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The Game Future NRL Stadiums part II

Last Week

Bench
Messages
3,726
NSW Labor are using this as a lightning rod issue.

This is just an election tool obviously. Which is stupid as Labor will probably get in on the back of the Federal Labor. This matter doesn't need to be an contested issue for Labor.

The silly thing is they'll make all these promises pre election and then back flip and honour the deal post election. They'll look worse for it.

What this does show is that the Sports Minister is corrupt as f**k. By having the SFS done first, he's guaranteed that the next government can't touch it and thus, kept his SCG trust mates happy.
 

Dogs Of War

Coach
Messages
12,721
Is Richard kind of missing the point though? This was always about retaining and attracting big events, not for regular clubs games. The investment is designed to keep the NRL grand final in Sydney and attract more big Wallabies tests, more big Socceroos internationals, more international Football mega-clubs, more concerts, more NFL games etc.

But part of it is also ensuring that small crowd events are also accommodated for by being more intimate. That will be the stadiums bread and butter, and the matches that perform the worst currently in the stadiums.
 

T-Boon

Coach
Messages
15,887
The upgrade of ANZ would also assist in Australia's bid for the Womens Soccer World Cup in 2023 by which time womens sport especially the World Cup will be even bigger than it is now.

I have to say without an upgrade I would not even go to a womens world cup game at ANZ. However, with an upgrade Sydney and ANZ would be the obvious place to showcase womens sport and Sydney to the world.

Peter FitzSimmons seems anti women to me.
 

insert.pause

First Grade
Messages
6,461
the argument that the NRL should help finance the rebuilds is so bloody ignorant! Why do they think the NSW gov wanted a commitment from NRL to stage the GF & origin games for the next 25yrs?

Qld offered $10m for one GF, that puts the NRL's financial contribution at $250m over 25yrs, and that's before the economic benefit to the state of about $50m per GF, which equates to $1.25 billion over 25 years from the GF alone.
 

Hello, I'm The Doctor

First Grade
Messages
9,124
the argument that the NRL should help finance the rebuilds is so bloody ignorant! Why do they think the NSW gov wanted a commitment from NRL to stage the GF & origin games for the next 25yrs?

Qld offered $10m for one GF, that puts the NRL's financial contribution at $250m over 25yrs, and that's before the economic benefit to the state of about $50m per GF, which equates to $1.25 billion over 25 years from the GF alone.

For me the arguement is more simple...

Do you expect musicians to build the pub they perform in? Do you expect the actors doing MacBeth to build the theater for their production?

Its obviously not done like this because the venue makes its money back over a hundred different performances, not just the one.

So why do we expect the NRL to throw in on the build when there will be dozens of different tennants over the next decade?
 

T-Boon

Coach
Messages
15,887
Think of how much good it would do for the girls of Australia if Australia hosted the womens soccer world cup.

Who would want to be the premier of NSW that cost Australia the 2023 Womens soccer world cup because we have no rectangular stadium capable of holding 75k people.
 

T-Boon

Coach
Messages
15,887
Really it is the federal government that should be putting up some of the funding for ANZ to increase our chances of getting the womens soccer world cup in 2023 and maybe the mens WC down the track. We aren't getting either of those or the thousands of tourists they bring to the whole country (not just NSW) if our best rectangular stadium is Suncorp at 50k capacity.
 
Messages
21,880
Is Richard kind of missing the point though? This was always about retaining and attracting big events, not for regular clubs games. The investment is designed to keep the NRL grand final in Sydney and attract more big Wallabies tests, more big Socceroos internationals, more international Football mega-clubs, more concerts, more NFL games etc.

To be fair it’s about both, hence the investment in club modes for both stadiums, and Parramatta stadium being a dedicated club ground.
 

El Diablo

Post Whore
Messages
94,107
http://www.smh.com.au/sport/nsw-mus...-mercy-of-football-codes-20171207-h00sqd.html

NSW must build stadiums or be left at the mercy of football codes


In the 17 years since the Sydney Olympics, every Australian capital city with major sports content, except Sydney, has rebuilt old stadiums or constructed new ones.

Allianz Stadium, on the edge of Sydney's CBD, will no longer be guaranteed safe after 2018, while ANZ Stadium at Homebush in the city's west has been a compromised facility since it was built for the 2000 Games.

Should the NSW government cancel its plan to spend $2 billion rebuilding both stadiums, Sydney will be left with three facilities suitable for AFL (SCG, ANZ and the Giants' boutique stadium at Homebush) and two rectangular stadiums for rugby league, rugby union and soccer (an unsafe Allianz and a 30,000-seater at Parramatta).

This will leave Sydney in last place in the race among Australian capitals to stage major sporting events, such as grand finals, State of Origin matches, Bledisloe Cups and soccer's World Cup events.

Furthermore, the NSW capital will not compete on the world stage for events such as the FIFA 2023 Women's World Cup, the 2025 British and Irish Lions Tour, the 2027 Rugby World Cup, along with top music events.

The NSW government will be at the mercy of the major football codes, rather than the reverse. When the ARU was forced to decide between the Melbourne Rebels and the Perth-based Western Force to cut from its SANZAAR competition, the Victorian government told the code it would not release any money from its well-funded major events budget if the Rebels were axed.

Faced with no government support for Bledisloe Cup matches and visiting international teams for possibly a decade in Australia's second-biggest city, the ARU yielded to the Victorian government.

If, however, the NSW government reneges on its two stadia rebuild, the NRL will withdraw from the agreement to stage the next 25 grand finals in Sydney. With former Queensland premier Peter Beattie expected to replace John Grant as chair of the ARL Commission in February, NRL grand finals will be shopped around the country, with Brisbane's Suncorp Stadium a likely venue. The Queensland government has become more aggressive in the past five years bidding for events.

NSW has already lost to Queensland the status as dominant rugby league state, being beaten on most indices of success. The trend will continue unless fans of the Eels, Bulldogs, Wests Tigers and Rabbitohs fill modern rectangular stadiums, allowing these clubs to spend gate receipts on junior development.

Perth, with a new stadium and minus an elite rugby union tenant, will also join the bidding race. Western Australia is in the process of spending over $1 billion on a new sporting precinct.

Sydney has been under threat for more than a decade from Melbourne's easily accessible infrastructure, centring on the 100,000-seat MCG and justifying its self-proclaimed status as the sporting capital of the known universe.

As Destinations NSW chair John Hartigan says, "Sydney's position as the gateway to Australia is under threat from the twofold restrictions imposed by the limitations of Sydney airport [a curfew and shortage of slots] and the lack of facilities to attract world class events."

Hartigan points out that it will take 10 to 12 years to build a second airport at Badgerys Creek and the difficulties of attracting events to the city will compound in that time, should the two stadia not be built.

Tourism has moved from a tier-two revenue earner to tier-one status in Australia, particularly with the decline in mining.

Tourism is worth $33.2 billion a year to the NSW economy and it supports 164,000 jobs and more than 96,000 businesses in NSW rely on the sector.

ANZ Stadium and Allianz Stadium, even in their current, inadequate states, host 200 major men's and women's fixtures across five codes every year and both venues attract 3.5 million people per year to major events and a total 17 million precinct visitors.

Allianz and ANZ, inject more than $1 billion into the NSW economy every year, meaning the initial $2 billion government investment is repaid in two years. If the state government doesn't invest in these facilities, it puts at risk the supply of critical revenue to NSW that funds schools and hospitals, as well as the jobs of one in 23 people who rely on the events sector.

NSW Sports Minister Stuart Ayres has pointed out the $2 billion stadia rebuild is a mere 1 per cent of the $200 billion the state government will invest in health and education over the period ANZ and Allianz are being rebuilt.

In other words, the 30-year investment in new stadiums is critical, not only for the long-term success of the visitor economy, but it helps fund health and education services all over the state.

Political football has already resulted in two key infrastructure projects in Australia – Melbourne's East-West Link and Perth's Freight Link – being cancelled because of electoral backlash. Transport experts say both will inevitably be built at a massively higher cost.

Kicking a hard decision down the road, like the NSW government's investment in the two stadia, only hurts the economy in the long run.
 

El Diablo

Post Whore
Messages
94,107
lol

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-12-08/comment-why-sydney-has-a-size-problem

COMMENT: Why Sydney has a size problem
Ashley Browne December 8, 2017 7:58 PM

THE AFL likes to think of itself as Australia’s game and when it comes to any of the football codes, using most of the usual indicators, it is a sentiment that is reasonably close to the mark.

But a fortnight ago, when the AFL world gathered en masse in Sydney for its biggest annual non-football event, the 2017 NAB AFL Draft, the League was also served a jolting reminder about how far down the pecking order it is in New South Wales.

The NSW state government announced the very same day that it was spending $2.3 billion to rebuild Allianz Stadium, which immediately abuts the SCG in Moore Park, and to all but rebuild ANZ Stadium, the 75,000-seat stadium that was initially built less than 20 years ago for the 2000 Sydney Olympic Games.

Add the new Western Sydney Stadium that is being built on the site of the former Parramatta Stadium, and that means three new sporting palaces for Sydney will open in the next few years, and more significantly, all rectangular and incapable of hosting AFL football, at least the 18-a-side version we have known and loved for 160 years.

The AFL had lobbied, more out of hope than with any real degree of optimism, that the rebuilt ANZ Stadium would retain its oval configuration, so the option remained for staging really large drawing games such as a Sydney derby final or any final involving the Swans or Giants against a club with a large travelling supporter base, in a stadium that seats close to 75,000.

Not surprisingly, NSW premier Gladys Berejiklian didn’t buy into that one. The Olympic Stadium is the home of the NRL, the Wallabies and the Socceroos, who all play on rectangular-shaped fields. Pleasing the AFL won’t win votes for any political party at the next election.

But there was a reasonable argument that some of that $2.3 billion should have been allocated to the SCG, where both the AFL and Cricket Australia had lobbied for the Brewongle and O’Reilly Stands, both built nearly four decades ago, to be razed then rebuilt.

The oval-shaped field sports argued that the various shortcomings that determined that Allianz Stadium needed to be bulldozed and started over applied even more so to the western corner of the SCG. Those two grandstands pre-date the neighbouring Sydney Football Stadium by nearly 10 years.

The rectangular-field sports will argue that the NSW government has fairly looked after the AFL (and cricket) in recent years, what with $45 million in 2010 to help redevelop Spotless Stadium as the match-day home for GWS and $97.5 million towards the rebuilt Bradman and Noble stands at the SCG.

And there are countless new AFL-suitable oval fields and accompanying infrastructure sprouting up all over New South Wales, and with more to come. And the reason nearly the entire AFL community decamped to Western Sydney for the draft was due to the largesse of the NSW government.

But the plain fact is that within a few years, no AFL game in Sydney will be able to be watched by a crowd of more than 48,000. The Giants might have to put aside their distaste for playing home finals at the SCG in order to maximize crowds, including any home final against the Swans. In NSW, as in Victoria, it might become a case of home state rather home ground finals.

The AFL packs plenty of punch in the corridors of power on one side of what Professor Ian Turner once called the 'Barassi Line'.

The other side? Well, AFL boss Gillon McLachlan and commission chairman Richard Goyder still have some work to do.

Follow @hashbrowne
 

El Diablo

Post Whore
Messages
94,107
http://www.smh.com.au/sport/renovation-not-an-option-for-either-stadium-20171207-h00t5d.html

Renovation not an option for either stadium
Businessman Tony Shepherd wears two hats, as chair of the Sydney Cricket and Sports Ground Trust and chair of the AFL's newest team, the GWS Giants.

As boss of the Trust, he has won a major victory by the NSW Government's decision to begin work on Allianz ahead of ANZ.

Top ranking NRL executives fear he will win a second victory, should an incoming Labor Government cancel plans to begin work on the redevelopment of ANZ stadium, leaving it shaped friendly for AFL games and that code's expansion in Sydney's west.

However, Trust sources insist Allianz, which is 12 years older than ANZ, has significant upcoming compliance issues, particularly with safety. Furthermore, building ANZ first would cause greater disruption in the building phase, forcing too many teams to be homeless and the city losing more events.

Critics reasonably ask why both stadiums have to be rebuilt, rather than renovated.

Neither offer anything that is demanded of modern stadiums, with an independent infrastructure body, Infrastructure NSW, conducting detailed studies on which the NSW Government made its decision.

A refurbishment of Allianz is not an option. It won't allow the extra 300 female toilets, 400 disability accessible seats and 300 food and beverage service points that are required for a stadium that holds 45,000 people.

Nor would a refurbishment mitigate the safety issues which will be real in 2019.

The redevelopment of ANZ, originally known as Stadium Australia, was always a case of 'when' not 'if'.

It has been a compromised facility since the Olympics. The people of Sydney's west deserve the best large scale purpose built rectangular venue in the world. It is said that Melbourne's AFL families can travel to the home ground of their grandfather in the same time it took him to walk the distance from his home. So, in the time it took their grandfather to walk to Essendon's then home at Windy Hill, his descendants can reach the Bomber's stadium in the Docklands via train from their homes in the city's south east.

Similarly, Rabbitohs fans should be able to take a train from Rooty Hill to Homebush in the same time it took grandad to walk to Redfern Oval.

But when they get to Homebush for an NRL game on a circular field in seats gently tiered, they shouldn't have to watch via the giant TV screen.

Let the silvertails play in the city. When US college teams, Rice and Stanford came to Sydney, elite Stanford made it non-negotiable they play near the CBD.

Provided the NSW Government invests in the two stadia, the state won't lose any of the 500 events held over the last six years.

The Sydney Olympic Park precinct directly employs 18,860 people and is finally taking shape as a thriving entity. To abandon plans for the rebuilding of its major stadium would rip the heart out of western Sydney's visitor economy.

It's anticipated the redevelopment of both stadiums will take between 27 and 36 months.

The SCG will host one NRL grand final in 2020 during the construction phase and organised sequencing will mean all other grand finals will be played at Allianz (2021, 2022) and ANZ (2023-2044).

The 2020 decider at the SCG will be a special 'Heritage Grand Final'.

The sequence means a shorter construction time and ensures that both stadiums will be available to compete on the world stage for major international events.

Critics arguing the NSW Government should be allocating the resources to grass roots, particularly in the bush, ignore the decision this year to start a $100m Regional Sports Infrastructure Fund which is committed to providing sports facilities in rural areas.

The fund focuses on high quality sports facilities which will allow regional communities to attract significant professional and amateur events to their region.
 
Messages
21,880
It doesn't sound like they'll do ANZ. Which sucks because I'd go more if they did.

Where do you take that from?

Backing out of either stadium rebuild is difficult.

ANZ - lose the NRL grand final, possibly other major events that require a rectangular field.

Allianz - safety issues, female toilets etc
 

insert.pause

First Grade
Messages
6,461
lol

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-12-08/comment-why-sydney-has-a-size-problem

COMMENT: Why Sydney has a size problem
Ashley Browne December 8, 2017 7:58 PM

THE AFL likes to think of itself as Australia’s game and when it comes to any of the football codes, using most of the usual indicators, it is a sentiment that is reasonably close to the mark.

But a fortnight ago, when the AFL world gathered en masse in Sydney for its biggest annual non-football event, the 2017 NAB AFL Draft, the League was also served a jolting reminder about how far down the pecking order it is in New South Wales.

The NSW state government announced the very same day that it was spending $2.3 billion to rebuild Allianz Stadium, which immediately abuts the SCG in Moore Park, and to all but rebuild ANZ Stadium, the 75,000-seat stadium that was initially built less than 20 years ago for the 2000 Sydney Olympic Games.

Add the new Western Sydney Stadium that is being built on the site of the former Parramatta Stadium, and that means three new sporting palaces for Sydney will open in the next few years, and more significantly, all rectangular and incapable of hosting AFL football, at least the 18-a-side version we have known and loved for 160 years.

The AFL had lobbied, more out of hope than with any real degree of optimism, that the rebuilt ANZ Stadium would retain its oval configuration, so the option remained for staging really large drawing games such as a Sydney derby final or any final involving the Swans or Giants against a club with a large travelling supporter base, in a stadium that seats close to 75,000.

Not surprisingly, NSW premier Gladys Berejiklian didn’t buy into that one. The Olympic Stadium is the home of the NRL, the Wallabies and the Socceroos, who all play on rectangular-shaped fields. Pleasing the AFL won’t win votes for any political party at the next election.

But there was a reasonable argument that some of that $2.3 billion should have been allocated to the SCG, where both the AFL and Cricket Australia had lobbied for the Brewongle and O’Reilly Stands, both built nearly four decades ago, to be razed then rebuilt.

The oval-shaped field sports argued that the various shortcomings that determined that Allianz Stadium needed to be bulldozed and started over applied even more so to the western corner of the SCG. Those two grandstands pre-date the neighbouring Sydney Football Stadium by nearly 10 years.

The rectangular-field sports will argue that the NSW government has fairly looked after the AFL (and cricket) in recent years, what with $45 million in 2010 to help redevelop Spotless Stadium as the match-day home for GWS and $97.5 million towards the rebuilt Bradman and Noble stands at the SCG.

And there are countless new AFL-suitable oval fields and accompanying infrastructure sprouting up all over New South Wales, and with more to come. And the reason nearly the entire AFL community decamped to Western Sydney for the draft was due to the largesse of the NSW government.

But the plain fact is that within a few years, no AFL game in Sydney will be able to be watched by a crowd of more than 48,000. The Giants might have to put aside their distaste for playing home finals at the SCG in order to maximize crowds, including any home final against the Swans. In NSW, as in Victoria, it might become a case of home state rather home ground finals.

The AFL packs plenty of punch in the corridors of power on one side of what Professor Ian Turner once called the 'Barassi Line'.

The other side? Well, AFL boss Gillon McLachlan and commission chairman Richard Goyder still have some work to do.

Follow @hashbrowne
It's as if they have seen the world outside Victoria for the first time and can't handle it. Same thing happened to them earlier this year in qld when the women couldn't play at the Gabba. They just expect everybody to fawn over them like they do in Victoriania.
 

OldPanther

Coach
Messages
13,404
Where do you take that from?

Backing out of either stadium rebuild is difficult.

ANZ - lose the NRL grand final, possibly other major events that require a rectangular field.

Allianz - safety issues, female toilets etc

There seems to be a lot of talk about getting Allianz done before the election + all the public pressure on spending "all the school and hospital money".
 

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