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Flanno's New Signings

Dragonsteve2

Juniors
Messages
549
Now you’re being totally ridiculous.

I can assure you I only post as Old Timer and have no other log ins.

By all means contact a moderator if need be.
Old Timer, you know I have almost always respected your views. I have certainly missed your wisdom from this Forum. Can I request you ignore the would be hecklers and produce one of your first rate analyses of where you think the Dragons are at. Why considerable improvement in some games and totally smashed in others. I would ask you if you are willing to do so, try to leave your anti-Flano perspective at a distance. Certainly point out any errors he has made but leave out that he should never have got the appt.
 

Old Timer

Coach
Messages
17,011
Old Timer, you know I have almost always respected your views. I have certainly missed your wisdom from this Forum. Can I request you ignore the would be hecklers and produce one of your first rate analyses of where you think the Dragons are at. Why considerable improvement in some games and totally smashed in others. I would ask you if you are willing to do so, try to leave your anti-Flano perspective at a distance. Certainly point out any errors he has made but leave out that he should never have got the appt.
I believe the root cause of our problem is that as a club and in all things we do it is always a compromise with no clear / definitive direction.

The joining with Illawarra was a compromise

The BOD is always a compromise

The selection of coaches bar Bennett are always a compromise even in the case of Bennett Doust sought a compromise of 3 years not 5

Where to train where to play always a compromise

What jersey to play in always a compromise

Players we recruit always a compromise

We always compromise in respect of unacceptable behaviour of players and staff.

Sadly we have no spine of any description especially in respect of the team.

Until we define our identity and stop making soft decisions we will continue to get results like we do.

We are a neither nor club, with a neither nor team with a neither nor coach.

In respect of what can Flanagan do right now to try & improve our fortunes it’s simple grow some balls and make some tough calls
 

Dragon David

First Grade
Messages
7,724
I believe the root cause of our problem is that as a club and in all things we do it is always a compromise with no clear / definitive direction.

The joining with Illawarra was a compromise

The BOD is always a compromise

The selection of coaches bar Bennett are always a compromise even in the case of Bennett Doust sought a compromise of 3 years not 5

Where to train where to play always a compromise

What jersey to play in always a compromise

Players we recruit always a compromise

We always compromise in respect of unacceptable behaviour of players and staff.

Sadly we have no spine of any description especially in respect of the team.

Until we define our identity and stop making soft decisions we will continue to get results like we do.

We are a neither nor club, with a neither nor team with a neither nor coach.

In respect of what can Flanagan do right now to try & improve our fortunes it’s simple grow some balls and make some tough calls
Thanks O/T. Great post as usual.
 

Dragon David

First Grade
Messages
7,724
No DNA when you are a JV and illawarra now doesn't exist .
Wincorp should cut ties with the 50% and St George Dragons back to being just 1 club and bring in a complete new board to run the football club . Manly did it years ago cut ties with Bears and now look at how they are back to the glory days.
We need to get our Dragons DNA back to what it was prior to 1999. Rebuild the Dynasty.
 

Peach & Apricot

Juniors
Messages
439
No DNA when you are a JV and illawarra now doesn't exist .
Wincorp should cut ties with the 50% and St George Dragons back to being just 1 club and bring in a complete new board to run the football club . Manly did it years ago cut ties with Bears and now look at how they are back to the glory days.

You can't 'cut ties' with Illawarra because Illawarra is the only thing that gives your club relevance and meaning. Just take a walk around St George district and the St George Leagues Club. It's like a mortuary
 

Dragon David

First Grade
Messages
7,724
You can't 'cut ties' with Illawarra because Illawarra is the only thing that gives your club relevance and meaning. Just take a walk around St George district and the St George Leagues Club. It's like a mortuary
I agree to some extent with what you say P & A and while I would like to see the St George Dragons become a stand alone club again, I don't think that will happen. None of us would be even thinking this if we continued on being a top 8 club and winning a couple more premierships as a merged club after we had the success during the Bennett years but the reality is that we haven't and we are plodding along still with the hope that after the great SG Ball Cup win by the Dragons the future will be brighter.

We also have the Centre of Excellence facility being completed sometime next year and in the case of the St George Leagues Club and the district feeling like a mortuary, I can only hope that with the proposed major renovations planned for the club going ahead, it will help bring back some vibrancy into the area. https://clubmanagement.com.au/st-george-leagues-club-to-undergo-complete-overhaul/
 

Illusion

Bench
Messages
2,850
No DNA when you are a JV and illawarra now doesn't exist .
Wincorp should cut ties with the 50% and St George Dragons back to being just 1 club and bring in a complete new board to run the football club . Manly did it years ago cut ties with Bears and now look at how they are back to the glory days.
Both joint Venture teams are a shit fight ........ Both teams have been bottom 4 , so is it working .......... NO .........
 

Illusion

Bench
Messages
2,850
You can't 'cut ties' with Illawarra because Illawarra is the only thing that gives your club relevance and meaning. Just take a walk around St George district and the St George Leagues Club. It's like a mortuary
I said this years ago about the Club , It's in a time warp one of the worst clubs in Sydney ......... It needs a developer to take it over and build a state-of-the-art Club , like the Panthers Club then turn it into a Sports Club ......... The oval across the road can be used by Rugby League , Soccer , Union , this will generate memberships .......... Anyway what do I know , we have people in the joint that are smarter than me running the place ......
 

twinkletoes

Juniors
Messages
932
I agree to some extent with what you say P & A and while I would like to see the St George Dragons become a stand alone club again, I don't think that will happen. None of us would be even thinking this if we continued on being a top 8 club and winning a couple more premierships as a merged club after we had the success during the Bennett years but the reality is that we haven't and we are plodding along still with the hope that after the great SG Ball Cup win by the Dragons the future will be brighter.

We also have the Centre of Excellence facility being completed sometime next year and in the case of the St George Leagues Club and the district feeling like a mortuary, I can only hope that with the proposed major renovations planned for the club going ahead, it will help bring back some vibrancy into the area. https://clubmanagement.com.au/st-george-leagues-club-to-undergo-complete-overhaul/
Sorry to disappoint Dragon David but Wollongong Council have not even approved the DA for the Centre of Excellence at this stage...it was submitted originally in November 2022.
 

TheRev

First Grade
Messages
8,568
Sorry to disappoint Dragon David but Wollongong Council have not even approved the DA for the Centre of Excellence at this stage...it was submitted originally in November 2022.
I assume there has been a lot of back and forth, any idea if its close to being approved?

With all the other barriers we have in recruiting players.. cant be easy for Flanno when he finally gets a player to 'tour the facilities' and it's just an old-school gym.
 
Last edited:

Dragon David

First Grade
Messages
7,724
Sorry to disappoint Dragon David but Wollongong Council have not even approved the DA for the Centre of Excellence at this stage...it was submitted originally in November 2022.
I didn't know this as nothing much has been said by the club because it probably is an embarrassment. Thanks for letting me know twinkletoes.

Here they were raving on about it and now it has gone all quiet. So not only do we lag with signings, we can't even get a DA through Council from as far back as November 2022 and that just shows how useless, for want of a better word, the club is. Unless approval is obtained reasonably soon, I cannot see us having the C of E built in 2025 and maybe not even 2026.

Not good at all.
 

Old Timer

Coach
Messages
17,011
Old Timer, you know I have almost always respected your views. I have certainly missed your wisdom from this Forum. Can I request you ignore the would be hecklers and produce one of your first rate analyses of where you think the Dragons are at. Why considerable improvement in some games and totally smashed in others. I would ask you if you are willing to do so, try to leave your anti-Flano perspective at a distance. Certainly point out any errors he has made but leave out that he should never have got the appt.
I know I posted a reply to you talking about the root causes (as I see them) of our issues and the downside of those issues and also made a suggestion for Flanagan as to how to go forward but I didn’t actually answer the question you politely asked of me.

So out of respect for you and your request I offer the following thoughts

The good results especially against top 8 type sides more often than not come from those sides having a game akin to a spoon contender rather than us totally dominating them and forcing them to play poorly.

I say this because in almost every win we have we have instances where we should put a cricket score on them but we very rarely ever put an opponent to the sword with an emphatic defeat.

The only one I can think of is against the Broncos in the reign of Mc Fookknuckle. We sort of limp to reasonable victories against a team where nothing clicked for them on the day.

Our worst defeats come from things that we should do instinctively being abandoned early in the game whether that be line speed, discipline, structure or perhaps even heart / belief if we get a bad injury early in the game because we have so few options to fall back on like the Suli fiasco on Anzac Day.

If we lose Rava, Suli or Lomax in the back 5 we become impotent in yardage from our end and the forwards quickly fatigue if they have to take up that workload very evident on Anzac Day. So those 3 are a must keep in the back line but they are all on the slow side so we have no pace other than Sloan so that keeps him in the side despite his obvious shortcomings.

Bird should be gone (bench at best) for Lomax and our fastest outside back in Koe or Flegg should be on the other wing. For sure Sloan needs another back that can come close to backing him up when he makes a break.

I reckon that Liddle is probably our 2nd fastest over a standing 50m start and that can’t possibly be good.

Our halves are way too slow as a pairing so that must be changed with either Kyle to 14 or Hunt to 9 and Liddle to 14 if none of that is doable then Hunt to 6 and Kyle to 7 as a last option.

JDB is going great (game changing) off the bench so that is a must keep situation so we need another prop on the bench (to avoid JDB entering the game too soon) with Lawrie making way. We need to create an alpha prop with footwork and/or offload. I think 6' 4”and 110kg is the minimum requirement and I believe we have a few of them in lower grades that if not quite there yet must be fast tracked for that role. You need to have 2 in fact so they can rotate as they get accustomed to the role.

As I said Flanagan needs to grow some balls re selections (including Hunt, Bird and his son) he also has to say that if we have another couple of score blowouts then Dean Young is the culprit as he is the defence coach and the buck stops there.

We must stop compromising and start marching one foot after the other always moving forward albeit at times very slowly.

We did for 11 years in a row and Penrith very nearly 4 and most likely will achieve that this year so it can be done and is testimony to those that are willing to make tough decisions.

Edit: Add Lawrie to the list re selctions.
 
Last edited:

Mojo

Bench
Messages
3,482
I know I posted a reply to you talking about the root causes (as I see them) of our issues and the downside of those issues and also made a suggestion for Flanagan as to how to go forward but I didn’t actually answer the question you politely asked of me.

So out of respect for you and your request I offer the following thoughts

The good results especially against top 8 type sides more often than not come from those sides having a game akin to a spoon contender rather than us totally dominating them and forcing them to play poorly.

I say this because in almost every win we have we have instances where we should put a cricket score on them but we very rarely ever put an opponent to the sword with an emphatic defeat.

The only one I can think of is against the Broncos in the reign of Mc Fookknuckle. We sort of limp to reasonable victories against a team where nothing clicked for them on the day.

Our worst defeats come from things that we should do instinctively being abandoned early in the game whether that be line speed, discipline, structure or perhaps even heart / belief if we get a bad injury early in the game because we have so few options to fall back on like the Suli fiasco on Anzac Day.

If we lose Rava, Suli or Lomax in the back 5 we become impotent in yardage from our end and the forwards quickly fatigue if they have to take up that workload very evident on Anzac Day. So those 3 are a must keep in the back line but they are all on the slow side so we have no pace other than Sloan so that keeps him in the side despite his obvious shortcomings.

Bird should be gone (bench at best) for Lomax and our fastest outside back in Koe or Flegg should be on the other wing. For sure Sloan needs another back that can come close to backing him up when he makes a break.

I reckon that Liddle is probably our 2nd fastest over a standing 50m start and that can’t possibly be good.

Our halves are way too slow as a pairing so that must be changed with either Kyle to 14 or Hunt to 9 and Liddle to 14 if none of that is doable then Hunt to 6 and Kyle to 7 as a last option.

JDB is going great (game changing) off the bench so that is a must keep situation so we need another prop on the bench (to avoid JDB entering the game too soon) with Lawrie making way. We need to create an alpha prop with footwork and/or offload. 64”and 110kg is the minimum requirement and I believe we have a few of them in lower grades that if not quite there yet must be fast tracked for that role. You need to have 2 in fact so they can rotate as they get accustomed to the role.

As I said Flanagan needs to grow some balls re selections (including Hunt, Bird and his son) he also has to say that if we have another couple of score blowouts then Dean Young is the culprit as he is the defence coach and the buck stops there.

We must stop compromising and start marching one foot after the other always moving forward albeit at times very slowly.

We did for 11 years in a row and Penrith very nearly 4 and most likely will achieve that this year so it can be done and is testimony to those that are willing to make tough decisions.
Pretty much agree with all of this, but I have a qualifier on Sloan's shortcomings - I still think he's steadily improving which cant be easy with an underperforming forward pack - and I think Kyle has performed pretty well - his pairing with Hunt, and Hunt's own performances, have hampered Kyle. I'd try Kyle 7 Hunt 6 - except I doubt very much Hunt would tolerate it (even more reason to trial it IMO).
 

Dragonsteve2

Juniors
Messages
549
I know I posted a reply to you talking about the root causes (as I see them) of our issues and the downside of those issues and also made a suggestion for Flanagan as to how to go forward but I didn’t actually answer the question you politely asked of me.

So out of respect for you and your request I offer the following thoughts

The good results especially against top 8 type sides more often than not come from those sides having a game akin to a spoon contender rather than us totally dominating them and forcing them to play poorly.

I say this because in almost every win we have we have instances where we should put a cricket score on them but we very rarely ever put an opponent to the sword with an emphatic defeat.

The only one I can think of is against the Broncos in the reign of Mc Fookknuckle. We sort of limp to reasonable victories against a team where nothing clicked for them on the day.

Our worst defeats come from things that we should do instinctively being abandoned early in the game whether that be line speed, discipline, structure or perhaps even heart / belief if we get a bad injury early in the game because we have so few options to fall back on like the Suli fiasco on Anzac Day.

If we lose Rava, Suli or Lomax in the back 5 we become impotent in yardage from our end and the forwards quickly fatigue if they have to take up that workload very evident on Anzac Day. So those 3 are a must keep in the back line but they are all on the slow side so we have no pace other than Sloan so that keeps him in the side despite his obvious shortcomings.

Bird should be gone (bench at best) for Lomax and our fastest outside back in Koe or Flegg should be on the other wing. For sure Sloan needs another back that can come close to backing him up when he makes a break.

I reckon that Liddle is probably our 2nd fastest over a standing 50m start and that can’t possibly be good.

Our halves are way too slow as a pairing so that must be changed with either Kyle to 14 or Hunt to 9 and Liddle to 14 if none of that is doable then Hunt to 6 and Kyle to 7 as a last option.

JDB is going great (game changing) off the bench so that is a must keep situation so we need another prop on the bench (to avoid JDB entering the game too soon) with Lawrie making way. We need to create an alpha prop with footwork and/or offload. I think 6' 4”and 110kg is the minimum requirement and I believe we have a few of them in lower grades that if not quite there yet must be fast tracked for that role. You need to have 2 in fact so they can rotate as they get accustomed to the role.

As I said Flanagan needs to grow some balls re selections (including Hunt, Bird and his son) he also has to say that if we have another couple of score blowouts then Dean Young is the culprit as he is the defence coach and the buck stops there.

We must stop compromising and start marching one foot after the other always moving forward albeit at times very slowly.

We did for 11 years in a row and Penrith very nearly 4 and most likely will achieve that this year so it can be done and is testimony to those that are willing to make tough decisions.

Edit: Add Lawrie to the list re selctions.
Thanks so much, OT. Really appreciate you sharing your quality analysis. I am a Dragons' fanatic but a cricketer at heart rather than a footballer so I miss a lot of the technical points that you can put your finger on. I do think there is potential in some of the young lower graders. I do think that despite successive heartbreaking last minute losses there is potential in the NSW Cup team and a distinct improvement on the rabble I have been watching over the past 4-5 seasons.

Thanks again. Really appreciate it!
 

Old Timer

Coach
Messages
17,011
Thanks so much, OT. Really appreciate you sharing your quality analysis. I am a Dragons' fanatic but a cricketer at heart rather than a footballer so I miss a lot of the technical points that you can put your finger on. I do think there is potential in some of the young lower graders. I do think that despite successive heartbreaking last minute losses there is potential in the NSW Cup team and a distinct improvement on the rabble I have been watching over the past 4-5 seasons.

Thanks again. Really appreciate it!
Thanks for your kind words I appreciate your input and interest.
I forgot to say that even picking our captain is a compromise and scratch my head wondering who if not Hunt and tgat really typifies the hole we find ourselves in.
 

TheRev

First Grade
Messages
8,568
I'd try Kyle 7 Hunt 6 - except I doubt very much Hunt would tolerate it
100% Agree, I thought that was the entire plan during the off-season.. yet I barely remember KFlan getting a 5th tackle kick all season.

But I think SFlanno would have to truly feel it was the only option before he pulled the trigger.. he is all in on hunt as "his 7" and it wont be an easy call.. combine that with Kyle being his son and the perception.. its not out of the question.

I am actually getting very nervous now about the idea of extending Hunt (and limiting our ability to sign our next half).. but with Lomax gone.. I also don't want to hit November 1st.. and lose our other marquee and all the press... when right now we have nothing but scraps to replace them...
 
Messages
316
100% Agree, I thought that was the entire plan during the off-season.. yet I barely remember KFlan getting a 5th tackle kick all season.

But I think SFlanno would have to truly feel it was the only option before he pulled the trigger.. he is all in on hunt as "his 7" and it wont be an easy call.. combine that with Kyle being his son and the perception.. its not out of the question.

I am actually getting very nervous now about the idea of extending Hunt (and limiting our ability to sign our next half).. but with Lomax gone.. I also don't want to hit November 1st.. and lose our other marquee and all the press... when right now we have nothing but scraps to replace them...
How sad Rev - our 'other Marquee'
More like two sticks and a tarp.
 
Last edited:

justadragon

Bench
Messages
2,897
Thanks for your kind words I appreciate your input and interest.
I forgot to say that even picking our captain is a compromise and scratch my head wondering who if not Hunt and tgat really typifies the hole we find ourselves in.
I know a lot of members are not going to like this, but I think JDB should be our captain. As I have said if you have done the crime and done the time , it should be time to move on. What he did to his wife was horrible, but she has found it in her heart to forgive him and move on with their lives, he is probably a better person now, should we not move forward as well ?
 

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