OT: Current Affairs and Politics

[strider]

To be honest, i don't remember much written on here about it but this time it seems like there are a lot of Trump sympathisers.

I actually didn't care in 2016 and i don't care now, either way. I just find it funny how much is posted about it and how so many people seem to think that Trump is the good guy for some reason.

Hands up who thinks Trump is a good guy?

Hands up who has interest in whether the most highly publicised election of our lifetime was dodgy?

I reckon they are two different things.

 

[Gary Gutful]

Hands up who thinks Trump is a good guy?

Perhaps not the best way to describe it, but I read it as saying that there are plenty of people who support a lot of what he has said or done...maybe they are just providing an alternate view for Trump haters to consider?

 

[Gronk]

 

[Gronk]

OK, so had to dump the above post quickly because my iPad was dying. Back home, so I can do something a little more substantial.

When I talk about avenues I think one thing is really important - time.

We're now at the halfway point between election and inauguration, so long game judicial action is becoming harder and harder to bring to fruition. If anyone wants to take a new legal path...well, most of these start from the beginning so they have to go through:

File in state courts - lose - compile and file an appeal to the state SC - lose - compile and file to the federal SC and hope you get a hearing.

Time, folks. That all takes time and that is now starting to run out.

So, currently on the SC plate are the Kelly suit (still alive but won't progress without hearing arguments) and now the Wood suit (docketed but no agreed hearing, yet). I believe Powell just filed two and has two more to come imminently, but neither have been confirmed as even docketed (for consideration) let alone agreed to for a hearing.

New options, I believe, are now limited by time.

***

In regards to the Texas suit itself, it is important to note that this failed to progress because of standing, and NOT because of merit.

This means that the SC did not say "Your arguments are dumb and you lose" but instead said "Look, Texas, you don't even have the right to make this argument because we don't see you as having suffered any damages".

OK, so why didn't Texas have standing?

My personal view is something like this - even if the 4 states had have cheated (outrageously and obviously, even) then it doesn't matter to Texas because Texas still gets the same Electoral College votes and still has the same influence on the final election outcome. As such, their position was not damaged, irrespective of what the other 4 states did or didn't do.

And, to be honest, that's fair enough.

So, who does have standing?

Once again, in my personal opinion - counties within the states that were being sued (WI, MI, PA, GA).

One of the Texas arguments was that counties within a state were subject to different rules and that violates the principle of equitable treatment (or whatever terms were actually used - you get the point).

If one county followed the rules and another didn't, and in doing so allowed additional votes to that second county that shouldn't have been allowed, then that dilutes the votes of the first county that followed the rules and reduces their influence over the state result that decides the EC votes.

OK, that seems a fair argument, too.

BUT!!! this means that individual counties would need to take up the argument and then go through the process I outlined above - state court, lose, appeal to state SC, lose, get it to SCOTUS.

And we're back to where we started - time.

Does anyone have enough time to get through the loopholes to get to where they need to go?

I guess we have to wait and see...

It was never going to be heard because of the precedent set by SCOTUS last year. The complaint was of course dissimilar, however the court did say that they are not getting involved in a brouhaha between states just because one state is unhappy that another state runs stuff differently. States are entitled to make decisions for the benefit of it’s own constituents and does not have to take into account the buthurt of it’s neighbours.


589 U. S. ____ (2020) 1 THOMAS, J., dissenting
SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES
ARIZONA v. CALIFORNIA
ON MOTION FOR LEAVE TO FILE A BILL OF COMPLAINT
No. 150, Orig. Decided February 24, 2020
The motion for leave to file a bill of complaint is denied.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/19pdf/150orig_3e04.pdf

 

[strider]

Perhaps not the best way to describe it, but I read it as saying that there are plenty of people who support a lot of what he has said or done...maybe they are just providing an alternate view for Trump haters to consider?

I think Trump is a self absorbed, lying, big noting twat. But i also find him comical at times.

I dont particularly have a USA political leaning, i think the whole place is full of loonies.

I think we were brought up to believe the usa was a great place. But i now believe its one of the dodgiest countries.

And yeah i reckon the election had all sorts of fraud. Cos Trump is one of the most dispised people in my life. But he has brought much on himself.

 

[I'm a loser baby...]

A shonk and a buffoon but probably not as corrupt as the other guy. And nowhere near as sinister as the power behind him.

 

[Gronk]

A shonk and a buffoon but probably not as corrupt as the other guy. And nowhere near as sinister as the power behind him.

The deep state ?

“...where shadowy elites in the military and government ministries have been known to countermand or simply defy democratic directives ...”

Do you know who introduced the term to modern US politics?



https://warontherocks.com/2019/02/how-the-deep-state-came-to-america-a-history/

 

[hindy111]

I think Trump is a self absorbed, lying, big noting twat. But i also find him comical at times.

I dont particularly have a USA political leaning, i think the whole place is full of loonies.

I think we were brought up to believe the usa was a great place. But i now believe its one of the dodgiest countries.

And yeah i reckon the election had all sorts of fraud. Cos Trump is one of the most dispised people in my life. But he has brought much on himself.

The land of mik and honey
I feel people are naive calling Americans dumb. Plenty know there is no such thing as the American dream. You either make it or get left behind to fade.

 

[hindy111]

 

[hindy111]

pretty funny take on it all. Worth a watch.

 

[Gronk]

The land of mik and honey
I feel people are naive calling Americans dumb. Plenty know there is no such thing as the American dream. You either make it or get left behind to fade.

Concrete jungle where dreams are made of
There's nothing you can't do

 

[Kornstar]

Hands up who thinks Trump is a good guy?

Hands up who has interest in whether the most highly publicised election of our lifetime was dodgy?

I reckon they are two different things.

I agree with you, they are 2 different things and i never said anything about it being whether Trump was good or bad, i just made the comment that the last election was pretty highly publicised as well and there were a lot of claims about the election being rigged back then but there was barely a whimper on here crying that Hilary was hard done by.

Seems really odd this time the attention it has received from people who have absolutely no skin in the game.

Perhaps not the best way to describe it, but I read it as saying that there are plenty of people who support a lot of what he has said or done...maybe they are just providing an alternate view for Trump haters to consider?

I think Trump is a self absorbed, lying, big noting twat. But i also find him comical at times.

I dont particularly have a USA political leaning, i think the whole place is full of loonies.

I think we were brought up to believe the usa was a great place. But i now believe its one of the dodgiest countries.

And yeah i reckon the election had all sorts of fraud. Cos Trump is one of the most dispised people in my life. But he has brought much on himself.

I would say if anything i was interested in seeing what he could bring as he was so different and with the right approach he could have been very good but he lost me when he proved his was racist in a country that is so multicultural.

I think the problem is that half the country is uneducated which makes them easily led. I love the country and can't wait to go back (in 2022 if they have their shit together) but most of the places i go are established tourist places so i am probably unlikely to deal with the complete morons you speak of.

I would suggest there was fraud on both sides, it just seems that people seem to think Trump is the victim here and nothing i have seen from the last 4 years makes me believe he is an innocent in all of this.

A shonk and a buffoon but probably not as corrupt as the other guy. And nowhere near as sinister as the power behind him.

Just out of curiosity cause i don't follow US politics closely, what specifically draws you to that conclusion?

 

[Happy MEel]

SC denies Texas case.

Ouch!

Not sure what avenues are left for Trump, now...

I’m shocked

 

[Gary Gutful]

Not sure what avenues? Is grace and humility still an option?

 

[Eelogical]

Not sure what avenues? Is grace and humility still an option?

Was it ever?

 

[Gary Gutful]

Was it ever?

Not without electro shock therapy.

 

[strider]

I agree with you, they are 2 different things and i never said anything about it being whether Trump was good or bad, i just made the comment that the last election was pretty highly publicised as well and there were a lot of claims about the election being rigged back then but there was barely a whimper on here crying that Hilary was hard done by.

Seems really odd this time the attention it has received from people who have absolutely no skin in the game.





I would say if anything i was interested in seeing what he could bring as he was so different and with the right approach he could have been very good but he lost me when he proved his was racist in a country that is so multicultural.

I think the problem is that half the country is uneducated which makes them easily led. I love the country and can't wait to go back (in 2022 if they have their shit together) but most of the places i go are established tourist places so i am probably unlikely to deal with the complete morons you speak of.

I would suggest there was fraud on both sides, it just seems that people seem to think Trump is the victim here and nothing i have seen from the last 4 years makes me believe he is an innocent in all of this.

Just out of curiosity cause i don't follow US politics closely, what specifically draws you to that conclusion?

The 2016 Russian thing is all about them pushing a campaign to discredit Clinton yeah? Is there more to it than that? .... I wouldn't doubt it - and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Trump had his grubby fingers all over it.

I've read reports that Google pushed a campaign to favour the Democrats this election. It may be horseshit, but its well known their management were devastated after 2016 and talked about doing what they could to right things. .... does that mean google might have done something similar to russia this time round?

 

[Gary Gutful]

The 2016 Russian thing is all about them pushing a campaign to discredit Clinton yeah? Is there more to it than that? .... I wouldn't doubt it - and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Trump had his grubby fingers all over it.

I've read reports that Google pushed a campaign to favour the Democrats this election. It may be horseshit, but its well known their management were devastated after 2016 and talked about doing what they could to right things. .... does that mean google might have done something similar to russia this time round?

 

[Gronk]

Not sure what avenues? Is grace and humility still an option?

Nope.

 

[Gronk]

SBS won’t retreat in Alan Jones libel fight


An ugly showdown over Alan Jones’ legacy is likely to erupt in a high-stakes court battle next year, after SBS revealed it would defend a polarising “tribute” segment that mocked the veteran radio presenter’s 35-year career as one of Australia’s most influential talkback hosts.

On the day of his retirement announcement on May 12, comedian Alex Lee presented a segment on SBS program The Feed in which she claimed Jones had built a “career out of bullying people”, had “gleefully used racial slurs”, and “spread lies and fake news”.

Jones launched defamation proceedings against SBS and Lee in October, claiming the program conveyed 10 defamatory imputations, including that he was a pedophile, racist, misogynist and a liar who “achieved his success” by habitually seeking to intimidate vulnerable people.

In a 36-page defence document filed last week, SBS denies those claims and says the claimed defamatory imputations are based on honest opinion, are protected by fair comment, are contextually true, and were justified under the Defamation Act.

In a statement of claim, Jones’ legal team argues the program wrongly suggested he “sought to incite racial violence” ahead of the Cronulla riots, was a “racist” for criticising Muslims and Aboriginal people, and was a “misogynist” for singling out female politicians for criticism.


SBS The Feed presenter and comedian Alex Lee. Picture: Facebook
They also say the program suggested Jones was a “disgraceful” teacher because he had written a love letter to a teenage schoolboy and that he was a “hypocrite” for choosing to isolate in his country estate despite seeking to undermine the risks posed by the coronavirus.

Jones’ barristers, Sue Chrysanthou SC and Kieran Smark SC, argue the segment was presented “in an over-sensationalised manner” with an “intent to injure”. “The applicant has been greatly injured in his business, personal and professional reputation and has been and will be brought into public disrepute, odium, ridicule and contempt,” the barristers say in documents.

SBS denies those claims and says Lee was expressing an honest opinion based on facts that were “sufficiently indicated or notorious”.

As well, SBS will seek to prove the “substantial truth” of the 10 conveyed defamatory imputations, including that Jones repeatedly “spread fake news about climate change”, engaged in “reprehensible professional conduct” by writing a love letter to a boy, and “secretly took money from companies to spruik their products on air”.

The matter is listed for a case management hearing next week.

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/bu...t/news-story/39a5035a9006d91956563570e91a42ba