Italy v Scotland Euro Cup

[Ari Gold]

Italy's first foray into a major tournament, it'll be interesting to see how they go. Unlike other countries, they have good relations with rugby union which has helped a lot with the development.
Good to see some big companies involved in the tournament, and hopefully a decent sized crowd will turn up considering it is free entry.

Scotland to win by plenty though, I am very surprised the Italians didn't select more players from abroad though.

 

[Ari Gold]

http://www.rlef.eu.com/news.php?id=1166

ITALIANS LOOK TO MAKE STEP UP

Wednesday 14th October 2009

The Italian side set to take on Scotland in Padua on Saturday evening will be a relatively inexperienced but highly determined one.

The Azzuri have been promoted into the rugbyleague.com European Cup, where they will also face Lebanon in Tripoli, after winning and then retaining the European Shield.

They include imposing centre Mark Dalle Cort for the group games, who has Super League experience, Marco Ferrazzano who played at Keighley and former Workington half back Franco Kmet who is currently with Wests Tigers.

Six of those selected come from the fledgling domestic competition in the country, with all four clubs – Nafit, Mastini, La Rocca and Piemonte – represented, along with players from the French league

Rugby League European Federation Executive Development Officer and Tournament Director, Kevin Rudd - who will be at the game - commented, “It is a tough ask for the Italians to step up to this level, especially with the short notice they had to prepare but it’s a challenge I know they are relishing and they aim to compete.”

“Scotland will prove to be a stern first test after their successful exploits in the World Cup but the Italians are looking to make a significant impression in front of their passionate home crowd.”


ITALY 20-MAN SQUAD

1 Edoardo Lerna Woodrush
2 Angelo Ricci Queensbury
3 Ludovico Torreggiani Nafit XIII
4 Marco Ferrazzano Unattached
5 Jason Dubas Fisher Leeds Akkies
6 Matthew Sands Lyon
7 Paul Stanica Nafit XIII
8 Daniele Pasqualini Mastini XIII
9 Filippo Veronese La Rocca XIII
10 John Grasso Amatory Catania
11 Pier Luigi Gentile Piemonte XIII
12 Nicola Facco Nafit XIII
13 Roccaro Marco Carpentras
14 Florian Anchisi Entraigues
15 Greg Brincat Randwick
16 Shane Pavan Unattached
17 Mark Dalle Cort Unattached
18 Franco Kmet West Tigers
19 Cameron Ciraldo Newcastle
20 Ben Falcone Balmain

 

[roopy]

Ciraldo flew over?
Good on him - although he is coming back from a horror injury and i'm sure he won't be playing like a firstgrader just yet.

 

[Ari Gold]

It's actually very beneficial for Ciraldo to be playing these few games, he has just come back from a devastating injury and he needs some match fitness and experience before pre-season training commences again.

Italy will struggle though, some of the better Italian based players are missing, I'm assuming they have Serie A Rugby Union commitments.

On top of that, they are also missing Cyril Armani (Avignon), Paul Franze (Gateshead, Chris Borgese (Redcliffe) and Aiden Guerra (Melbourne), quite possibly their 4 best players from the 30 man squad named last week.

 

[1895]

Six of those selected come from the fledgling domestic competition in the country, with all four clubs – Nafit, Mastini, La Rocca and Piemonte – represented, along with players from the French league

I tried looking for some results or anything on these 4 Italian club teams and there are no results or matches except players allegedly playing for them getting picked for Italy! The only domestic game that I have found that happened in 2009, was that Southgate College from London played an Italian Domestic XIII in June. I hope that there was games played and would look better if this was backed up with some Photos etc but I fear nothing really is happening in Italy except a group of Union players playing League for Italy. The Italian Website is not very informative and is out of date by the look of things.
And I also think its sad that teams like Italy, Scotland, Ireland field teams that have only 6 or 7 Italian Born Natives in out of a squad of 20! Its a shame the RLIF allow these Nations to field a strong "Australian/English" teams. The rules should be changed so that out of 20 Players-15 should be Native players. We would then be able to see how strong the game is in a Country and also it looks like a more proper National team not just a set of very passionate people with Italian/Scottish,Irish etc ancestory! Also its not really fair that Serbia who have done heaps of development and use mainly Serbs are forced to play against Nations that are full of Aussie and English with Irish, Scottish etc backgrounds.

 

[miguel de cervantes]

I tried looking for some results or anything on these 4 Italian club teams and there are no results or matches except players allegedly playing for them getting picked for Italy! The only domestic game that I have found that happened in 2009, was that Southgate College from London played an Italian Domestic XIII in June. I hope that there was games played and would look better if this was backed up with some Photos etc but I fear nothing really is happening in Italy except a group of Union players playing League for Italy. The Italian Website is not very informative and is out of date by the look of things.
And I also think its sad that teams like Italy, Scotland, Ireland field teams that have only 6 or 7 Italian Born Natives in out of a squad of 20! Its a shame the RLIF allow these Nations to field a strong "Australian/English" teams. The rules should be changed so that out of 20 Players-15 should be Native players. We would then be able to see how strong the game is in a Country and also it looks like a more proper National team not just a set of very passionate people with Italian/Scottish,Irish etc ancestory! Also its not really fair that Serbia who have done heaps of development and use mainly Serbs are forced to play against Nations that are full of Aussie and English with Irish, Scottish etc backgrounds.

Welcome to the forum 1895.

This is a much discussed topic. At the end of the day the teams are trying to win and they will select whoever is necessary to try and do just that. I guess at least this suggests the tournament means something to them.

In the long run, with Serbia fielding more "pure" sides, when tighter restrictions are applied they will be the ones that benefit the most having blooded more domestic players.

 

[roopy]

People need to think about the alternative before they constantly criticise the grandparent rule.
Without it we have 5 international sides and some park level sides below that - not much better than International AFL.
What we have is what we have - and it is great.
Build a bridge - and get the f**k over it.

 

[Ari Gold]

I tried looking for some results or anything on these 4 Italian club teams and there are no results or matches except players allegedly playing for them getting picked for Italy! The only domestic game that I have found that happened in 2009, was that Southgate College from London played an Italian Domestic XIII in June. I hope that there was games played and would look better if this was backed up with some Photos etc but I fear nothing really is happening in Italy except a group of Union players playing League for Italy. The Italian Website is not very informative and is out of date by the look of things.
And I also think its sad that teams like Italy, Scotland, Ireland field teams that have only 6 or 7 Italian Born Natives in out of a squad of 20! Its a shame the RLIF allow these Nations to field a strong "Australian/English" teams. The rules should be changed so that out of 20 Players-15 should be Native players. We would then be able to see how strong the game is in a Country and also it looks like a more proper National team not just a set of very passionate people with Italian/Scottish,Irish etc ancestory! Also its not really fair that Serbia who have done heaps of development and use mainly Serbs are forced to play against Nations that are full of Aussie and English with Irish, Scottish etc backgrounds.

Welcome to the forum.

So if something isn't on the internet it doesn't exist? :roll: However, try looking at rugby.it, and then in 10,100 Rugby section you will find a 70+ post thread on Italian rugby league. If you can translate it, you may be able to find some information there.

Secondly, have a look at the Italian squad from the European Shield
Italia: 1 Eduardo Lerna; 2 Marzio Ferraro; 3 Giovanni Franchi; 4Cyril Armani; 5 Christian Gigliodoro; 6 Marco Pozzebon; 7 Filippo Veronese; 8 Angelo Ricci; 9 Jonathon Marcinzack; 10 Fabio Berzieri (C); 11Matthew Sands; 12 Marco Ferrazzano; 13 Jason Dubas-Fisher. A disposizione: 14 Paul Stanica; 15 Mauro Di Maggio; 16 Daniele Pasqualini; 17 Nicola Facco

The players highlighted are the non-domestic players, and some of them include players from the French league. The only reason Italy called upon Aussie/English players for this tournament is because the Scotland/Ireland/Wales team are stacked full of SL/CC1 players.

And as they say, "when in Rome..."

 

[Ari Gold]

By the way, live commentary for the game is located at following link.

http://italiarugbyleague.blogspot.com/

 

[flamin]

The rules should be changed so that out of 20 Players-15 should be Native players.

Theres only 1 NZ Warrior in the Kiwis side - according to your idea I suppose you'd have to put the whole team in the squad then.

If players chose to play for a country and they are eligible that's fine - they just have to stick to that country for life.

 

[jim_57]

I think Scotland will win but not by too much. Scotland by around 20, I expect Italy to stand up well on home soil with a (hopefully big) home crowd behind them. That and Scotland will have to travel to Italy which will be a first for most of them I imagine and they don't have as good a side as last year.

 

[Evil Homer]

Scotland team:

1.Jamie BENN
2.Jon STEEL
3.Mick NANYN
4.Kevin HENDERSON
5.James NIXON
6.Brendon LYNDSAY
7.Gareth MOORE
8.Mitch STRINGER
9.Ben FISHER (c)
10.Neil LOWE
11.Alex STOZTACK
12.Richard FLETCHER
13.Lee PATERSON

14.Andy HENDERSON
15.John COX
16.Rob LUNT
17.Paddy COUPAR

 

[1895]

Theres only 1 NZ Warrior in the Kiwis side - according to your idea I suppose you'd have to put the whole team in the squad then.

If players chose to play for a country and they are eligible that's fine - they just have to stick to that country for life.

??? A native as in born in that Country! A player can be born in NZ or Italy etc and play elsewhere-he would still be classed as a native.

 

[1895]

So if something isn't on the internet it doesn't exist? :roll: However, try looking at rugby.it, and then in 10,100 Rugby section you will find a 70+ post thread on Italian rugby league. If you can translate it, you may be able to find some information there.

Where is the evidence then that Italy for example has 4 teams playing in a domestic comp? There is no evidence to support this. Please prove that there are 4 teams in Italy and that they have played games-maybe some Photos etc. Until then I and others doubt Italy has any proper domestic teams or comps.

Secondly, have a look at the Italian squad from the European Shield

You missed Marcinzak and so 6 Heritage players played against Czech and Italy used 7 against Germany in a Competition which has not a lot at stake. Its my opinion that Italy did not need to use so many heritage players in this particular competition.

ITALY V Czech (6 Players)

1 Lerna, 2 Ferraro,3 Franchi 4 Armani 5 Gigliodoro,6 Pozzebon,7 Veronese

8 Ricci, 9 Marcinzack ,10 Berzieri 11 Sands,12 Ferrazzano, 13 Dubas-Fisher

Subs
14 Stanica,15 DiMaggio,16 Pasqualini,17 Facco


ITALY v Germany (7 Players)

1.Lerna, 2.Veronese, 3.Franchi, 4.Armani, 5.Ferraro,6.Tomaso, 7.Fontana,
8 Berzieri, 9.Pasqualini,
10 Ricci, 11.Sands, 12.Ferrazzano, 13. Dubas Fisher,
Subs
14 Stanica,15 Di Maggio,16 Maserati, 17Facco

The players highlighted are the non-domestic players, and some of them include players from the French league. The only reason Italy called upon Aussie/English players for this tournament is because the Scotland/Ireland/Wales team are stacked full of SL/CC1 players.

And as they say, "when in Rome..."

And thats the point I am badly trying to make. Its ok having Internationals but for me it cheapens the shirt and the comp when a team has so many Heritage players in who in a couple of years will change Nations! I say 5 heritage players as thats enough and all though the standard is not the highest, the authenticity is better and the passion is still the same if not more! Whats the point in having the possibility of 20 Heritage players out of 26 Players on a field in an international? Do people not think that it is more a Heritage team than a proper National team?

 

[1 Eyed TEZZA]

So, this games on tonight, midnight (Aussie time), any radio broadcasts anyone can find?

 

[1895]

Scotland team:
1.Jamie BENN
2.Jon STEEL
3.Mick NANYN
4.Kevin HENDERSON
5.James NIXON
6.Brendon LYNDSAY
7.Gareth MOORE
8.Mitch STRINGER
9.Ben FISHER (c)
10.Neil LOWE
11.Alex STOZTACK
12.Richard FLETCHER
13.Lee PATERSON

14.Andy HENDERSON
15.John COX
16.Rob LUNT
17.Paddy COUPAR

Very poor and for me is Scotland Heritage! Steel is Scottish born. Coupar is as well but sure all the rest are not Scottish born-though not sure on Cox. It sides like this that make International Rugby League a joke! Is Serbia the only Nation who seems to take domestic and International Rugby League seriously?

 

[Evil Homer]

Cox plays for Edinburgh so I would guess is Scottish born.

Not sure what the problem is though - if you look at the football World Cup, there are only usually one or two nations who have the entire squad based domestically, and some nations have one or two domestic players at most. That's just the nature of international sport. The Scottish players all have Scottish blood in them, it's not even as if they qualify via the ridiculous residency rule, so as long as development work is going on in the country I do not see the problem with picking the strongest 17 available.

 

[hutch]

And I also think its sad that teams like Italy, Scotland, Ireland field teams that have only 6 or 7 Italian Born Natives in out of a squad of 20! Its a shame the RLIF allow these Nations to field a strong "Australian/English" teams. The rules should be changed so that out of 20 Players-15 should be Native players. We would then be able to see how strong the game is in a Country and also it looks like a more proper National team not just a set of very passionate people with Italian/Scottish,Irish etc ancestory! Also its not really fair that Serbia who have done heaps of development and use mainly Serbs are forced to play against Nations that are full of Aussie and English with Irish, Scottish etc backgrounds.

the one nation rule would sort out who is serious in playing for their country. i have no problem with the grandparent rule, but their should definately be a limit in how many per team are chosen using this rule. i dont think it should be 15 out of 20 who are 'native', but i would like to see 4 or 5 out of every 17 players in a national team as 'domestic products'. they dont necessarily have to still play in that country, so if they scored a pro contract overseas they would still count as domestic. this would give countries a greater incentive to develop their own players and not rely on other countries to do it for them. there was going to be a rule like this at the last world cup, but tonga threatened legal action and the rlif backed down. it was a pathetic move by tonga, and i believe it showed in the teams poor effort in the world cup.

serbia will reap the rewards in the future. they will have a bigger pool of passionate players who are actually serbian, instead of 15 players who would rather play for another country. they are putting in the deveopment at the moment and will hopefully improve their team in 5-10 years.

 

[hutch]

Without it we have 5 international sides and some park level sides below that - not much better than International AFL.
.

im hoping you were exagerating to stress your point because that is a ridiculous comparison. we are played in over 30 countries around the world, afl is played seriously in 1 and maybe socially in a handful of others.

 

[Ari Gold]

The FIRL have tracked down the son of Tagini, who was one of the Italian players that ran on the field against the Kangaroos in the 1960's, and he will be presenting the game ball just before kick-off.

A nice touch.