NBA Off-Season Signings/Trades

[betcats]

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[betcats]

TBH the talk of "did they trade the right guy" will stop soon as he has a few more of the 33% shooting nights with 5 TO like today. Although RW has about that every 2nd night. I actually think Martin has played well for OKC.

I heard some nupty today comparing him to MJ on a broadcast. An audible "bitch please" was heard from my house.

Harden has impressed me more than I thought in 2 out of 3 games so far this season.

But the issue with him is getting a shot off under pressure. Case in point today....Wes Matthews was ALL over him...and his shooting percentage reflects that. When he plays against inferior defensive guards he looks fantastic - i.e. Stuckey and Lou Williams essentially.

What I'd like to see him do to really show he is a great player is when he comes up against a guy who is good defensively...to treat em like they aren't there...or find other ways to get to the basket or create opportunities for others.

Now it isn't to say he doesn't get the respect of other teams - in the Finals last year they had LeBron on him ALOT....goes to show the respect they have for him.

But I'd still say he needs to take that next step of being dominant against what many perceive are better players or more dominant teams.

But he has taken significant strides to be an All-Star calibre player.

Firstly, 8 - 24 isnt all that bad. Kobe, Westbrook, Rose etc all regurlarly get forgiven for similar shooting nights and all of them have better teams and better second options then Harden.

Secondly, 24, 6 and 5 or whatever he had is an ok game, even with the turnovers.

Thirdly, He doesnt have to score 40 points every night to prove he is a star.

 

[Big Mick]

Again...taking one thing out of the post without acknowledging the balance.

Firstly, the response for 33% shooting was with regards to comparisons saying OKC should have traded Westbrook instead. I was saying a few more of those nights when he is just "regular" rather than elite shooting will quiet that talk.

Secondly, I provide legit constructive criticism preventing him from being elite....but I'm bagging him out? What he didn't struggle under defensive pressure in the Portland game? I'm meant to just forget that instead of saying it is something that he's had issues with in his career and needs to fix it to beat good teams?

Not every player is perfect. I like Harden ffs but just because I like him doesn't mean I can't point out some problems in his game.

 

[betcats]

Again...taking one thing out of the post without acknowledging the balance.

Firstly, the response for 33% shooting was with regards to comparisons saying OKC should have traded Westbrook instead. I was saying a few more of those nights when he is just "regular" rather than elite shooting will quiet that talk.

Secondly, I provide legit constructive criticism preventing him from being elite....but I'm bagging him out? What he didn't struggle under defensive pressure in the Portland game? I'm meant to just forget that instead of saying it is something that he's had issues with in his career and needs to fix it to beat good teams?

Not every player is perfect. I like Harden ffs but just because I like him doesn't mean I can't point out some problems in his game.

You can point out problems in his game if you want, that is a lot different to your original statement of "He is not a starter, he is a max guy, he is not a first option" That is a very strong statement, and so far after three games your only evidence to back that up is that he is bothered by good defenders.

Im not saying your definately wrong, but I have a strong opninion on the matter and as this is a place of disscussion I want to comment on it.

Don't make such strong statements and then have a whinge when you are called on them.

 

[betcats]

"The kid is a genuine talent, but I don't believe he can lead a team to a title as a #1 player on a team like a superstar".

Talk about a back track.

There are probably only 3 or 4 guys in the league who are capable of doing that right now.

 

[simostorm]

I think i know what big mic is saying.. hardens first two games have surprised a lot of ppl.. he's certainly shown in 2 games what he's capable of.. but before those two games there was definite reason to doubt as we've never seem harden on a team by himself..

 

[betcats]

I agree that there was doubt, most of which was around Hardens ability to be the man and deal with everything extra that comes with it. Is there still some doubt? Yes. Is there as much doubt as there was a week ago? Shit No.

Also Micks statement left no room for doubt, he was firmly of the opinion that Harden could not be the man in Houston, is not worth max money and cannot be a starter(think he means 'star' here), which is wrong imo.

Anyway it sounds like im have a go at Mick with this and my previous comments, I'm not, Mick, i'm just very passionate about basketball.

 

[Big Mick]

I think i know what big mic is saying.. hardens first two games have surprised a lot of ppl.. he's certainly shown in 2 games what he's capable of.. but before those two games there was definite reason to doubt as we've never seem harden on a team by himself..

Bingo. Aint that hard.

 

[Big Mick]

Anyway it sounds like im have a go at Mick with this and my previous comments, I'm not, Mick, i'm just very passionate about basketball.

Could have fooled me champ because it sounds like it.

Reason for the "backtrack" was there was a sample size of two games as a genuine #1 option and he genuinely impressed me. You, yourself just said there was doubt about whether he could be the man a week ago...what I can't re-evaluate a position but you can?

Special K gave me the chance to re-evaluate the statement so I did. Doesn't change the fact he still needs to work on his game. He aint perfect.

And doesn't change the fact that I think he needs a superstar with him to win a title and that he needs to work on finding alternative ways of distributing or getting to the basket when he is smothered by good defenses. They are genuine improvements that need to be made on a personal and team level. It aint a slight on him...it is not being biased.

 

[simostorm]

Well one thing hardens done to Houston is made them worth watching now.. didn't really care for them before..

 

[Big Mick]

Well one thing hardens done to Houston is made them worth watching now.. didn't really care for them before..

Must watch for me now.

I'm also impressed with Asik. A lot were critical of his deal but I think he'll end up living up to it. Dude sets the best picks you can run pick and roll off him all day.

 

[Ridders]

Imo it's a bit early to be making a judgement, either way, on Harden. Will probably wait till the All-star break to judge how he's measured up to being a No.1 option. His first couple of games probably blew out expectations a bit. Imo if he can average around 22-5-5 on good efficiency, then imo that's definitely worthy of his contract.

 

[betcats]

I think while Harden is the only big star on that team he'll get 20 5 5 pretty easily. His game is so well rounded, if the rockets can slip into the playoffs then I honestly believe he'll be up there in the mvp discussions. Maybe not a serious threat but one worth mentioning. Thats IF they can make the palyoffs.

 

[betcats]

Could have fooled me champ because it sounds like it.

Reason for the "backtrack" was there was a sample size of two games as a genuine #1 option and he genuinely impressed me. You, yourself just said there was doubt about whether he could be the man a week ago...what I can't re-evaluate a position but you can?

Special K gave me the chance to re-evaluate the statement so I did. Doesn't change the fact he still needs to work on his game. He aint perfect.

And doesn't change the fact that I think he needs a superstar with him to win a title and that he needs to work on finding alternative ways of distributing or getting to the basket when he is smothered by good defenses. They are genuine improvements that need to be made on a personal and team level. It aint a slight on him...it is not being biased.

Maybe you're just sensitive?? lol Either way I could care less Mick.

You made a dumb statement, got called on it then tried to change it to something completely different because you realised how far off your original statement was and you don't want to admit it was wrong.

Oh and the Hawks backcourt held Westbrook to 14pts yesterday.

 

[betcats]

Harden isn't a starter. He isn't a #1 option. He isn't a max guy.

I think i know what big mic is saying.. hardens first two games have surprised a lot of ppl.. he's certainly shown in 2 games what he's capable of.. but before those two games there was definite reason to doubt as we've never seem harden on a team by himself..

Bingo. Aint that hard.

Full of shit Mick, Stand by what you said.

 

[Big Mick]

I did admit I was wrong. By changing the statement and admitting he was much better than I thought was admitting I was wrong. Far out, it isn't that hard.

As for being sensitive?...lol. I'm the one who was having a decent conversation with Special K and re-evaluated the position. Then you chime in with ultra-aggressive bullshit and then try to mask it with "I'm just passionate". Then you chime in with "Stand by your position". Why? I altered it because of what I've seen thus far and made my position meaningless. I can't wait for the next time you are wrong on something...ever so slightly.

Maybe you are the one that is sensitive champ. Perhaps you should open your eyes to read what's been said instead of reading the first line.

 

[betcats]

I did admit I was wrong. By changing the statement and admitting he was much better than I thought was admitting I was wrong. Far out, it isn't that hard.

As for being sensitive?...lol. I'm the one who was having a decent conversation with Special K and re-evaluated the position. Then you chime in with ultra-aggressive bullshit and then try to mask it with "I'm just passionate". Then you chime in with "Stand by your position". Why? I altered it because of what I've seen thus far and made my position meaningless. I can't wait for the next time you are wrong on something...ever so slightly.

Maybe you are the one that is sensitive champ. Perhaps you should open your eyes to read what's been said instead of reading the first line.

Ultra aggressive? lol f**k me you are precious Mick.

Im not a sensitive little school girl so next time im wrong about something ill cop it sweet.



Anyway your new position is Harden needs another star to win a championship, right?


Well genius, who was the last superstar to win by themselves? The only two this decade that even really come into contention are Duncan and Dirk. The Pistons are an anomally as far as im concerned.

IMO they dont count, Duncan had Parker and Ginobli(both all starss). Dirk had Butler, Kidd and Chandler who are all still top ten players in there position, have been or are all stars and Kidd is a future HoFer.

So in the last decade no superstar has won without atleast one more supersater or multiple all star calibre players on their team.




edit: seriously, ultra aggresive? lol how do you even be ULTRA aggresive on an internet forum, what a joke.

 

[Big Mick]

lol. Exhibit A.

So now I'm wrong for saying he needs a superstar to win a championship? *sigh* So over this dumb conversation. It's like talking to a brick wall.

You know what - whatever you say Betcats. Harden is an All-Star #1 option and the next MJ. You are clearly the authority on all things NBA. And oh so passionate! All hail Betcats!

Whenever I have an opinion on the NBA in the future I'll be sure to clear it with you first.

 

[betcats]

You're an idiot for saying he needs a superstar, Mick. Even Jordan needed Pip. Its a nothing opinion.

If the Goat, Kobe LBJ etc had to team up with another star of course Harden does you f**king idiot.

Sorry if that was too ULTRA aggressive for you.


You obviously don't have much of an idea about the NBA so you should clear your opinions with someone cause they are bull shit and you are clearly talking out of your ass.

 

[Big Mick]

You obviously don't have much of an idea about the NBA so you should clear your opinions with someone cause they are bull shit and you are clearly talking out of your ass.

I'm sure you were just passionate there betcats. lol.

Whatever you say champ.