Match Discussion: Round 8 vs Sydney @ McDonald Jones Stadium

[macavity]

I just can't understand what anyone sees in Hoy. Plodtastic.

Poor Man's Shannon McDonnell

 

[Jono078]

I don't feel I've gotten enough off my chest so I'll have another little whinge/rant..

What does AOB actually do with the team this week?

You can tell the team started with enthusiasm last night but it quickly came undone due to errors and poor plays where it looked like they didn't know what to do. Players not knowing their roles and being able to execute relatively simple plays is the quickest way to kill confidence and any belief and what probably looks like a lack of desire - perhaps it's not that, it's just the lack of direction and not knowing what to do.

So seriously, what does AOB tell them this week? I think he needs to come up with a damn simple game (which you'd think we already have by watching them) and give each player something to focus on.

I don't want to see any more uncontested high kicks. I would much rather Mann, Crossland and Ponga just kick it as far as they can and I don't care if 90% of them go dead, as long as one holds up and we get a repeat set or apply pressure on a team coming out of their end then I'm ok with that, rather than a short kick which gets the opposition on the front foot right away with their forwards not having to run too far back.

Also I think he does need to change up the squad a little this week.

I would like to see Barnett go to 13 with Watson back to 14. Sue can be a front row replacement off the bench. Not sure how Fitzgibbon went in reserves but he can have his starting spot back and at the least I think he'll bring enthusiasm and excitement of playing his first game of the year.

Tuala has to go, at some point you have to say that kind of form is not accepted in FG.

End of random rant. I feel a bit better now, thanks.

 

[slotmachine]

Poor Man's Shannon McDonnell

Ouch

 

[perverse]

That's just it, isn't it? I have no idea what we do all off season, all week at training, etc. These guys are professionally paid to do this as a job, and they look more clueless than your average park footy team in executing even the most basic stuff.

 

[slotmachine]

It's why I find calls for a more expansive game plan baffling.

They can't run five one-out hit ups and get a kick away without f**king something up.

 

[Burwood]

It's amazing the amount of times we see set plays break down. We get a scrum 10m out, and the ball carrier needs to surrender because they've run behind a teammate. It must happen 5 or so times a game. The only time set plays don't break down is when they are run in slow motion like you'd expect to see in a training drill.

If this form keeps up much longer, the only really talented players we have like Best and Ponga are going to leave to get success elsewhere.

It worries me that Best is suffering from the exact same problem that Ramien had when here. He is essentially getting zero quality ball and being used as a battering ram. The kid has all the talent in the world, but we may as well be playing two extra 2nd rowers in the centres each week.

You can dismiss Ramien as being a dickhead, but it looks like that was only an issue he had with us- he seems to be quite happy playing at Cronulla and getting quality early ball from quite ordinary halves the likes of Moylan and Townsend.

 

[Loose Cannon]

Also I think he does need to change up the squad a little this week.

I would like to see Barnett go to 13 with Watson back to 14. Sue can be a front row replacement off the bench. Not sure how Fitzgibbon went in reserves but he can have his starting spot back and at the least I think he'll bring enthusiasm and excitement of playing his first game of the year.

Tuala has to go, at some point you have to say that kind of form is not accepted in FG.

This should have been implemented weeks ago. Barnett should be playing 25 balls to the wall at lock, before Watson subs on. Barnett is lost on the edge, restricting Best (as if we had a plan to use him), and has had little to no impact this year.

Tuala has been embarrassing and needs to go. I don’t care who gets his spot, Shibasaki aside.

AOB needs to work his interchange. If Jesse Sue can’t be used for 30 split around halftime, he is severely wasted.
Watson comes on and stays, Barnett slots wherever he is needed at the back end.

11 Friz
12 Fitz
13 Barnett

14 Watson
15 JSaf
16 Sue
17 Jones

 

[Spot On]

This should have been implemented weeks ago. Barnett should be playing 25 balls to the wall at lock, before Watson subs on. Barnett is lost on the edge, restricting Best (as if we had a plan to use him), and has had little to no impact this year.

Tuala has been embarrassing and needs to go. I don’t care who gets his spot, Shibasaki aside.

AOB needs to work his interchange. If Jesse Sue can’t be used for 30 split around halftime, he is severely wasted.
Watson comes on and stays, Barnett slots wherever he is needed at the back end.

11 Friz
12 Fitz
13 Barnett

14 Watson
15 JSaf
16 Sue
17 Jones

Totally agree with this. On paper, that looks much better. What do we have to lose?

 

[The Axe of Druss]

I assume that's not directed at me given the shit and trolling I've had hung on me for sticking up for him for the past 18 months (even though my words have been twisted and misinterpreted constantly too).

Either way, people are entitled to change their opinion and/or admit when they were wrong too. It's actually pretty mature and sensible. You should change your opinion when you believe the evidence indicates that your current position is wrong.

Messiah is the wrong word imo. He's just our only leader, and we're a better team with him. It's ok to say that while also thinking his short kicking game is abysmal and that we're paying him too much money. Both can (and imo are) true. You can think in more than 1 dimension and have a nuanced opinion.

It shows how much we're missing blokes like Guerra from last year, and I'll certainly put my hand up and say I wasn't too upset to see him retire.

Nah not specifically at you bro, honestly don't remember you ripping him too much

Was more directed at the wowsers who acted like he was the worst half who ever pulled on a jersey and were suggesting ridiculous ways he should be punted from the club, and are now pining for his return. They know who they are

Im all on board for punters changing their minds, I do it all the time myself. Just giggling at the huge pendulum swings from a big chunk of the fanbase

 

[Knight Tales]

Do we look at veterans again in the short term? Similar to Guerra etc. The kids are learning bad habits cos no one is pulling them into line.

 

[NoSchitSherlock]

I'm starting to wonder if there's something going on behind the scenes.
Management hassles in the club? Coaching conflicts? Suliebold joining has resulted in losses.
Also hearing about player parties.
Probably just rumours but, with that performance, it gets you wondering.

 

[Walk On Home Boy]

Do we look at veterans again in the short term? Similar to Guerra etc. The kids are learning bad habits cos no one is pulling them into line.

Klemmer, Green and Frizell have enough experience to point the others in the right direction imo. We've just got too much big money tied up in the wrong players. Combine that with an unproven coach and a few injuries and this is what we have. Still, I think the teams desire and effort should certainly be in question. It's pathetic tbh.

 

[Yosh]

You guys seen/heard this? Embarrassing... If I was AOB I would have this turned on all week everywhere at the club.

Lack of talent is one thing but lacking effort is unacceptable. Our set plays are slow because one half is 300 years old on one knee and the other literally can't make a spiral pass but the whole side should be the first to jump on a loose ball and should contest every high ball etc.

 

[Yosh]

Double Post!

 

[alexwilliams_66692007]

I find it quite ironic that since we changed our run out song to 'Better' we've been much, much worse

 

[NoSchitSherlock]

Our issue is that we don't have a winning culture.
It's a week by week thing with these guys. It's been that way for years.
Bennett would comment on how well we'd do in training but then not bring that to the game.
He also admitted players were playing for a spot.
None of these players know what it's like to be a consistently winning team in Newie. They weren't around when we could do that. For some supporters that winning culture is a distant memory but damn it's good.

You can't create a winning culture unless you win.
Maybe it's a top-down sort of thing.
I'd rather see someone in charge who has experienced us at our prime.

 

[Knight Tales]

Our issue is that we don't have a winning culture.
It's a week by week thing with these guys. It's been that way for years.
Bennett would comment on how well we'd do in training but then not bring that to the game.
He also admitted players were playing for a spot.
None of these players know what it's like to be a consistently winning team in Newie. They weren't around when we could do that. For some supporters that winning culture is a distant memory but damn it's good.

You can't create a winning culture unless you win.
Maybe it's a top-down sort of thing.
I'd rather see someone in charge who has experienced us at our prime.

Does anyone think Bennett would see us as unfinished business now WESTS have taken over? With him OC I would not put it past him to at least let them know he is open to offers if they decide AOB is not working out.

 

[Apey]

I think he cares about winning, anyone that plays any game or sport wants to win - but hunger is a different beast entirely. He doesn't crave it. There's no level of obsession or willingness to sacrifice to attain it that I've yet seen. To be honest it's not even that uncommon with freakishly talented people. The truth is he's probably never had to work that hard to be the best at whatever he put his attention to on any given day.

It's pretty well established that Kalyn doesn't really care that much about footy outside of training and game day. He doesn't watch other teams play, he doesn't put in extras. Talent will get you so far - and his talent is freakish, no question. That talent alone will not make him a champion, though. Most champions live and breathe the sport - and would play their next game immediately after a loss if it meant they had a chance to erase the loss they just copped. Kalyn will likely mope a bit with the boys in the sheds, go home and play some playstation and enjoy his day tomorrow - at least that's the impression that I get from him.

I'm a firm believer that the obsession is a key ingredient that turns talented players into greats. The absolute need they have to improve and to win. I'm yet to see it from Ponga tbh. That's just my read on it based on what I've seen from him over the years outside of game day. Maybe I'm wrong - I'd love for him to prove me wrong - but his inconsistency on the field only reinforces the belief in my head at this point.

I don't disagree re Ponga. I dont even disagree with your original post that Pearce is the best halfback and leader we have. That is a very sad but true statement.

I'm not sure he's as hungry for success as you make him out to be though.

 

[Apey]

You can dismiss Ramien as being a dickhead, but it looks like that was only an issue he had with us- he seems to be quite happy playing at Cronulla and getting quality early ball from quite ordinary halves the likes of Moylan and Townsend.

Ramien is still pretty garbage at Cronulla. Mildly better than he was here.

 

[Yosh]

Just watching more games recently and trying to analyze what the good teams do well, it looks more and more like we're playing a dinosaur version of the sport.

The days of the play making fullback seems to be over. The elite teams have fullbacks with skill but they are strong runners first and foremost. Plus they have great support play ability. Ponga looks like a modern 6 not 1.

Our wingers are too small or lack any real athletic ability. Just solid. They aren't the fastest, strongest nor most agile. They neither offer strong metres to start the set nor counter attacking threat. Hunt and Lee will be massive improvements. Tuala needs to go asap. Brodie, To'a or Young can have the right centre spot.

Our forwards are the least skilled in the competition. The war of attrition style of forward is gone now. Forwards either are super athletic or skillful and can shift the ball, playmake or step through themselves. I think the Saifiti boys have enough leg speed to be relevant but Klemmer’s style seems to be out of date. He needs to be working on his passing/playmaking game or get that killer offload back asap. No point making ten post contact metres if he gets out on his back and has the world's slowest play the ball.

Connor and Sue should be on the field together. Connor is our biggest threat through the middle and Sue hits the ball up with impact and offers quick play the balls. Barnett is skillful and should play to his strengths and not try to play like 6ft 6, 250 pound Polynesian who can run the 40 yard dash in under 5. Model his game on Jake Trbojevic. Should be given the license to kick early if he sees an opportunity.

For our horrendous fifth tackle options. Anything but what we're doing will be an improvement.