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How to re-build the Dragons

Wolfgang ofihd

Juniors
Messages
21
Dufty has worked well at fullback but if you're playing him then you need to have big wingers who can get alot of kick return meters because dufty is not good on kick returns and we shouldn't expect him to be that good at it. Hence why the coaches have persisted with Rava. Have a look at most teams and certainly the top teams all have big fullbacks who have great kick return, good defence and some ball playing ability. I don't think having dufty as starting fullback will mean we challenge for top 4. I reckon he could be the perfect supersub off the bench where he can come on for 30-40mins per game in the middle during the end of the 1st and 2nd half utilising his speed against tired middles.

I would love us to target Joey Manu and offer him the fullback position. He is a young gun and fits the modern day fullback requirements. Whenever he's played fullback for the chooks, he has done very well. Has speed, size, power, ball playing ability and has been in a great professional system where he's been very succesful. IMO he would be perfect for us and is probs looking for a fullback spot.

We need to persist with Rava and Saab as our wingers as they both have great potential and fit the modern day winger requirements. Lomax is looking great at center and we need to let him develop at this position as strike center and has excellent goal kicking. We also have a few youngsters/juniors coming through like the feeagi twins/sse etc that should have a shot at center either later this season or next year.

Interested to see how clune develops in the halves and would persist with him as he's showing more of his kicking game and being more confident running the ball on the left. We defs need to get rid of Corey Norman asap. Forgot his kicking/running the ball etc. At a bare minimum his body language is horrendous. I hope we target Matt burton from the Panthers and offer him the starting spot. His few games have been amazing. Great left foot kick, a big body and strong runner who is confident. We have always done well with a strong running half.

Once Hunts contract expires, I wouldn't resign him. We already have mciness and I prefer mciness at hooker long term over hunt who is too inconsistent. I also believe hunt is a better hooker than half and we can't have him and mciness playing lock/hok as it takes up too much money and mciness is too small to play lock long term. Mciness has a great running game and is creative but our gameplan hasn't suited his attributes. Also him doing soo much defensive work has impacted his attack.

We definitely need to hold onto Paul vaughan at FRF. We need to have a mobile big pack with good lateral footwork. Lawrie and merrin aren't big enough and are too slow to play in the middle. You could get away with one of them on the bench but having both of them in our team makes us too slow defensively. I would try to get someone like a Lindsay Collins from the roosters or Thomas flegler from the Broncos. Both are young props who are powerful, quick and have great lateral footwork. Top teams have fwds that are mobile and we need to target them.

Tariq Sims we need to keep for experience and hopefully he can find his form again. Frizz is a big loss as he continuously bends the line and provides a point of difference with his quick footspeed. We'll definitely notice our slow pack next year unless we target the correct players. Someone who could replace him is Jackson Ford who looks like a very good prospect. I would also target Sitili Tupinoua from the roosters who is a big rangy and quick edge/middle player. He has great potential and fits the modern day edge back rower and shares similar attributes to frizz.

Lock is mciness for the time being but definitely an area of concern for the future. We could play host/kerr at lock in the future.

Imo you can't play Tristan sailor and Matt dufty in the same team as they are similar size and share similar attributes. If we play both of them then we are too small, unless you play sailor over clune or dufty. Ideally having dufty or sailor on the bench would give us a spark when we are chasing points or to break the game open. We also would need an experienced forward on the bench along with a couple of youngsters.

This squad has the makings of a top team but we really need to recruit the correct players that fit modern day football.
 

redVinme

Juniors
Messages
2,499
Dufty has worked well at fullback but if you're playing him then you need to have big wingers who can get alot of kick return meters because dufty is not good on kick returns and we shouldn't expect him to be that good at it. Hence why the coaches have persisted with Rava. Have a look at most teams and certainly the top teams all have big fullbacks who have great kick return, good defence and some ball playing ability. I don't think having dufty as starting fullback will mean we challenge for top 4. I reckon he could be the perfect supersub off the bench where he can come on for 30-40mins per game in the middle during the end of the 1st and 2nd half utilising his speed against tired middles.

I would love us to target Joey Manu and offer him the fullback position. He is a young gun and fits the modern day fullback requirements. Whenever he's played fullback for the chooks, he has done very well. Has speed, size, power, ball playing ability and has been in a great professional system where he's been very succesful. IMO he would be perfect for us and is probs looking for a fullback spot.

We need to persist with Rava and Saab as our wingers as they both have great potential and fit the modern day winger requirements. Lomax is looking great at center and we need to let him develop at this position as strike center and has excellent goal kicking. We also have a few youngsters/juniors coming through like the feeagi twins/sse etc that should have a shot at center either later this season or next year.

Interested to see how clune develops in the halves and would persist with him as he's showing more of his kicking game and being more confident running the ball on the left. We defs need to get rid of Corey Norman asap. Forgot his kicking/running the ball etc. At a bare minimum his body language is horrendous. I hope we target Matt burton from the Panthers and offer him the starting spot. His few games have been amazing. Great left foot kick, a big body and strong runner who is confident. We have always done well with a strong running half.

Once Hunts contract expires, I wouldn't resign him. We already have mciness and I prefer mciness at hooker long term over hunt who is too inconsistent. I also believe hunt is a better hooker than half and we can't have him and mciness playing lock/hok as it takes up too much money and mciness is too small to play lock long term. Mciness has a great running game and is creative but our gameplan hasn't suited his attributes. Also him doing soo much defensive work has impacted his attack.

We definitely need to hold onto Paul vaughan at FRF. We need to have a mobile big pack with good lateral footwork. Lawrie and merrin aren't big enough and are too slow to play in the middle. You could get away with one of them on the bench but having both of them in our team makes us too slow defensively. I would try to get someone like a Lindsay Collins from the roosters or Thomas flegler from the Broncos. Both are young props who are powerful, quick and have great lateral footwork. Top teams have fwds that are mobile and we need to target them.

Tariq Sims we need to keep for experience and hopefully he can find his form again. Frizz is a big loss as he continuously bends the line and provides a point of difference with his quick footspeed. We'll definitely notice our slow pack next year unless we target the correct players. Someone who could replace him is Jackson Ford who looks like a very good prospect. I would also target Sitili Tupinoua from the roosters who is a big rangy and quick edge/middle player. He has great potential and fits the modern day edge back rower and shares similar attributes to frizz.

Lock is mciness for the time being but definitely an area of concern for the future. We could play host/kerr at lock in the future.

Imo you can't play Tristan sailor and Matt dufty in the same team as they are similar size and share similar attributes. If we play both of them then we are too small, unless you play sailor over clune or dufty. Ideally having dufty or sailor on the bench would give us a spark when we are chasing points or to break the game open. We also would need an experienced forward on the bench along with a couple of youngsters.

This squad has the makings of a top team but we really need to recruit the correct players that fit modern day football.

Agree with a lot of this.
Manu looks great at fb and his stats in minimal games there are elite.

We also need exactly what you said in the forwards. Think pat carrigan, Liam Martin and a few others fit this too.

Long term I'd love Sullivan and Burton as halves imo
 

Wolfgang ofihd

Juniors
Messages
21
Agree with a lot of this.
Manu looks great at fb and his stats in minimal games there are elite.

We also need exactly what you said in the forwards. Think pat carrigan, Liam Martin and a few others fit this too.

Long term I'd love Sullivan and Burton as halves imo

Thanks mate. Very excited to see Sullivan develop and hopefully he can live upto the hype.

Burton has massive wraps and I think having a big body half also helps us defensively on the edges where we have been prone to leak points in the past. Panthers will need to make a decision between luai and burton by next season.

Carrigan/Martin would be great additions. My thinking is target youngish players from the top sides who are fringe 13 or bench players and unlikely to get a starting spot anytime soon like flegler/collins/tupinoua or Joey Manu who is probably keen to play fullback. These guys should develop into great starting players in the future.

Taking this approach we don't need to pay massive overs as we are giving them the opportunity to start. IMO we definitely need to focus on overhauling our forward pack in the next season or two.

Hopefully we see guys like Eddie blacker/ J.ford/ J. Host be given more mins and opportunity.
 

redVinme

Juniors
Messages
2,499
Thanks mate. Very excited to see Sullivan develop and hopefully he can live upto the hype.

Burton has massive wraps and I think having a big body half also helps us defensively on the edges where we have been prone to leak points in the past. Panthers will need to make a decision between luai and burton by next season.

Carrigan/Martin would be great additions. My thinking is target youngish players from the top sides who are fringe 13 or bench players and unlikely to get a starting spot anytime soon like flegler/collins/tupinoua or Joey Manu who is probably keen to play fullback. These guys should develop into great starting players in the future.

Taking this approach we don't need to pay massive overs as we are giving them the opportunity to start. IMO we definitely need to focus on overhauling our forward pack in the next season or two.

Hopefully we see guys like Eddie blacker/ J.ford/ J. Host be given more mins and opportunity.

I'm of the same train of thought. There is some great young players out there, many of which could do a job for a reasonable cost.

I feel almost though we need just 1 player. A draw card like newy did with ponga. To give confidence for others to jump. Manu/Coates would be up there for me. Coates will be a freak and atm broncs aren't a draw card. Farnworth too.

We need some footy players not just athletes.
 

possm

Coach
Messages
15,591
I'm of the same train of thought. There is some great young players out there, many of which could do a job for a reasonable cost.

I feel almost though we need just 1 player. A draw card like newy did with ponga. To give confidence for others to jump. Manu/Coates would be up there for me. Coates will be a freak and atm broncs aren't a draw card. Farnworth too.

We need some footy players not just athletes.
In my opinion, we need 4 new recruits and a reshuffle of Dufty from fullback to five-eighth. So:
1. New marquee Fullback
2. Saab or Ramsey or Pereira or Feagai
3. Lomax

4. New player or Williame or Feagai
5. Ravalawa or Saab or Feagai or Schiller
6. Dufty or Sailor
7. Clune or Sullivan

8. New player to replace Graham
9. Hunt
10. Vaughan
11. T Sims

12. New player to replace Frizell
13. McInnes

14. Kerr or Ellis
15. Lawrie or Blacker
16. Fuimaono or Ford
17. Brittain or Merrin



 

Dragonslayer

First Grade
Messages
7,693
In my opinion, we need 4 new recruits and a reshuffle of Dufty from fullback to five-eighth. So:
1. New marquee Fullback
2. Saab or Ramsey or Pereira or Feagai
3. Lomax

4. New player or Williame or Feagai
5. Ravalawa or Saab or Feagai or Schiller
6. Dufty or Sailor
7. Clune or Sullivan

8. New player to replace Graham
9. Hunt
10. Vaughan
11. T Sims

12. New player to replace Frizell
13. McInnes

14. Kerr or Ellis
15. Lawrie or Blacker
16. Fuimaono or Ford
17. Brittain or Merrin



Just one question Possm.

Who is this 'marquee' fullback, that is (a) available, and (b) would want to come to the Dragons?
 

possm

Coach
Messages
15,591
Just one question Possm.

Who is this 'marquee' fullback, that is (a) available, and (b) would want to come to the Dragons?
Millward and Flanagan will work that one out; that's why they are paid the big bucks. However, I'm sure if we have the announcement of our new coach, players would be more likely to come to the club.
 

redv13

Bench
Messages
2,805
Millward and Flanagan will work that one out; that's why they are paid the big bucks. However, I'm sure if we have the announcement of our new coach, players would be more likely to come to the club.
Kerr is your starting prop with Vaughan. There’s no marquee fullbacks available.
I’m surprised Saints didn’t chase Cotric to play centre. If he ends up at the dogs he’s a silly silly boy, big career killer at the moment
 

Dragon David

First Grade
Messages
7,528
The way that the Bulldogs are going, with possible signings, we will end up with the dregs as usual. We procrastinate too much and take too long to make any decisions and before we know it, who is left to get?

The Bulldogs got rid of Dean Pay(pulled the pin) and look like getting Trent Barrett.
They look like getting Nick Cotric and keeping CNH and are going for Addo Carr and several others. Their squad for 2021 i think will ensure that they are well away from the bottom of the ladder.

The current players will be lifting against us in the match this weekend to impress the selectors and try for new contracts. Forwards aren't too bad and they will build on their halves and backs.

In the meantime the rejects are rejecting us and makes me wonder what is ahead for us.
 

mickeylane

Bench
Messages
4,918
Dufty has worked well at fullback but if you're playing him then you need to have big wingers who can get alot of kick return meters because dufty is not good on kick returns and we shouldn't expect him to be that good at it. Hence why the coaches have persisted with Rava. Have a look at most teams and certainly the top teams all have big fullbacks who have great kick return, good defence and some ball playing ability. I don't think having dufty as starting fullback will mean we challenge for top 4. I reckon he could be the perfect supersub off the bench where he can come on for 30-40mins per game in the middle during the end of the 1st and 2nd half utilising his speed against tired middles.

I would love us to target Joey Manu and offer him the fullback position. He is a young gun and fits the modern day fullback requirements. Whenever he's played fullback for the chooks, he has done very well. Has speed, size, power, ball playing ability and has been in a great professional system where he's been very succesful. IMO he would be perfect for us and is probs looking for a fullback spot.

We need to persist with Rava and Saab as our wingers as they both have great potential and fit the modern day winger requirements. Lomax is looking great at center and we need to let him develop at this position as strike center and has excellent goal kicking. We also have a few youngsters/juniors coming through like the feeagi twins/sse etc that should have a shot at center either later this season or next year.

Interested to see how clune develops in the halves and would persist with him as he's showing more of his kicking game and being more confident running the ball on the left. We defs need to get rid of Corey Norman asap. Forgot his kicking/running the ball etc. At a bare minimum his body language is horrendous. I hope we target Matt burton from the Panthers and offer him the starting spot. His few games have been amazing. Great left foot kick, a big body and strong runner who is confident. We have always done well with a strong running half.

Once Hunts contract expires, I wouldn't resign him. We already have mciness and I prefer mciness at hooker long term over hunt who is too inconsistent. I also believe hunt is a better hooker than half and we can't have him and mciness playing lock/hok as it takes up too much money and mciness is too small to play lock long term. Mciness has a great running game and is creative but our gameplan hasn't suited his attributes. Also him doing soo much defensive work has impacted his attack.

We definitely need to hold onto Paul vaughan at FRF. We need to have a mobile big pack with good lateral footwork. Lawrie and merrin aren't big enough and are too slow to play in the middle. You could get away with one of them on the bench but having both of them in our team makes us too slow defensively. I would try to get someone like a Lindsay Collins from the roosters or Thomas flegler from the Broncos. Both are young props who are powerful, quick and have great lateral footwork. Top teams have fwds that are mobile and we need to target them.

Tariq Sims we need to keep for experience and hopefully he can find his form again. Frizz is a big loss as he continuously bends the line and provides a point of difference with his quick footspeed. We'll definitely notice our slow pack next year unless we target the correct players. Someone who could replace him is Jackson Ford who looks like a very good prospect. I would also target Sitili Tupinoua from the roosters who is a big rangy and quick edge/middle player. He has great potential and fits the modern day edge back rower and shares similar attributes to frizz.

Lock is mciness for the time being but definitely an area of concern for the future. We could play host/kerr at lock in the future.

Imo you can't play Tristan sailor and Matt dufty in the same team as they are similar size and share similar attributes. If we play both of them then we are too small, unless you play sailor over clune or dufty. Ideally having dufty or sailor on the bench would give us a spark when we are chasing points or to break the game open. We also would need an experienced forward on the bench along with a couple of youngsters.

This squad has the makings of a top team but we really need to recruit the correct players that fit modern day football.
no player ever leaves Roosters willingly especially a gun like Manu...so forget that idea...its either Dufty or Ramsey who btw is a gun fullback...
 

mickeylane

Bench
Messages
4,918
The way that the Bulldogs are going, with possible signings, we will end up with the dregs as usual. We procrastinate too much and take too long to make any decisions and before we know it, who is left to get?

The Bulldogs got rid of Dean Pay(pulled the pin) and look like getting Trent Barrett.
They look like getting Nick Cotric and keeping CNH and are going for Addo Carr and several others. Their squad for 2021 i think will ensure that they are well away from the bottom of the ladder.

The current players will be lifting against us in the match this weekend to impress the selectors and try for new contracts. Forwards aren't too bad and they will build on their halves and backs.

In the meantime the rejects are rejecting us and makes me wonder what is ahead for us.
Addo Car will end up at souths as soon as Johnston leaves....right next to his hunting mate Latrell...
 

Forbes Creek Dragons

First Grade
Messages
5,078
no player ever leaves Roosters willingly especially a gun like Manu...so forget that idea...its either Dufty or Ramsey who btw is a gun fullback...
I reckon for next year Ramsey will take up a wing spot and Dufty will be at 1. If injury or bad form strikes though I think Ramsey could find himself back there at some stage and it wouldn't shock me if he was very hard to dislodge once he gets a start.
 

gitano

Juniors
Messages
2,364
Back 5 in 2021 should really be
1. Ramsey
2. Gordon
3. Aitken
4. Slomax
5. Pereira or Mika
 

possm

Coach
Messages
15,591
1.Dufty
2.Ramsey
3.Wiliame
4.Lomax(c)
5.Rava
They won’t start Ramsey at 1 they will start him on the wing to get used to NRL level. Can’t put him outside Aitken because his confidence will be destroyed not getting any ball.
Dufty should replace Norman at five-eighth and the sooner the better. He has the attacking flair, the passing game and the instinctive backup we need. He needs to work on his defence and his kicking game.

At this point in time, a Clune / Dufty halves combination could be dynamic. Initially, Dufty will need the protection of T Sims, a la Thompson/Soward.

If Norman is dropped, his manager will quickly seek a release to play with another club; Warriors, Cowboys, Dogs, Broncos .....
 

redandwhite4evr

Juniors
Messages
1,827
The way that the Bulldogs are going, with possible signings, we will end up with the dregs as usual. We procrastinate too much and take too long to make any decisions and before we know it, who is left to get?

The Bulldogs got rid of Dean Pay(pulled the pin) and look like getting Trent Barrett.
They look like getting Nick Cotric and keeping CNH and are going for Addo Carr and several others. Their squad for 2021 i think will ensure that they are well away from the bottom of the ladder.

The current players will be lifting against us in the match this weekend to impress the selectors and try for new contracts. Forwards aren't too bad and they will build on their halves and backs.

In the meantime the rejects are rejecting us and makes me wonder what is ahead for us.

The Dragons are a hard sell DD- the current triumvirate of coaches/selectors (Mary, Young and Flanno- and throw Shepherd in there somewhere as well) reminds me of the Roman Republic when Julius Caesar, Pompey and Crassus divided up the empire between them. We all know that ended badly.

When a player asks who is coaching next year, the likely answer that Millward will have to give is that all three will be back co-coaching as Mary has another year to run and Flanno cant be Head Coach until 2022. But how long can Mary continue to take the plaudits for Flanno's good work without Flanno going into meltdown?
 

SnowDragon

Juniors
Messages
790
The Dragons are a hard sell DD- the current triumvirate of coaches/selectors (Mary, Young and Flanno- and throw Shepherd in there somewhere as well) reminds me of the Roman Republic when Julius Caesar, Pompey and Crassus divided up the empire between them. We all know that ended badly.

When a player asks who is coaching next year, the likely answer that Millward will have to give is that all three will be back co-coaching as Mary has another year to run and Flanno cant be Head Coach until 2022. But how long can Mary continue to take the plaudits for Flanno's good work without Flanno going into meltdown?

If they sign Flanno now as head coach from 2022 once he is allowed, that should satisfy all involved? just check with the NRL in the meantime so we aren't perceived as breaking any rules. (I am sure the NRL want to make sure they stick to the ban, but also would prefer less coach sacking etc.)
 
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