Lockyer > Johns: no contest

[Schiltzenberger]

I don't get how many Origin games Locky has to CONTROL before he gets the accolades he deserves from south of the border.

He kicked NSW out of game 1, and tonight he passed us into at least 20 points.

ON FIELD- Locky by heaps
OF FIELD- No contest

Honestly, what did Johns do at Origin level? 1 f'n game (gm 2 2005). The sad thing is, NSW fans I know say the same thing.

Just not LU posters...............and Ray Warren and Phil Gould.

I'm from NSW and think Lockyer was and is the better player of the 2. Johns was better defensively but Lockyer is better overall.

I thought Lockyer was one of the best fullbacks I'd seen, then he went to 5/8 and still looked great. If his defense was on par with Johns then there'd be no question from the media as to who is the best. I still don't think his defense was as bad as made out so I still rank him above Johns.

Johns was way over hyped right from the start of his career after scoring so many points on debut. He would have games where he did absolutely nothing but would walk away with 1 or 2 Dally M points.

 

[Big Pete]

Personally, I preferred Johns as a player.

I didn't understand this until tonight when Fittler was talking about Lockyer.

He started with 'Many people don't see Lockyer as a strong player'.

And to me, that summed it up.

Lockyer never had the physical presence Johns had, he had the passing game and a quality kicking game, but physically Lockyer could always be found wanting.

Don't get me wrong, Lockyer certainly has his advantages over Johns too, his positioning is fantastic and he was certainly faster and more agile but personally I find Johns' physical prowess more appealing.

With that said, another great performance by Lockyer. There were a lot of question marks about him as a player heading into this season and he's answered them as any true champion would.

 

[Big Pete]

If his defense was on par with Johns then there'd be no question from the media as to who is the best. I still don't think his defense was as bad as made out so I still rank him above Johns.

Neither.

Physically at times he can be found wanting, but he reads the play really well and invariably comes up with the right play 9/10.

 

[Tommy Smith]

Lockyer a better person? Not from the many stories ive heard of the man when he's on the piss.

As for playing ability, no offense to Lockyer who is a great player but Joey is the best player ive ever seen. Lockyer is great in every aspect (except defense) but Johns is simply better in every one of those areas. Better long passing game, short passing game, running game, putting blokes through holes, defender, long kicking, short kicking, goal kicking, He was amazing in everything he did.

No comparison. Sounds to me like typical QLDers getting all excited like they do after every good game Locky plays which leads to one of these threads.

Its like comparing Laurie Daley to Wally Lewis IMO. Daley was amazing but Lewis was the best.

 

[AuDragon]

No comparison. Sounds to me like typical QLDers getting all excited like they do after every good game Locky plays which leads to one of these threads.

 

[kruzin]

^ LOL pwnt.

 

[Tommy Smith]

Yeah by who? Some big fat chicken eating African American chick from Kentucky?

Must be, i mean who the f**k else uses an old cliched line like "talk to the hand"?

Argue the merits, ladies.

 

[AuDragon]

Yeah by who? Some big fat chicken eating African American chick from Kentucky?

Must be, i mean who the f**k else uses an old cliched line like "talk to the hand"?

Argue the merits, ladies.

Talk to the hand and... Count them fingers you idiot! :roll:

 

[Rudderriffic]

Talk to the hand and... Count them fingers you idiot! :roll:

There's four fingers there champ, what's your point?

 

[Dazzat]

Personally, I preferred Johns as a player.

I didn't understand this until tonight when Fittler was talking about Lockyer.

He started with 'Many people don't see Lockyer as a strong player'.

And to me, that summed it up.

Lockyer never had the physical presence Johns had, he had the passing game and a quality kicking game, but physically Lockyer could always be found wanting.

Don't get me wrong, Lockyer certainly has his advantages over Johns too, his positioning is fantastic and he was certainly faster and more agile but personally I find Johns' physical prowess more appealing.

With that said, another great performance by Lockyer. There were a lot of question marks about him as a player heading into this season and he's answered them as any true champion would.

And how many times does he have to "answer as a true champion" before people give him the credit. Does he have to miss the team bus and walk across the Brisbane River to the game?

People comparing skills of Johns, Thurston and Lockyer have missed the point.

The point I made was that according to total accumulated influence over the space of 15 years, there is no comparison. Lockyer is an Origin legend ... sustained excellence over 15 years. The best Johns fans can come up with is one series.

 

[Big Pete]

Lockyer is an Origin great.

I don't know what Andrew Johns has to do with Lockyer though, other than also being an Origin great.

 

[knaus]

yes lockyer is great. but look at the team he plays with. its the best origin side ever. if he played for the blues and could steer that rabble to 5 wins in the row. now thats greatness

 

[Hass]

It's no coincidence that the last time NSW won an Origin series was the last time Andrew Johns played.

Lockyer is an all-time great. He deserves LOTS of praise. But he's just not as good as Andrew Johns (nobody is).

Johns' Origin career was hampered by his numerous injuries. He was often out injured, returning from injury on the bench or being played out of position at hooker (where he still excelled but not to the same extent as he would have had he been picked at halfback).

That's why he never "dominated" Origin over a long period of time.

But he sure as hell dominated Rugby League for a long period of time.

Just because he's turned out to be an idiot off the field doesn't change his awsomeness on it.

 

[Dazzat]

It's no coincidence that the last time NSW won an Origin series was the last time Andrew Johns played.

Lockyer is an all-time great. He deserves LOTS of praise. But he's just not as good as Andrew Johns (nobody is).

Johns' Origin career was hampered by his numerous injuries. He was often out injured, returning from injury on the bench or being played out of position at hooker (where he still excelled but not to the same extent as he would have had he been picked at halfback).

That's why he never "dominated" Origin over a long period of time.

But he sure as hell dominated Rugby League for a long period of time.

Just because he's turned out to be an idiot off the field doesn't change his awsomeness on it.

This 'one man band' thinking is what has NSW in their current predicament. Start thinking 'team' and you might start rebuilding. Keep looking for the next Joey Messiah and look forward to a 10-peat.

Numerous injuries, and numerous games being not selected or picked at hooker?

The legend of Joey grows two-fold every year as the Maroon massacres continue.

 

[Joker's Wild]

Locky has surpassed Joey IMO as a much better all round footballer. He is an inspirational leader, has dominated 1 position (although the idiotic NSW selectors are mostly to blame for that regarding Joey) and has shown incredible longevity.

The biggest thing for mine is how Darren has conducted himself off the field, which in my mind is ever more important these days given the media climate.

Joey had the ability to change a teams fortunes all by himself but Locky has the ability to hold a team together. Much rarer talent

 

[MightyBronco]

Who knows? But i reckon Lucky runs rings around Johns...and would have carved up NSW last night even if Johns was playing...

 

[babyg]

Cliff Lyons is the most skillful player I reckon but measurement of a great is not all about skill.

Lockyer by a mile.

Lockyer 5 Origin series in a row
Johns Game 2 05.

 

[Dazzat]

Put it this way ... if you were picking a team ... for the future and were offered two players.

The first doesn't have as much noticeable skill, but is great at leading players and will stick around for years, and play at a high level year after year.

The second has all the skills, will win you a few games, but will not give you the length of service as the first.

Which would you pick? I think NSW selectors would probably pick the second even now.

 

[bluey]

FMD joey was a star, Locky is a great player but to say joey is not up with him wrong wrong wrong.

 

[Noa]

And again, look at the sides Darren ahs had around him at brisbane compared to Johns at Newcastle. They're both excellent players in their own right, but it certainly helps when you have a decent side as well as extreme skill.

Lockyer had some pretty sh*tty teams from 01-05 and still got them to the finals every year.