Is Brett Lee the ultimate cricketing wanker?

[typicalfan]

Brett Lee is one of our greatest personalities. He might get fired up but what fast bowler hasn't. And he backs it up unlike Johnson.

Lee was the best ODI bowler in the world alongside Bracken at one stage and has clearly out performed the wild thing and any other pace bowler this summer for Australia.

Ordinary test bowler although he could always get a wicket even if he went for runs. And an average of 31 would have definitely been handy, do you know the bowling averages for the summer for the likes of Hilfenhaus, Siddle, Harris and Johnson?

Siddle 35
Hilfenhaus 59
Harris 26
Johnson 37


So Harris aside Lee is clearly doing ok with an average of 31 in this case

 

[Patorick]

One of the worst of all-time that one.

A 3-year old child has more maturity.

Does it answer the question posed in the thread's title Brut?

 

[Tonearm Terrorwrist]

Brett Lee is one of our greatest personalities. He might get fired up but what fast bowler hasn't. And he backs it up unlike Johnson.

Lee was the best ODI bowler in the world alongside Bracken at one stage and has clearly out performed the wild thing and any other pace bowler this summer for Australia.

Ordinary test bowler although he could always get a wicket even if he went for runs. And an average of 31 would have definitely been handy, do you know the bowling averages for the summer for the likes of Hilfenhaus, Siddle, Harris and Johnson?

Siddle 35
Hilfenhaus 59
Harris 26
Johnson 37


So Harris aside Lee is clearly doing ok with an average of 31 in this case

His average balloons out to 40 against England which included the very ordinary England teams of 2001 (average 55) and 2002/03 (average 41) I don't think he would have done much better than Johnson, Siddle or Hilfenhaus in this series against the best English-South African batting line up he would have faced.

He was always a much better ODI bowler than a test bowler.

 

[typicalfan]

Yep he was ordinary in England and the sub continent but again he could always take wickets. His problem was that he went for too many runs an over. 3.5 is ridiculously high for a test cricketer. But his strike rate is as good as any, that paints the picture the most. Some rubbish mixed with some very good balls, couldn't apply pressure enough to be a consistently good or great test bowler but a wicket was always around the corner.

The England batting line up isn't that spectacular our bowlers and in particular our fielding was deplorable I don't think Lee would have been as bad as Notch or Hilfenhaus.

 

[hineyrulz]

Yep he was ordinary in England and the sub continent but again he could always take wickets. His problem was that he went for too many runs an over. 3.5 is ridiculously high for a test cricketer. But his strike rate is as good as any, that paints the picture the most. Some rubbish mixed with some very good balls, couldn't apply pressure enough to be a consistently good or great test bowler but a wicket was always around the corner.

The England batting line up isn't that spectacular our bowlers and in particular our fielding was deplorable I don't think Lee would have been as bad as Notch or Hilfenhaus.

Sounds like you are talking about Johnson, both similar bowlers. Can get you wickets but at what cost???


He was never the same bowler after he did his elbow in 2000, when he burst on the scene he looked like he would be a champion.

 

[typicalfan]

Sounds like you are talking about Johnson, both similar bowlers. Can get you wickets but at what cost???


He was never the same bowler after he did his elbow in 2000, when he burst on the scene he looked like he would be a champion.

I was going to say similar to Johnson, except I felt Lee had good control Johnson at times may as well run in with his eyes closed.

Johnson at his best is slightly better than Lee at his best, Lee nowhere near as bad as Johnson when he loses the plot.

Lee was good for about a season after McGrath retired but then he went downhill.

 

[AusKnightRKO]

Like you said lee for the 1 n half seasons after pidge retired he was awesome but the elbow gave way

But seriosuly brutus give yourself a uppercut

 

[Tonearm Terrorwrist]

Sounds like you are talking about Johnson, both similar bowlers. Can get you wickets but at what cost???


He was never the same bowler after he did his elbow in 2000, when he burst on the scene he looked like he would be a champion.

Lee didn't have the 3 metre-wide long hop wicket taking delivery that Johnson has, similar stats but Lee was nowhere near as erratic as Johnson. Lee bowled a lot of short and wide crap in between his good balls but you generaly depend on him to put in the spot more than Johnson.

You're right about his elbow injury he was never the same again.

 

[typicalfan]

Notch has a better economy rate than Binga but a lot of his wide stuff is too wide to play at. Binga served a lot on a platter.

 

[hineyrulz]

Lee didn't have the 3 metre-wide long hop wicket taking delivery that Johnson has, similar stats but Lee was nowhere near as erratic as Johnson. Lee bowled a lot of short and wide crap in between his good balls but you generaly depend on him to put in the spot more than Johnson.

You're right about his elbow injury he was never the same again.

Probably being a bit hard on Bing, plus Johnson never had to share his wickets with Pidge,Warne,Dizzy,Kasper and MacGilla. And as you say Johnson is the master at picking up wickets with wide Poo, he's a champion at that.

 

[typicalfan]

The strike rate is impressive I mean both Notch and Binga took less balls to get 100 wickets than Akram or Ambrose, that is impressive even if you are getting tonked in between.

I felt Lee never really found his length in tests until Pidge retired either too short or too full, he definitely should have been more consistent and had a better average for his talent.

For the record the best bowler in the world Dale Steyn has a worse economy rate than Lee but has one of the best strike rates of all even better than Sid Barnes.

 

[ANTiLAG]

Lee didn't have the 3 metre-wide long hop wicket taking delivery that Johnson has,

Not many bowlers do :lol:

 

[JJ]

Brett Lee is one of our greatest personalities. He might get fired up but what fast bowler hasn't. And he backs it up unlike Johnson.

Lee was the best ODI bowler in the world alongside Bracken at one stage and has clearly out performed the wild thing and any other pace bowler this summer for Australia.

Ordinary test bowler although he could always get a wicket even if he went for runs. And an average of 31 would have definitely been handy, do you know the bowling averages for the summer for the likes of Hilfenhaus, Siddle, Harris and Johnson?

Siddle 35
Hilfenhaus 59
Harris 26
Johnson 37


So Harris aside Lee is clearly doing ok with an average of 31 in this case

Lee had plenty of tours when whe performed in a Hilfenhaus-like manner... his career record against England is poor (to be kind), and that was against English teams not anywhere near as good as this one

 

[ozbash]

amazing how so many people who have never met the guy can know him so well

have a look at yourselves, not him

what have you douchebags ever done for your country ?

:shock: "gasp" Twizzle, I know someone whoes friend saw 'bunga' at an airport, once

Looking at myself is not part of my daily rootine ;-)

I do lots for my country, thanks very much...

 

[Benjitheking]

Shane Watson holds that title but Lee's in the top 10 though.

 

[Red Bear]

Lees best bowling period in test cricket was from 2005-India 2008, where he broke down again. He finished very poorly, but he bowled well for three years before that, when he was actually fit.

Lee was ruined by injury through much of the 2000-2005 period, constantly on the mend (about 9-12 operations during his career), and a role in the side which was to just charge in (when bowling with McGrath and Gillespie).

He wasnt a great test bowler, although still took 300 wickets, but his best was when he had a long period of fitnes from 2005-08 - 31 tests (from the beginning of 05 Ashes, comeback series which wasnt great, till just before indian tour) for 150 wickets at 27.65, strike rate of 49.2, economy of 3.37. Take it from post Ashes and its an even better record, and his performances after Mcgraths retirement were supurb (including 24 wickets at an average of under 23 against India at home). It's just he broke down in India and after that Australia, and faded really badly. sh*t happens.

42 wickets at 16 or so in his first 7 tests wasnt bad either.

in 30 tests between Ashes 01 and Ashes 05 however he only took 97 wickets at about 38, a product of rarely being fit in part.

Shame, should've been a better test cricketer than he was.

Also a great guy off the field from all reports. Few friends of mine met him at of all events the FFA awards night and said he was a really nice guy.

 

[ANTiLAG]

My opinion on Lee is the same as many non-Aussies. If the beamers were actually accidental then he is respected. Even if he has exerburnace in celebration. If the beamers were intentional then he is a limp bastar(|.

 

[typicalfan]

Lee had plenty of tours when whe performed in a Hilfenhaus-like manner... his career record against England is poor (to be kind), and that was against English teams not anywhere near as good as this one

Hilfenhaus took 7 wickets in the recent series, I can tell you Brett Lee has never taken 7 wickets or less in a 5 match series (or a 4 match series)

Even in the ashes of 2005 where he averaged 41 he still managed 20 wickets. This is the point I am making. Lee might go for runs but you will never see 1/517 or any rubbish like that because he takes wickets. Thus he would have been an improvement.

He has averaged over 40 in 3 match series and still taken double what Hilfenhaus did in 5 matches.

 

[Brutus]

Brett Lee is one of our greatest personalities. He might get fired up but what fast bowler hasn't. And he backs it up unlike Johnson.

Lee was the best ODI bowler in the world alongside Bracken at one stage and has clearly out performed the wild thing and any other pace bowler this summer for Australia.

Ordinary test bowler although he could always get a wicket even if he went for runs. And an average of 31 would have definitely been handy, do you know the bowling averages for the summer for the likes of Hilfenhaus, Siddle, Harris and Johnson?

Siddle 35
Hilfenhaus 59
Harris 26
Johnson 37


So Harris aside Lee is clearly doing ok with an average of 31 in this case

Lee averaged 40.6 against England in 18 tests if you really want to get down and dirty with facts. He would have fitted in well with that lot.

 

[Brutus]

Does it answer the question posed in the thread's title Brut?

Lee wins it for consistency.

I really enjoyed his 1/68 off 8 overs the other day. Clarkey should have bowled for the full 10 overs. 1/90 would have looked much better.

I'm enjoying all these excuses as to why his Test career wasn't as good as it could have been.