Gallop's view on juniors

[Man_of_Steel_1982]

How do you put a dollar price on Concessions for Juniors?

The other clubs will say they got too much, the Storm (for example) will say its not enough.
What if the clubs with large junior bases dont get the expected return from their Junior players, what if the Storm dont get value for their purchase of a player?

There are too may question marks and its difficult to put an exact price for concessions and keep everyone happy. take a look at Club CEO's now and how much they bitch and whinge...imagine when they think other clubs get more money and are successful because everyone goes there for the big dollars.
I cant see anywhere how all clubs are going to agree to disagree on a financial figure that will be fair to all and sundry...

you are dillusional if you think players seriously want to play for their junior club because of rivalry when they can get $50k + at another club.
All players are mercenaries and will follow money becasue of their very short shelf life in a career that, if they are lucky, will last 10-15 years.

I think you totally miss the point. If clubs aren't happy they can take action and... develop better juniors! If they don't get a good return on their juniors... sack the development team! With a better TV deal the NRL could hand out junior development funding and clubs could spend it inside their boundaries in which ever way the like.

The answers to the questions you pose are simple - "tough luck".

As for players taking more money... the whole point is that they'll be able to continue to get good money at home without having to fit under the cap.

 

[Ram Man]

I think you totally miss the point. If clubs aren't happy they can take action and... develop better juniors! If they don't get a good return on their juniors... sack the development team! With a better TV deal the NRL could hand out junior development funding and clubs could spend it inside their boundaries in which ever way the like.

The answers to the questions you pose are simple - "tough luck".

As for players taking more money... the whole point is that they'll be able to continue to get good money at home without having to fit under the cap.

You cant develop juniors if they are not there!

So you would be happy for example that the Storm would get a $6mil Salary Cap and the Dragons got $3mil but had 8 juniors...Ask Peter Doust if he would be happy with that!
Its a bit exaggerated but you missed my point of how do you put a dollar figure on the price of juniors.
Do you think the Storm are going to be able to develop a similar nursery to the Dragons or the Panthers in the space of a few years. And if not, the other NRL CEO's are going to be happy they are still not receiving good money because they can develop good juniors.

 

[Brutus]

Why don't kids want to play RL on the northern beaches anymore?

Is it a case of the richer the area, the less RL is played?

All our "rich area" RL teams have no juniors.

Cronulla will be next...

 

[macavity]

Why don't kids want to play RL on the northern beaches anymore?

Is it a case of the richer the area, the less RL is played?

All our "rich area" RL teams have no juniors.

Cronulla will be next...

mumsy is afraid little Angus will get injured, and little Angus prefers the homo-erotica of Rugby dressingrooms or AFL bonding sessions...

 

[Man_of_Steel_1982]

You cant develop juniors if they are not there!

So you would be happy for example that the Storm would get a $6mil Salary Cap and the Dragons got $3mil but had 8 juniors...Ask Peter Doust if he would be happy with that!
Its a bit exaggerated but you missed my point of how do you put a dollar figure on the price of juniors.
Do you think the Storm are going to be able to develop a similar nursery to the Dragons or the Panthers in the space of a few years. And if not, the other NRL CEO's are going to be happy they are still not receiving good money because they can develop good juniors.

Yes, I think the Dragons would be very happy with a $3mil cap on OUTSIDE players and no limit on local juniors.

I'd say quite a few clubs would be happy with that - those that aren't would be the ones that contribute nothing to future of the game.

 

[Cockadoodledoo]

Sounds good... lets look at that for the roosters

1. Um None ... does Luke ricketson still count
2. Bought.... Yes ....... Developed.... Debatable
3. Um 1 Fitzy

Sounds like a great idea...

Well Anthony Cherrington is a local junior having played for the Paddington Tigers since the age of 12.

The majority of our starting 17 have only played at the Roosters, most having joined in their teens.. Minichiello came at 15 to the Roosters, Sean Kenny-Dowall at 17 from NZ just looking for a game. Mitch Aubusson at 16 from Ballina, Sia Soliola at 17 from NZ, Sam Perrett at 18, Mitchell Pearce at 16, Lopini Paea at 17 from Minto Cobras, James Aubusson at 18 who then went to the Storm for a couple years, Setaimata Sa signed as a 17 year old and stayed in NZ for a year to finish school, Frank-Paul Nuaasala at 18 from NZ, Ryan Williamson who is likely to start in the Centres next season is a 17 year old from Qld who has come through from our SG Ball team.

8 year players, Fitzy yes.. also Minichiello..

 

[Ram Man]

Yes, I think the Dragons would be very happy with a $3mil cap on OUTSIDE players and no limit on local juniors.

I'd say quite a few clubs would be happy with that - those that aren't would be the ones that contribute nothing to future of the game.

Ok all your juniors are $hit or injured....does the tough luck status still apply when your juniors dont produce any talent.
I can gaurantee that Doust will be the 1st one on the phone to Gallop whinging looking for more concessions....too much grey area!
The clubs responsibilty is to develop their junior not to ensure the promotion and future of the game...you may want to look to the NRL to do that!

 

[Different kind of Rabbit]

They have to work something out, because option B is that all these clubs realise that they are gaining nothing by developing a Junior so they put less and less money into the Junior system and we end up with a Junior system that doesn't exist.

Maybe the answer is to have a Junior system that is completely run by the NRL and all 1st grade teams have to contribute the funds. Then you could have some sort of draft system set up ala the AFL where Juniors get portioned out to the club that needs them most. That way, the first year they actually play Footy for one of the big clubs would be in say the under 20's. That way, all clubs would be responsible for Junior development financially and all would reap the benefits via a fair draft system.

Once these guys were drafted, you could have them on say a 3 year contract and then after that 3 years is up, they would be free to negotiate on the open market.

 

[Ram Man]

They have to work something out, because option B is that all these clubs realise that they are gaining nothing by developing a Junior so they put less and less money into the Junior system and we end up with a Junior system that doesn't exist.

Maybe the answer is to have a Junior system that is completely run by the NRL and all 1st grade teams have to contribute the funds. Then you could have some sort of draft system set up ala the AFL where Juniors get portioned out to the club that needs them most. That way, the first year they actually play Footy for one of the big clubs would be in say the under 20's. That way, all clubs would be responsible for Junior development financially and all would reap the benefits via a fair draft system.

Once these guys were drafted, you could have them on say a 3 year contract and then after that 3 years is up, they would be free to negotiate on the open market.

Now there is a plan that I can handle....can you apply for the board DKOR, you seem to come up with some beauties!

 

[mxlegend99]

David Gallop should be encouraging teams to develop players... it's in the best interest of the game.

He won't make that change because it gives the teams with good junior systems an advantage... why is that a bad thing? Any change that encourages teams to develop their own players is a good thing for the NRL.

Yet as it stands now... the clubs who develop players are being penalised for doing so. Panthers put a lot of money into developing players, and at the last minute other teams come along and benefit from the time and money spent on these players. This year the Panthers had to let go 11 players from their top squad just to keep some of our better juniors, and even then we still couldn't keep them all.

Meanwhile other clubs will let one or two players go and replace them with players that the Panthers, Eels etc. have developed and those are the clubs which are dominating the NRL at the moment.

 

[Man_of_Steel_1982]

David Gallop should be encouraging teams to develop players... it's in the best interest of the game.

He won't make that change because it gives the teams with good junior systems an advantage... why is that a bad thing? Any change that encourages teams to develop their own players is a good thing for the NRL.

Yet as it stands now... the clubs who develop players are being penalised for doing so. Panthers put a lot of money into developing players, and at the last minute other teams come along and benefit from the time and money spent on these players. This year the Panthers had to let go 11 players from their top squad just to keep some of our better juniors, and even then we still couldn't keep them all.

Meanwhile other clubs will let one or two players go and replace them with players that the Panthers, Eels etc. have developed and those are the clubs which are dominating the NRL at the moment.

Exactly.

And with clubs looking after their own territory, along with an NRL grant (the growth of the game in their area will directly benefit them) the NRL/ARL can focus on the development of the game in country areas, Vic, WA & SA, NT etc.

 

[badav]

Exactly.

And with clubs looking after their own territory, along with an NRL grant (the growth of the game in their area will directly benefit them) the NRL/ARL can focus on the development of the game in country areas, Vic, WA & SA, NT etc.

There has to be more even geographical distribution of territories amongst teams if any system like that could ever work.

The NRL will never put in place a system that disadvantages teams with small junior areas. The salary cap works more evenly than a system that rewards one team with a junior area 8 times larger than another.

The topic of juniors and concessions is flogging a dead horse.

 

[Roosterphin1]

Gallop is exactly right. How can you give concessions for juniors when not every team has access to the same numbers of juniors. Until it is a level playing field it would never get over the line and nor should it!

 

[El Diablo]

Gallop is exactly right. How can you give concessions for juniors when not every team has access to the same numbers of juniors. Until it is a level playing field it would never get over the line and nor should it!

What is the point in having a team in an area if they have no juniors there?

move them to an area where they can actually contribute something to the game instead of leeching off other clubs

 

[Ram Man]

What is the point in having a team in an area if they have no juniors there?

move them to an area where they can actually contribute something to the game instead of leeching off other clubs

So do you propose Melbourne get the arse?

 

[adamkungl]

Sounds good... lets look at that for the roosters

1. Um None ... does Luke ricketson still count
2. Bought.... Yes ....... Developed.... Debatable
3. Um 1 Fitzy

Sounds like a great idea...

Isn't the point of this whole argument to reward the development of local juniors? I know my club does sweet f**k all locally, so be it, other clubs can reap the rewards. I should point out I don't mean make them cap exempt, maybe a 30% discount for locals, 20% for develops, 15% for long servering players, something like that.

However the insinuation that we don't develop players is utter rubbish.
From this years squad - Minichiello, Tupou, Shillington, M Aubusson, (J Aubusson was with us as a junior but made his FG debut for Melbourne i think), Lopini and Mickey Paea, Pearce, Perrett, Sa, Soliola, Shackleton, and Kenny Dowall, 12 players all developed and brought into first grade by us. I may have missed a couple of fringe first graders too. Not to mention a lot of other players such as Ben Hannant and Adrian Kirk which come to mind, which featured in this years finals series.

 

[Roosterphin1]

What is the point in having a team in an area if they have no juniors there?

move them to an area where they can actually contribute something to the game instead of leeching off other clubs

Didnt say that..said that they will never give concessions until it is a level playing field.

 

[Pass the Ball]

A transfer fee paid to the club that has developed that player will solve all of these problems...

 

[El Diablo]

So do you propose Melbourne get the arse?

i have said they should be moved countles times

Roosters and Sea Eagles should be forced to do so too. especially seeing what's recently happened at both clubs with the Roosters pissing off what little juniors they have left and Manly pulling out of the NSW cup and instead entering a team in the Queensland cup

 

[Pass the Ball]

What is the point in having a team in an area if they have no juniors there?

move them to an area where they can actually contribute something to the game instead of leeching off other clubs

Hate to break it to you, but the corporate dollar tends to play a role in sport these days also...