My season review - Sack Sheens

[Magpies Forever]

For that all too brief period where the main squad was Gallant, Ryan, Ayshford, Lawrence, Tuiaki, Marshall, Moltzen, Payton, Ellis, Heighington, Gibbs, Farah, Galloway with Morris, Skando and others off the bench things were about right with WT. What we didnt have was the depth to cover injuries. Injuries arent Teflon and co's fault but lack of depth recruitment in key positions is, as is the having to drag Sheens kicking and screaming to actually field the best team in their right positions eg downgrade Morris to bench, reshuffle backline and promote Gallant.

As soon as the injuries hit WT were stuffed- no experienced fall back players either from the lower grades or in the main 25 squad.

As an aside, for my 2 cents- I'd have also left the Marshall, Moltzen combo in the halves with Gallants injury and just filled that fullback position eg Hanbury or someone from lower grades. WT had actually got a performing halves combination going for the first time in years and they tinker with it yet again. Robbing Peter to pay Paul....

 

[weretiger]

I still cant understand why when your full back is out injured you replace him by breaking up a working half and 5/8 combination and bring in a 19year old who has never played 1st grade for the most important games of the seasons surely it would have been easier to find a fullback and why wasnt GALLNT fullback from game 1.ITS TIME FOR SHEENS TO GO. I would even consider Nathan Brown it couldnt be much worse.

 

[N.C.]

Key moment of 2009 = Morris signing with the Sharks for 2010.

Sure, we were on the back end of about a hundred game losing streak and looked gone for all money, but it wasn't until he broke ranks with King Tim and his band of merry pranksters that the miracle occured. He was dropped to the bench, Marshall moved back to 6, Moltzen was brought into the line and Gallant was finally given a run...

You can't credit Sheens with the fightback. We all know that if Morris had signed on with us for another couple of years Sheens would have kept a special spot warm for him, and it would not have been on the bench.

After all the mid-week rubish from Farah about missing the finals again being "unacceptable", I wonder what kind of press-conference Mr Sheens has planned for early next week? Or is he just going to let his skipper hang himself out to dry?

 

[Reek_Havoc]

Too many stuffups in regards to his team selections. Same story for 3 years. Peter Gentle, time to take over.

 

[b.bear]

Yeah what can i say thats the perfect word for the feeling ive got about this season "GUTTED" ,I can in no way put blame on the players for our failing to make the finals once again not even on our favourites morris,gibbs,payne etc at least they had a go what can expect from a team who has to put up with what has to be the biggest EGO in the nrl.This imbo is living on the past glories of our magnificent 2005 sqaud which would of won the GF that year even if they coached by my five yo daughter even though she was only 6mnths old at the time....he has got to go or he will eventually send our players to the madhouse through his mind games , non selection on form but through favouritism and many other tim'isms... on the upside Benji regaining his confidence as the year rolled on was good to see,Robbie had another good year holding us together,ELLIS buy of the year by a country mile , the emergence of ayshford good young player,TNT he's dynamite,moltzen our next Halfback , Gallant finally getting a run and showing what he's got,KG's early season form,they were alL upsides on another dissapointing end to the year.....BUT BACK TO THE SUBJECT AT HAND TIM SHEENS,ROYCE SIMMONS AND WARREN MCDONALD HAVE TO WEAR OUR FAILURE TO PROGRESS TO THIS YEARS FINALS AND AFTER 4 YEARS WITH THE PLAYERS WE'VE GOT ON OUR ROSTER ( AND PLAYERS WE HAVE LET GO) TO NOT MAKE THE FINALS SINCE 2005 IS A JOKE AND THEY HAVE TO GET THE F**K OUT OF THE TIGERS DEN OR THEY WILL BE THE RUINATION OF US ALL ....GET OUT TIM, ROY ,WARREN I THINK YOU HAVE DONE ENOUGH DAMAGE , JUST GO !!!!!!!

 

[adamkungl]

I'd be glad you missed the 8....it would have got Sheens another 4 year contract knowing WT management.

 

[Tigers_are_Pro]

What's devestating is we have the 3rd best attack and 8th best defense.

NRL doesn't have enough weighting on how good you've attacked/defended all season, especially with the fact that our losses that weren't by 1 or 2 pts, were last few minute blow outs IE Penrith, Cowboys.

 

[weretiger]

listening to 2sm today they were giving sheens all the credit for the tigers good end of season form :crazy:

 

[alien]

Oh, my bad, mastercoach thinks Laurie is a back rower

Mr Sheens is actually right about that one.

 

[DanOz]

Mr Sheens is actually right about that one.

Sorry mate, I'll check with you about the validity of my opinions in the future...

Alternately, we could agree to disagree.

 

[Everlovin' Antichrist]

I agree, Sheens have outlived his use-by-date by some considerable time.

We had Morris in the halves for the best part of 2 1/2 seasons when the bloke isn't a halves arsehole and when the crunch came via Gallant's injury this year he took Moltzen out of 7 and put him at 1.

He's has misused Laurie constantly, the bloke should have been on the bench for the Parra game if only to get under Moi Moi's skin. He keeps trying to fill in at prop with backrowers, we keep buying blokes like Mitch Brown and Geoff Daniella, neither of whom can get a run at Cronulla or Penrith respectively unless 1/2 their squad is injured.

We started this season with our best Fullback playing for the Magpies and the moment he put him in and he put Moltzen at 7, we started winning. Those changes were obvious to almost everyone here but he took 1/2 a season.

We lost Harrison and Laffranchi when neither wanted to leave and both have carved up for their new clubs. Harrison especially is annoying because he is showing for Canberra what he really never got the chance to show for us.

Collis is sh*t but plays regular NRL for us, as does Halatau. The only good thing is that we've punted them both.

But the big thing for me is Morris. It was blindingly obvious the bloke wasn't a 7 from very early on, but he kept him there. That alone killed 2 seasons for me.

 

[madunit]

The most major f**k up's Sheens has made has been in recruitment and retention.

Backloading contracts, paying overs etc has sacrificed our depth. We have a top 18-20 players all earning big bikkies, most of them getting overs, while we're stuck with about 5-6 players for depth.

Our inability to sign quality props over the past 4 years (we signed 1 good prop in that time) is ridiculous.

In the past 5 years we've had 3 top quality halfbacks, 1 of which was never given a proper chance (Head), another was never even looked at (Lewis) and the other was Prince.

Apart from Gallant, we never had a backup fullback.
We've never had a good enough back up for Benji, which is dumb considering the injuries he's had.
And our goalkicking stocks are very low. When you're main goalkicker happens to be one of the most injury riddled players in your side, you are running a big risk.

We need to get a new and more competent goalkicker, even if it's a backup to Benji initially.

And we need a ball playing lock. We've always needed one. The last ones we had were Ben Galea and Terry Hill ffs.

Obvious things we've always needed and never got.

Instead Sheens has been more inclined to buy backrowers and transform them into front rowers, make hookers play halves etc, the man is just f**ked in the head.

A coach is always worth sticking with if he is ahead or at least keeping up with the game and it's evolution.

Once a coach falls behind the pace, he'll never catch up.

Sheens fell behind before he got to the Tigers, 2005 while was great, It's very clear now given our results either side of the premiership, that it was a fluke. One I'm happy to have, but a fluke none-the-less.

His time has past, the game has left him behind, and while he tries to catch up to it, he's holding the players and the club back, preventing it from keeping up with everyone else.

This was by far a successful year, we were lucky that there was a large mid-table group all on around the same points on the ladder. People forget that before the 6 straight wins, only the Roosters were below us.

In 6 weeks we jumped 10 ladder positions, thanks to the close comp, not thanks to anything Sheens did.

 

[b.bear]

listening to 2sm today they were giving sheens all the credit for the tigers good end of season form :crazy:

yeah and that nong gavin robertson was probably agreeing ,he has to be the weakest tiger supporter i know

 

[super_coach]

Their has been a small group of us calling for Sheens head for quite some time now. I think madunit summed it up pretty well in his previous post. The side out performed my expectations this year by a long way but i put that down to Ellis and the availability of Farah and Marshall and nothing to do with Sheens at all. He was still guilty of poor selections,abysmal use of the interchange and inflexibility to be able to make changes. He also let his ego get in the way of the Laurie affair.

Now time to go--but will not happen, 2011 a new man will be in town but not 2010

 

[Front-Rower]

The most major f**k up's Sheens has made has been in recruitment and retention.

Backloading contracts, paying overs etc has sacrificed our depth. We have a top 18-20 players all earning big bikkies, most of them getting overs, while we're stuck with about 5-6 players for depth.

Our inability to sign quality props over the past 4 years (we signed 1 good prop in that time) is ridiculous.

In the past 5 years we've had 3 top quality halfbacks, 1 of which was never given a proper chance (Head), another was never even looked at (Lewis) and the other was Prince.

Apart from Gallant, we never had a backup fullback.
We've never had a good enough back up for Benji, which is dumb considering the injuries he's had.
And our goalkicking stocks are very low. When you're main goalkicker happens to be one of the most injury riddled players in your side, you are running a big risk.

We need to get a new and more competent goalkicker, even if it's a backup to Benji initially.

And we need a ball playing lock. We've always needed one. The last ones we had were Ben Galea and Terry Hill ffs.

Obvious things we've always needed and never got.

Instead Sheens has been more inclined to buy backrowers and transform them into front rowers, make hookers play halves etc, the man is just f**ked in the head.

A coach is always worth sticking with if he is ahead or at least keeping up with the game and it's evolution.

Once a coach falls behind the pace, he'll never catch up.

Sheens fell behind before he got to the Tigers, 2005 while was great, It's very clear now given our results either side of the premiership, that it was a fluke. One I'm happy to have, but a fluke none-the-less.

His time has past, the game has left him behind, and while he tries to catch up to it, he's holding the players and the club back, preventing it from keeping up with everyone else.

This was by far a successful year, we were lucky that there was a large mid-table group all on around the same points on the ladder. People forget that before the 6 straight wins, only the Roosters were below us.

In 6 weeks we jumped 10 ladder positions, thanks to the close comp, not thanks to anything Sheens did.

I agree with everything you said except for 2005 being a fluke. When you take in to perspective that team we had:

* A world Class fullback in Hodgson who could kick goals and positional play was 1st class

* A winger who scored 20 odd tries in Pat Richards (although Tui was up there this year and very much as damaging)

* A young 5/8th in Marshall who not only combined with Prince like vegemite on toast, but the rugby league world really knew nothing about and he blew them away

* A world class centre in Whaturia who also scored 20 odd tries

* Laffranchi in the pack with a young Farah who also nobody outside the wests tigers knew much about and he to took the game by storm

* Bryce Gibbs was a bench player (which I think is where he belongs)

Since then we have lost Prince so we brought Morris :crazy: Hodgson should of been replaced with Gallant but we all know he wasn't until Sheen's hand was forced, Lawrence has come along in leaps and bounds but still has a fair way to go and Tuiaki has done a sensational job.

The only decent signing we have seen is Ellis. Thank goodness for him, Farah and Marshall this year or else we would of been baking the cake with the spoon and not the roosters.

 

[westie]

I agree, Sheens have outlived his use-by-date by some considerable time.

We had Morris in the halves for the best part of 2 1/2 seasons when the bloke isn't a halves arsehole and when the crunch came via Gallant's injury this year he took Moltzen out of 7 and put him at 1.

He's has misused Laurie constantly, the bloke should have been on the bench for the Parra game if only to get under Moi Moi's skin. He keeps trying to fill in at prop with backrowers, we keep buying blokes like Mitch Brown and Geoff Daniella, neither of whom can get a run at Cronulla or Penrith respectively unless 1/2 their squad is injured.

We started this season with our best Fullback playing for the Magpies and the moment he put him in and he put Moltzen at 7, we started winning. Those changes were obvious to almost everyone here but he took 1/2 a season.

We lost Harrison and Laffranchi when neither wanted to leave and both have carved up for their new clubs. Harrison especially is annoying because he is showing for Canberra what he really never got the chance to show for us.

Collis is sh*t but plays regular NRL for us, as does Halatau. The only good thing is that we've punted them both.

But the big thing for me is Morris. It was blindingly obvious the bloke wasn't a 7 from very early on, but he kept him there. That alone killed 2 seasons for me.

Collis wasn't punted, he took the smart option.

 

[N.C.]

I agree with everything you said except for 2005 being a fluke. When you take in to perspective that team we had:

* A world Class fullback in Hodgson who could kick goals and positional play was 1st class

* A winger who scored 20 odd tries in Pat Richards (although Tui was up there this year and very much as damaging)

* A young 5/8th in Marshall who not only combined with Prince like vegemite on toast, but the rugby league world really knew nothing about and he blew them away

* A world class centre in Whaturia who also scored 20 odd tries

* Laffranchi in the pack with a young Farah who also nobody outside the wests tigers knew much about and he to took the game by storm

* Bryce Gibbs was a bench player (which I think is where he belongs)

Since then we have lost Prince so we brought Morris :crazy: Hodgson should of been replaced with Gallant but we all know he wasn't until Sheen's hand was forced, Lawrence has come along in leaps and bounds but still has a fair way to go and Tuiaki has done a sensational job.

The only decent signing we have seen is Ellis. Thank goodness for him, Farah and Marshall this year or else we would of been baking the cake with the spoon and not the roosters.

Great post, but don't forget Big Keith...

Aside from Ellis and Galloway, what signings (with NRL experience) have we made since 2005 who are still have on our books? Compare that to those who have walked or will depart at years end.

Payne, Galea, Hanbury (not confirmed whether they are staying or going)

vs

Lolesi, Harris, O'Hara, Morris, Youngquest...

There are probably others, but on my quick count, two out of ten is a pretty poor strike rate.

 

[madunit]

Buys since 2005:
Keith Galloway
Sam Harris
Jamaal Lolesi
Tevita Metuisela
Ryan O'Hara
Danny Galea
Jason Moodie
John Morris
Matt Head
Corey Payne
Ryan Tandy
Gareth Ellis
Rhys Hanbury

 

[Tiger Hawk]

Collis wasn't punted, he took the smart option.

From that I'm gathering we offered a contract? So if we did, and he signed for the Sharks, I'm assuming it's either because it's for more money, or he wanted out of the place. Fair enough on either count for mine, let someone else overpay him, or if he just wanted out can't blame him as he doesn't suit our style of play.

If we didn't offer a contract though (not I would know either way), he was punted. And the club, for once, took the smart option.

 

[baddog]

collis and halatau both wanted out because they didn't want to play under the coach and took pay cuts to do it. laurie also wants out of the joint for the same reason.