NBA Off-Season Signings/Trades

[betcats]

I will bet Harden is re-signed and Perkins is amnestied. It will happen

I dont normally do this but, good call numbnuts.

 

[edabomb]

I think this is the Thunder conceding they weren't going to beat the Heat this season. Instead they've retooled to give it a run in a couple years when Wade and probably Bosh are declining.

It's smart - but I reckon the shot at a Championship comes along so rarely that it's always a risk trading it away. Westbrook or Durant go down with something serious next year and this becomes a terrible trade.

 

[Nth-Qld-Raider]

If Martin stays injury free he could be good, I guess KD's numbers will now go up a little more, he might average just over 30 a game now.

The two first round picks is nice in the deal, I'm sure one is a lottery pick from Toronto, that could be handy.

 

[edabomb]

I'm not a fan of Martin - he's a one dimensional chucker IMO - a team like Miami should be able to shut him down fairly easily.

17.1pts on 13.4 shots last year compared to Harden's 16.8 on 10.1.

 

[betcats]

Martin can score but they definately got worse. I think the development of Lamb will be important when looking back at the quality of this trade.

 

[Special K]

Martin is "turrible". A one dimensional chucker is spot on plus he is injury prone. The hope for the Thunder is he scores, stays on the cheap and Lamb develops. Plus the potential lotto pick.. Ugh I dunno though I am sure there would of been better Harden deals out there but I guess not.

It isn't a bad deal for the Thunder but a strange one I guess given how close to the ring they were/are.

 

[simostorm]

Martin; plus lamb plus pick.. that's a great deal.

 

[simostorm]

Plus thunder rid themselves of a heap of junk in the other 3.

 

[Special K]

They were cheap though depth though so hardly a reason to give up such a talent in Harden.. Especially to get a 30 year old injury prone chucker who hates D, a mid lotto pick and a lotto pick(the real value I guess) for a 23 year old who is putting up great numbers behind Durant and Westbrook? Harden will be the man for the Rockets.

The Rockets got the great deal. Thunder did not get ripped off but it is hardly a great deal for them imo as they really did not need to get any younger(as the real value in the trade are the picks and Lamb not Martin). I get they had to do something due to the cap and all but it really flys in the face of them saying they would keep the group together.

A+ for the Rockets, B for the Thunder. Nobody got ripped off it is just weird for a team like the thunder who are and can be in win now mode for the next ten years. An odd retooling when you are so close.

 

[betcats]

They were cheap though depth though so hardly a reason to give up such a talent in Harden.. Especially to get a 30 year old injury prone chucker who hates D, a mid lotto pick and a lotto pick(the real value I guess) for a 23 year old who is putting up great numbers behind Durant and Westbrook? Harden will be the man for the Rockets.

The Rockets got the great deal. Thunder did not get ripped off but it is hardly a great deal for them imo as they really did not need to get any younger(as the real value in the trade are the picks and Lamb not Martin). I get they had to do something due to the cap and all but it really flys in the face of them saying they would keep the group together.

A+ for the Rockets, B for the Thunder. Nobody got ripped off it is just weird for a team like the thunder who are and can be in win now mode for the next ten years. An odd retooling when you are so close.

I dunno if this is such a great deal for the rockets. Rockets just gave Harden the MAX deal that Okc wouldnt give him, Is he worth it? Can he be the number 1 option?

Harden is good, very good, but he has never been the main focus of the defence, Durant and Westbrook get that so at best he has been the third focus. He has never even started consistently. Also playing with Lin and Chandler Parsons is a lot different from Durant and Westbrook.

Not saying this is gonna fail but there is a lot of unanswered questions imo, it will be interesting to see if Harden can become that franchise guy the Rockets have been looking for.

 

[Big Mick]

I love this deal for OKC.

The picks they are getting is reportedly Dallas & Toronto picks. Both those teams are top 10 lottery teams next year.

On top of that they will have a chance to get someone like a Steven Adams or Nerlins Noel out of the draft next year with one of those picks potentially top 5. That gives them flexibility to flip Perkins for picks next year as well.

Love the way OKC do business.

Harden isn't a starter. He isn't a #1 option. He isn't a max guy.

EDIT - I AM WRONG.

 

[Special K]

I agree the Rockets have been looking for a franchise guy for a while but in terms of what is out there and available I do not see a better option then Harden given his age and talent. You send Martin and a couple of late to mid lotto picks for a guy like Harden every day even if it doesn't pay off you have to take the risk. Like Philly flipping Iggy for Bynum(knee injury in all they had to do that deal).

 

[betcats]

I love this deal for OKC.

The picks they are getting is reportedly Dallas & Toronto picks. Both those teams are top 10 lottery teams next year.

On top of that they will have a chance to get someone like a Steven Adams or Nerlins Noel out of the draft next year with one of those picks potentially top 5. That gives them flexibility to flip Perkins for picks next year as well.

Love the way OKC do business.

Harden isn't a starter. He isn't a #1 option. He isn't a max guy.

Except they got worse. Thats what i dont like. THIS season imo they went from favourites in the West to just contenders.

That may of been the best tam Okc will ever have and they blew it up so quickly after Hardens negotiations broke down.

I mean trading for picks when you have a young team that just went to the finals and is ready to go again seems silly to me. So much can go wrong with draft picks, imo they will be very lucky to draft someone who develops as well as Harden has in the next 3 or 4 years.

EDIT: Harden isnt a starter?????????? gtfo. Imo he is a genuine star. He is one of the most efficient scorers in the L, he can run the offence very well, he has sneaky strength and athleticism, runs pick n roll well, good hands, good vision, good passing, good handles, good D.
16.8pts 3.7apg 4.1rpg 1spg all in 31 minutes last season. He will be an all star imo, just not the guy to lead a team to a ring.

 

[Big Mick]

EDIT: Harden isnt a starter?????????? gtfo. Imo he is a genuine star. He is one of the most efficient scorers in the L, he can run the offence very well, he has sneaky strength and athleticism, runs pick n roll well, good hands, good vision, good passing, good handles, good D.
16.8pts 3.7apg 4.1rpg 1spg all in 31 minutes last season. He will be an all star imo, just not the guy to lead a team to a ring.

A genuine star who is the 3rd guy on his team? And when I say starter I mean #1 option on a team. f**k me...Darko was a starter...I'm not lumping him in with Darko.

He's efficient because he gets no attention. His shooting percentage with a hand in his face reduced by 20% from regular shooting percentage last year as opposed to guys like LeBron, Kobe, Durant who's shooting percentage when Open and when there is a hand in their face is roughly the same...about 5% difference if anything.

He aint running the pick and roll in Houston. Not unless Jeremy Lin who is that type of PG isn't on the floor.

And you give me those numbers...fine...but he was the 3rd option on his team. He was pretty much ALWAYS open.

He may be an All-Star...maybe...but he isn't a "star". He's just a guy who will have the odd good year here and there. He isn't the #1 option on a team yet he is getting #1 option money.

We'll see this year if he is a genuine star or not. Should be take the next step in his career and be a star, I'll happily admit I was wrong...I just don't think I will be.

 

[betcats]

I think he will take the next step, but i understand your doubt, there is a lot of unanswered questions re his ability to be the main man and handle the increased attention coaches and teams will pay to him now.

He can be a number 1 option(i think he is better suited to being 2), just not on a championship team imo, not right now.

His assist and rebound numbers should definately go up next season with increased playing time and possesions. Points should go up as well but his efficiency will go down no doubt.

He is only 23 and already has a very well rounded game. Also he wasnt even really the third option, he came off the bench. He played quite a bit of minutes without Durant and/or Westbrook on the floor. He was not ALWAYS open.

I didnt say he will be ruining the pick and roll in Houston. I said he CAN do it, and do it well.

Where did u get those hand in face stats from?i find it very hard to believe Kobe, Lebron Durant and co dont shoot better wide open then with a hand in there face, very hard to believe.

 

[Special K]

wait did someone just compare Harden to Darko?

/thread

 

[simostorm]

Rockets saying they a contender with harden..

 

[Big Mick]

wait did someone just compare Harden to Darko?

/thread

No...read again.

 

[Big Mick]

Where did u get those hand in face stats from?i find it very hard to believe Kobe, Lebron Durant and co dont shoot better wide open then with a hand in there face, very hard to believe.

Some basketball reference site, I forgot which one but it was referenced in one of the articles talking about the trade.

It was saying when wide open Kobe, LeBron etc shoot around 55%, when hand in the face, they shoot around 45%.

Conversely...Harden is around 50% when open (similar to the elite guys), but drops to 30% when guarded.

So it isn't necessarily that Kobe, Lebron are bad when open, they are great...so is Harden, but they just don't get disturbed by contact as much as Harden it appears.

Those figures may be full of shit, but it is what I read on one of the articles talking about the trade. Might have been in a Houston paper or something. Not sure. Was late. lol. Those stats just stood out to me.

 

[andrew057]

Well soon see how good Harden is as a #1 option.

Martin isnt a chucker, hes a good scorer and is a nice option off the bench and with Maynor coming back Westbrook will still get his rest.

The Toronto pick is guaranteed so could be a top 5 pick. Pretty sure the Dallas pick is protected. Thunder have so much flexibility now, could get a couple good draft picks, will have the option to re-sign Martin at what will be a much lower price/trade his expiring contract/or just let him come off the books season end and go back into the market with 12mil worth of cap space.