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Jake Arthur

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
91,176
One thing on Utokimanu, sure he makes some great meters fresh, but I think the club may have taken the new faster rules into consideration. It will be even faster this year and Utoki is still a massive unit. Should be interesting to see if he can get back in defense.
I missed the first twenty minutes of the game but when I watched it Utoikamanu was walking around in defence. Absolute plodder. I assume he made some massive carries early on.
 

Gazzamatta

Coach
Messages
15,611
Was the Tigpies trial that showcased Stefano on Kayo? I can't seem to find a replay.
The hype has me intrigued. Maybe the change has done him good.
 

The Rosco

Bench
Messages
2,908
Was the Tigpies trial that showcased Stefano on Kayo? I can't seem to find a replay.
The hype has me intrigued. Maybe the change has done him good.
It was on Kayo and nrl.com.
Stefano has trimmed down a fair bit, and played well enough last night.
As for hype . . . mate there's a 3 minute youtube highlight reel for every footymom that has a son that plays juniors. Stef had big wraps on him. You guys wouldn't release him early. It all adds to the mystique.
Anyway, I hope he plays up to his ability and puts in the effort. All we can ask, I guess.
 

hindy111

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Messages
62,867
Sorry Hindy I haven't watched the game, so I really can't comment on their performance, but I must say your analysis sounds about right from what we already know of some of these players and is very astute as always.

I am particularly interested in what you saw in Hollis. I have high hopes for him and I'm heartened to hear that he is coming along so well so far. Naiuku I know nothing about and will try to keep an eye out for him.

Hipgrave is one of these players that will never set the world on fire, but will fill a whole when you need experience and a bit of mussel for a short stint of time. He could never challenge someone of real class and ability like that of what Hollis seems to possess if fulfilled at NRL level.

The small sample I have seen of Arthur he reminds me of DCE, but fitter. He seems to have all the skills a halfback needs to succeed, without blistering pace but enough to get the job done. He just needs to keep working on the finer details of his game and he could just be our long term number 7 and future captain in about 3-5 years from now.

Anyway, has anyone got a link to a replay of the game? I wouldn't mind checking it our for myself. Thanks you.


Hollis is very mobile. Think James Tamou. The way he tackles is similar. Hold them up then wrestle them to the ground and rolls them on their back. It slows down the next play. I like Kafusi but one are he seems a little suspect to me is defense. But that maybe more to do with fitness and getting back into the defensive line.
He doesn't have the RAW power of a Kafusi. But I feel being 19 and not filled out yet along with the fact he has yet to play against real men he will gain this no issue. It wasn't like he was man handled. He would do a few good surges followed by a few Alvaro style ones.
He also has a huge motor. He made 137 mtrs and 26 tackles. Considering no footy was played last season or barely any that is a fair effort after 18mths of no game time.

He will need to develop an offload and add a bit of BRUT to his defense. But I predict he will be physically ready come 2022. Atleast for a bench role.

Naiuku is built like a brick. Unlike Sivo he doesn't shy away from his charges. Reminded me of Manu Vatuvei. Loved the collision and keeps those legs pumping once he hits the line. Aslong as he can read the game in defense and catch a high ball which may derail him then we will have a very good winger on our books.

Penisini looked explosive also.....
 

hindy111

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62,867
I missed the first twenty minutes of the game but when I watched it Utoikamanu was walking around in defence. Absolute plodder. I assume he made some massive carries early on.

In NSW cup it is what I noticed. One big charge then 2 or 3 where the defense would rush up before he gained any momentum and dominate him.
Defense he would always struggle to get back in the line. Every game I saw Tim Mannah and Gower made him look average. And NSW cup is slow. Ray Stone at this level looks like an animal in defense. He monsters guys and makes 30+ tackles no sweat.
 

TheRam

Coach
Messages
13,885
Agree.... But I reckon potentialy our spine is elite if the two young guys build and if Moses remains form.

I know what you and the other posters on here mean, but I view our spine to be elite already and here is why.

We have had 2 back to back seasons where we have out performed more celebrated and experienced spines and finished above them. And even though Moses had a very patchy season last year, we still managed to dominate most sides and that is with a spine that 2 of the 4 are relatively very inexperienced.

With more games now including finals, we will boost this season a very elite spine that baring injuries should be in the top 3 or 4 spines in the comp again. I mean when you are comparing all four players from each club as a whole, ours is right up there. We are better then almost all spines in the NRL.

Look for example the Roosters, Tedesco and Keary may edge out our two in those positions, but our hooker and 5/8th in my opinion are better, especially if Mahoney can recapture his running game, and we could even out point Keary or at least be evens with him if Moses recaptures his best form this year. (NOTE: Keary is their half playing in 6)

Then there is Penrith, I rate Cleary on last years form better then Moses and Api Koroisau also better then Mahoney, but then I rate our fullback better the theirs and the 5/8ths at this point at about even. But the thing here is Moses is not that far behind Cleary. So if he can start playing the way he can before his calf injury, then our spine is at least as good as theirs. But either way we aren't that far behind the Grand Finalists of last year.

Melbourne have Munster and Harry, who are obviously streets ahead of our 2 in these positions. But we have Moses who is at least as good as their 7. Then I know most would rate Papenhuyzen a better fullback the Guth, but I wouldn't trade Guth for him. He brings so much to our team that Pap doesn't, but I won't go into it here other then to say he is invaluable to our team. But yes the storm do on paper have an edge on our spine overall, but not by much at all, which means we are still in the elite class.

Then there is the Raiders. Other then fullback, their other 3 spine players are better or equal to our spine players on last years form overall, but Moses has the ability to exceed anything that George Williams can produce if he bounces back to his best this year. But either way we are up there and very close to them also.

Souths are a very good package of 4, that is overall in every position better then ours, but their problem, some could say like ours is consistency. But the 2 young blokes in our spine are a major reason for that inconsistency, needing more experience and maturity, whereas the Bunnies don't have that excuse. Also if Moses plays his best game this season, he has a better running game then Reynolds and has a kicking game almost as good.

Manly's 1 and 7 are obviously better and equal to ours in that order, but then we blow them away in the other to positions.

As for the rest of the NRL, we piss all over them.

The major takeaway from this though isn't if we have an elite spine, which to me is bleeding obvious, but just how elite it manages to get hinges on Moses regaining his running game and not losing his "team playmaker game" in the process. If this happens, not only have we got an elite spine, but we will catapult probably all the other spines in the NRL to being overall the best.

Also a major improvement will materialize if Mahoney starts to run. That alone will improve our attack by at least 20%. But even without much of a running game he is still high quality if not a little predictable in attack much like Jake Friend at the Roosters. Also at least this year we have backups for him, which may assist in his overall game too.

Note: I know that the abilities of one great superstar spine player like a Trbojevic or Mitchell can blow away any opposition team on their own and that is why they earn the big bucks. But I am analyzing the overall qualities of each spine as a whole. And remember, when playing a quality opponent like these guys if you have an overall high quality team who are all focused you can and we have minimised their contribution against us. The trick is for our spine players to step up and dominate over the rest of theirs.
 

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
62,867
Sorry Hindy I haven't watched the game, so I really can't comment on their performance, but I must say your analysis sounds about right from what we already know of some of these players and is very astute as always.

I am particularly interested in what you saw in Hollis. I have high hopes for him and I'm heartened to hear that he is coming along so well so far. Naiuku I know nothing about and will try to keep an eye out for him.

Hipgrave is one of these players that will never set the world on fire, but will fill a whole when you need experience and a bit of mussel for a short stint of time. He could never challenge someone of real class and ability like that of what Hollis seems to possess if fulfilled at NRL level.

The small sample I have seen of Arthur he reminds me of DCE, but fitter. He seems to have all the skills a halfback needs to succeed, without blistering pace but enough to get the job done. He just needs to keep working on the finer details of his game and he could just be our long term number 7 and future captain in about 3-5 years from now.

Anyway, has anyone got a link to a replay of the game? I wouldn't mind checking it our for myself. Thanks you.


If you go to the NRL website or app can view for free. That's how I watched it.
 

Delboy

First Grade
Messages
7,537
I must have watched a different game re Stefano, saw about 3 charges then little in defence, great kid but we over hyped him! Now looks like the same treatment at the Tigpies. If he starts , that says more about your front row stocks than anything.
 

Gary Gutful

Post Whore
Messages
52,937
I know what you and the other posters on here mean, but I view our spine to be elite already and here is why.

We have had 2 back to back seasons where we have out performed more celebrated and experienced spines and finished above them. And even though Moses had a very patchy season last year, we still managed to dominate most sides and that is with a spine that 2 of the 4 are relatively very inexperienced.

With more games now including finals, we will boost this season a very elite spine that baring injuries should be in the top 3 or 4 spines in the comp again. I mean when you are comparing all four players from each club as a whole, ours is right up there. We are better then almost all spines in the NRL.

Look for example the Roosters, Tedesco and Keary may edge out our two in those positions, but our hooker and 5/8th in my opinion are better, especially if Mahoney can recapture his running game, and we could even out point Keary or at least be evens with him if Moses recaptures his best form this year. (NOTE: Keary is their half playing in 6)

Then there is Penrith, I rate Cleary on last years form better then Moses and Api Koroisau also better then Mahoney, but then I rate our fullback better the theirs and the 5/8ths at this point at about even. But the thing here is Moses is not that far behind Cleary. So if he can start playing the way he can before his calf injury, then our spine is at least as good as theirs. But either way we aren't that far behind the Grand Finalists of last year.

Melbourne have Munster and Harry, who are obviously streets ahead of our 2 in these positions. But we have Moses who is at least as good as their 7. Then I know most would rate Papenhuyzen a better fullback the Guth, but I wouldn't trade Guth for him. He brings so much to our team that Pap doesn't, but I won't go into it here other then to say he is invaluable to our team. But yes the storm do on paper have an edge on our spine overall, but not by much at all, which means we are still in the elite class.

Then there is the Raiders. Other then fullback, their other 3 spine players are better or equal to our spine players on last years form overall, but Moses has the ability to exceed anything that George Williams can produce if he bounces back to his best this year. But either way we are up there and very close to them also.

Souths are a very good package of 4, that is overall in every position better then ours, but their problem, some could say like ours is consistency. But the 2 young blokes in our spine are a major reason for that inconsistency, needing more experience and maturity, whereas the Bunnies don't have that excuse. Also if Moses plays his best game this season, he has a better running game then Reynolds and has a kicking game almost as good.

Manly's 1 and 7 are obviously better and equal to ours in that order, but then we blow them away in the other to positions.

As for the rest of the NRL, we piss all over them.

The major takeaway from this though isn't if we have an elite spine, which to me is bleeding obvious, but just how elite it manages to get hinges on Moses regaining his running game and not losing his "team playmaker game" in the process. If this happens, not only have we got an elite spine, but we will catapult probably all the other spines in the NRL to being overall the best.

Also a major improvement will materialize if Mahoney starts to run. That alone will improve our attack by at least 20%. But even without much of a running game he is still high quality if not a little predictable in attack much like Jake Friend at the Roosters. Also at least this year we have backups for him, which may assist in his overall game too.

Note: I know that the abilities of one great superstar spine player like a Trbojevic or Mitchell can blow away any opposition team on their own and that is why they earn the big bucks. But I am analyzing the overall qualities of each spine as a whole. And remember, when playing a quality opponent like these guys if you have an overall high quality team who are all focused you can and we have minimised their contribution against us. The trick is for our spine players to step up and dominate over the rest of theirs.
5 teams have better spines but ours is still elite?
 

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
62,867
I don't think we will persist with Moses. He has this year and next. So will play this year as a 26yld and the following as a 27yld. It is of some concern that we had our best pack in a decade yet he had his worse season.
A guy with 150 NRL games under his belt. Has poor game management and once things are going off track a little he loses it. His only saviour could be if Dbags runs the show and he plays second fiddle.
Moses was terrific in 2019 and I felt 2020 he would be the elite half of the comp. But his rapid decline had me lose all faith in him. Perhaps he was injured and the calf was holding him back. I hope so. He is now entering his golden years and the next 4 should be the best of his career or we hope so. I am not convinced and I wouldn't be surprised if his career went pear shaped. We will have him for 2 more seasons. It may time perfect for young Arthur too slide into the side come the end of Moses. Drags would of had close to 80 games of NRL experience by then barring injury!
 

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