clubs are allowed to spend extra money under the salary cap in addition to getting the best juniors. They artifically create a level of success for new clubs that other sports don't (smart bastards!) to generate interest.

 

[muzby]

I'm wondering how much support they're going to get if they continue losing. Granted they have had some close matches; they don't have those long-term supporters that will stick by them regardless...

Or maybe length of time has nothing to do with it?

current precident is at least 44 years...

 

[Perth Red]

One thing to keep in mind is that new AFL Clubs are allowed to spend extra money under the salary cap in addition to getting the best juniors. They artifically create a level of success for new clubs that other sports don't (smart bastards!) to generate interest.

I think it is hypocritical of NRL to criticise the AFL for having rules that benefit new teams and create artificial league standings. The NRL does exactly the same thing by having a salary cap that dumbs down teams so that all are equal. This is equally artifical and is no different to what AFL does with its drafts and concessions for expansion teams.

 

[Knownothing]

The Rebels are privately owned, a lot of Melbourne money behind them. It will take them a while to develop a winning team, but they will. The Western Force struggled to win games in their first two seasons.

 

[dimitri]

I think it is hypocritical of NRL to criticise the AFL for having rules that benefit new teams and create artificial league standings. The NRL does exactly the same thing by having a salary cap that dumbs down teams so that all are equal. This is equally artifical and is no different to what AFL does with its drafts and concessions for expansion teams.

I dont think its hypocritical at all.

Because the AFL also has a salary cap plus the draft. The on top of that they have special living allowances for teams like Sydney/Brisbane, then on top of that they have even extra allowances for new teams.

Not saying it shouldnt be done though.

The Reds were really stuffed around back in 1995 - having to pay team's travel costs. Shows the difference between the 2 codes sometimes

 

[Perth Red]

both codes use an artificial system to ensure clubs are competitive with each other. TBH you never really here of AFL clubs having to off load players due to salary cap restraints, not sure why but I haven;t ever read a story about either WA team having to offload star players.

 

[Eels Dude]

The fact that all the Australian Super 15's sides struggle is shows the depth in RU players here.

Good points made by pretty much everyone above. AFL have larger junior numbers in Australia and have more money. But the amount of rugby league players that head overseas is too early. Some teams will struggle to compete like always, but their are a lot of young players with first grade potential who go to the UK or change to RU instead of persevering is quite staggering. The NRL could hold another 2 sides, no more than that currently though. We don't wanna another repeat of of 1998 competition where you've got bottom 4 sides who cannot even win more than 5 games all season.

 

[Perth Red]

Also with a development pathway we are far more likely to attract/keep jnr talent. For example with our SG Ball side we attracted a top RU jnr (Curtis Rona) to play for the Reds jnrs. He had a great year and has been signed by the Roosters.
http://www.sydneyroosters.com.au/de...&id=3836&player=curtis-rona&team=Roosters-NYC

 

[Ulysseus]

The Perth thing with the distance is a bit of an issue.
I only need to think back to Saints in 2009.
They finished minor premiers, lost one game and had to hop a plane to Brisbane, had they won there they were to hop another plane to Melbourne, had they won there it was another plane back to Sydney.

 

[Ulysseus]

The Perth thing with the distance is a bit of an issue.
I only need to think back to Saints in 2009.
They finished minor premiers, lost one game and had to hop a plane to Brisbane, had they won there they were to hop another plane to Melbourne, had they won there it was another plane back to Sydney.

 

[dimitri]

The Perth thing with the distance is a bit of an issue.
I only need to think back to Saints in 2009.
They finished minor premiers, lost one game and had to hop a plane to Brisbane, had they won there they were to hop another plane to Melbourne, had they won there it was another plane back to Sydney.

Doesnt seem to be an issue with other codes

In Union and Netball, the Perth teams need to make several trips to NZ as well.

If a WA Team was to make finals, they could look at staying on the east coast for a week