NRL: Lets talk about relocating teams, says QRL boss.

[LeagueXIII]

Balmain Tigers have gone bust!

That is very sad, such an iconic rugby league name. Unlike other sports we don't protect them we just kick them to the curb and say next........

Balmain could and should be like South Sydney are today.

 

[TheFrog]

Without upgrades (and it's hard to see where the money would come from), they may be faced with taking their home games to Parramatta

Honestly mate, you are without a clue. Penrith Stadium is fine, could be a bit bigger, thats all. Moving games to Parramatta would be a disaster. There was a stadium at Parramatta before, opened in the mid 80s, and we never needed to take games there.

 

[TheFrog]

The problem was in 1980's they didn't pick the best 5 Sydney teams and the best 5 Brisbane teams, add in Canberra and start from there!

Vaporizing half a dozen teams in the 1980's would have had the same result it would now- massive disenfranchisement of a huge portion of the game's supporter base. What we have now is what has evolved from the 12 team Sydney premiership that existed in 1980.

 

[MugaB]

The western half of Sydney, population wise, currently has 2.5 teams, being generous since the Wests Tigers are based at Concord which is in the eastern half. One day Parramatta and Penrith might merge but surely the eastern half of Sydney, with 6.5 teams is the area that is over-represented.

This is total garbage, sorry but merging 2 teams that are 30kms away from each other is dullard thinking, especially when parramatta, Canterbury, concord(wests), and souths
Are all within 10-15kms away from each other and all play out of anz stadium
Penrith has a massive catchment of juniors yes, but it also draws players and pathways from Bathurst, and greater western region of country nsw,
I would like to see the panthers play 8 home games, with the remaining 4 in rural country towns in nsw out west, dubbo, mudgee, orange, and Bathurst.
The distance of crounulla is far enough also to not be an issue either, only dragons if more games at kogarah would conflict there, but being that they are an already merged entity, should be full time wollongong, with 3 matches at kogarah, much like wests tigers does with balmain and campbelltown

The only mergers is see possible, is splitting wests tigers up and moving balmain tigers to perth, funded by nrl as the newer addition, with keeping the heritage of a foundation club and western suburbs magpies re-merge with Canterbury, and become a very powerful and rich south western entity, the other is merge sydney roosters and manly and rule north of the bridge, again 3 games at brookvale, with all others at allianz,

Add in a northern brisbane team (redcliff and sunshine coast based) and a south queensland team (logan/ipswich based)
& add in possibly central coast
Adelaide, PNG, and Central QLD in another 10 years, or next/next tv deal cycle

 

[TheFrog]

This is total garbage, sorry but merging 2 teams that are 30kms away from each other is dullard thinking,

It's been done before and was successful too.

 

[MugaB]

So in other words lets merge, easts and souths, or st George and cronulla
Or better yet norths and manly that'll work
Stgeorge and illawarra only work as the dragons basically ate up the steelers, there isn't anything illawarras way barr playing in at WIN stadium
If they had merged with cronulla it would have been to the same effect, probably worse, only 3 games max and it would have stayed sharks colors

Balmain are hugely pushed aside in their "WESTS" merger, they basically are the western suburbs magpies with a gold strip pretending to be a tiger.

And norths are now non existent
Unless the NRL pays attention to the central coast bid

So no, it hasn't worked yet
You dont merge rival clubs,
its insane business, and any real league fan, (im talking grew up in NSWRL era) will know this, the NswRL started in sydney, it will always be based around sydney, it will expand to places that want it, and can sustain it
I can see 6-7 teams working minimum.
Parramatta, Easts/Manly, Cronulla, Souths, Penrith and Canterbury/Wests & Stgeorge based in Wollongong

 

[MugaB]

Besides geographicaly, if SYDNEY roosters stadium ALLIANZ is the main focal location in sydney that all other teams are regarded in distance to it in sydney only

Then Central coast being 70kms away
and Wollongong being 85kms away
And Penrith being 60kms away would all have teams, and probably be classified out of/or the edge of sydneys metropolitan or the bookends so to speak.
It would be the remaining teams inside that would need to merge
Parramatta is 25kms away from Allianz stadium thats crazy that between those 2 teams we have Canterbury, Wests tigers and Souths in between that distance

But no, you say lets go the other way and merge Parra with Penrith
Do you get what i mean by saying its not smart, you cannot merge rivals

 

[MugaB]

Personally I think that relocation is a bad idea, but if you were going to do it the best way to do it would be to do it in a way that would have the least impact possible on the clubs, so a small restructure of Sydney to start, then if necessary big relocation to other cities.

For example instead of relocating Cronulla as is often suggested, force the Dragons to move full-time to the Gong (maybe minus a couple of big games like the ANZAC day game that they can keep in Sydney), then force the Sharks to broaden their focus to all of the surrounding regions of Sydney (including all the traditional Dragons areas in Sydney) instead of just the Shire, and make them represent the fact that they aren't just the Cronulla Sharks anymore with a minor re-brand so that their brand encompasses that whole region as well. Then if all goes well in a couple generations you'd have a 'South Sydney' team and a South Coast team where you used to have two teams fighting over what is effectively the same patch of turf.

Take Manly, they're stuffed at the moment, but relocating the only club north of the Bridge to the other side of the country would be a dumb idea, so instead of doing that the NRL should buy the club back from the Penn family, then restructure it into the 'North Sydney' club and re-brand to represent that fact, piss the Bears off when they try to intervene and meddle, then once the club is stable and relatively established sell it on to the highest bidder with the understanding that the club must focus on all of NS. Then in a couple generations instead of having a tiny club on the Norther Beaches ignoring the rest of North Sydney you'd have the making of a relatively big club that represents the whole region.

If the NRL was really going to push relocation then stuff like that is where they should start. There're other areas where the solutions aren't so simple like 'East Sydney' (one of either Souths or the Rooster probably have to pack up and leave), and figuring out who stays, who goes, where and how they stay, where they go, in Western Sydney will be a nightmare for all involved, and that is where you're big relocations would come from, but even then there're probably a few solutions (like Tigers to Campbelltown/South West Sydney full time) that could be explored.

I agree with the ideas of sharks of sydneys south, and dragons of the gong, probably not so much north Sydney idea, only coz of manly vs bears saga that still rages on
Which in truth the idea in theory works, but the fans of both teams already are at odds with themselves aswell as at the nrl, but where does western sydney start? West of Anz stadium or west of redfern, west of Ashfield, such a broad term, i feel Parramatta is the west and anything east of them needs to consolidate
The problem with mergers or relocations, is everyone in sydney has a team and is tribal for it, no one wants to see THEIR team move away, or be united with a dud or rival.
I think relocations can work, not so much mergers, but it has to happen over time, and has to be beneficial to that club only, not beneficial to the league, reason the womens league only has one sydney team, even though souths and cronulla have had actual womens teams in their own comp for years, they should have been a shoe in. Had Newcastle, Penrith, or any other team out of nsw had a team to put forward they easily would have been included in the NRLW. but out of tigers, parra and dogs maybe only one licence they would grant, Souths too close to roosters, and cronulla to close to dragons area. Nrl are starting show which teams matter to them through the womens comp

 

[Perth Red]

I don't even know why people are wasting their time debating this stuff, its never going to happen. There'll be no mergers or relocations, NRL doesn't have the balls for it. Only hope for expansion is to go to an 18 team comp in 2023 or 2028 or 2033 or whenever the NRL has someone in charge with some vision.

 

[The Great Dane]

I agree with the ideas of sharks of sydneys south, and dragons of the gong, probably not so much north Sydney idea, only coz of manly vs bears saga that still rages on

It's nice that you agree but I don't really agree with it myself, I'd do things very differently, no mergers, no relocation, just relegation, but that is an aside.

Anyhow I'm not really sure what there is to disagree with when it comes to the Sea Eagles taking over NS, the Bears should effectively be a non-issue at this point, and frankly the old Bears fans wouldn't be the Sea Eagles target audience if they were to expand into NS anyway, their grandchildren and/or kids would be along with the rest of the younger demographics, and if we're honest Sea Eagles and (to a lesser extent) Bears fans who actually care about the old rivalry or even truly understand it in the Sea Eagles case are dying out very quickly, once a couple of generations pass on they'll be as rare as hens teeth.

I think relocations can work, not so much mergers, but it has to happen over time, and has to be beneficial to that club only, not beneficial to the league

At that point why bother at all. What the clubs see as "beneficial" and what is actually "beneficial" are two vastly different things, e.g. I'd bet you anything that one of the West Sydney clubs would try to pressure the government to build a stadium in Liverpool so they could 'relocate' there, which might be great for the club but wouldn't (in of it's self) alleviate any of the problems of over saturation in Sydney that the NRL is facing and thus would be utterly pointless.

 

[The Great Dane]

I don't even know why people are wasting their time debating this stuff, its never going to happen. There'll be no mergers or relocations, NRL doesn't have the balls for it. Only hope for expansion is to go to an 18 team comp in 2023 or 2028 or 2033 or whenever the NRL has someone in charge with some vision.

Sure the current NRL doesn't have the balls for it, they're to scared of the Daily Telegraph and the media hacks, and the club 'power brokers' to do rationalisation or anything really important and/or difficult, however it's inevitable that given time the NRL will be forced by market pressures to either rationalise Sydney or completely restructure the competition and/or league structure, it's just a matter of time.

The really bad thing though is that the longer the status quo continues the more damage it does and the harder it will be to actually do the rationalisation in the future, it's a bit like ripping a band-aid off or slowly pulling it off, and the NRL are going with slowly pulling it off in the hope of delaying the pain when really all it will do is draw the process out...
On the other hand though there is the bonus of doing it this way cause the AFL are headed down a very similar path and it'll almost certainly come to a head for them before it does for the NRL, so the NRL will get the opportunity to learn from them and see what did and didn't work for them.

 

[MugaB]

I meant regarding beneficial for the club to move on its own terms, thus they would promote themselves towards moving to perth or wherever for example
Rather than being moved on or forced by nrl hierarchy to move/merge etc
Its probably never going to happen, and more likely clubs will dissolve as they have in the past

 

[Perth Red]

I guess in theory clubs are probably more aware now that if they drop out of the NRL they are probably never getting back in. I reckon Bears and Manly thought if they dissolved the merger they would both find a way back into the NRL eventually. Knowing that you aint getting back might be enough to see a bankrupt club decide to relocate, but its hard to see any club going bankrupt with the new $13mill grant tbh.

 

[T-Boon]

Knowing that you aint getting back might be enough to see a bankrupt club decide to relocate, but its hard to see any club going bankrupt with the new $13mill grant tbh.

I don't know, they will increase their spending even before that money comes in, so they will mostly all be making a "loss" still.

 

[siv]

Wonder how Wests would be if the still had all of their original Territory of Sydney

Eg Penrith / Parramatta / Canterbury / St George and Cronulla

 

[Vee]

I guess in theory clubs are probably more aware now that if they drop out of the NRL they are probably never getting back in. I reckon Bears and Manly thought if they dissolved the merger they would both find a way back into the NRL eventually. Knowing that you aint getting back might be enough to see a bankrupt club decide to relocate, but its hard to see any club going bankrupt with the new $13mill grant tbh.

Hold their beers.

 

[TheFrog]

Wonder how Wests would be if the still had all of their original Territory of Sydney

Eg Penrith / Parramatta / Canterbury / St George and Cronulla

Most of it was just bush in those days.

 

[Southern Rooster]

If only the cemented that back in 1908.

Souths have already packed up and left.

 

[Southern Rooster]

That is very sad, such an iconic rugby league name. Unlike other sports we don't protect them we just kick them to the curb and say next........

Balmain could and should be like South Sydney are today.

Very true. We do nothing to protect the history of our clubs. The NRL believes the code started in 1998. No foundation club should have been kicked out. The code missed a chance to relocate and expand at the same time when they forced mergers and the like.

 

[Stallion]

Very true. We do nothing to protect the history of our clubs. The NRL believes the code started in 1998. No foundation club should have been kicked out. The code missed a chance to relocate and expand at the same time when they forced mergers and the like.

If they are prudent business people North Sydney should be back in some form as the Central Coast Bears with strong links to North Sydney. Itsunami also not impossible to have the West Tigers called the Balmain Campbelltown Tigers. Perhaps give West Magpies a lifeline in West Australia with having links to the Lidcombe (or wherever club). Just some options. I'm aware they will be howled down but still not impossible if well thought out and planned smartly. The carve up of the established clubs of Sydney has been immensely damaging to this once unrivaled code in NSW and QLD. Agreeing to go to 14 teams over twenty years ago was suicidal in so many ways. A massive mistake and the code is still hurting as a result.