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OT: Current Affairs and Politics

Gronk

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So who do you blame for the BLM deaths?

You didn’t read your own link.

—-8<—
ACLED found that the overwhelming majority of the more than 9.000 Black Lives Matter demonstrations that took place across the US after the killing of George Floyd have been peaceful. News reports at the height of demonstrations over Floyd’s killing cited dozens of deaths in connection with protests, but many of those turned out to be examples of deadly crimescarried out in the vicinity of protests, rather than directly related to the demonstrations themselves, the researchers concluded. ACLED’s dataset only focuses on political violence.
—-8<—-

So even if you think that one death from BLM protests is one too much, the mortality rate was still 1 every 375 protests, in a country that carries guns. I wonder how that compares with just every day gun or violent crimes over there ?

So who’s at fault was it ? Well have we established that there is a problem, outside the norm stats in that weird AF country as yet ?
 

strider

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I couldn't read your article because it's paywalled so I don't know if seven people actually died because of Trump. But you're the one who blamed him, so that's obviously your point. How did Trump kill them? I remember one woman was shot dead by a cop and some clowns took souvenirs. It's not really what an insurrection looks like. Trust me, I've been involved in a few.
1 woman protestor shot

1 man protestor heart attack outside before anyone went into building

1 woman protestor claimed to be crushed but found to have had drug overdose to the side of the mob

1 man heart failure, organised people to go to protest but not sure if was actually there

1 capitol police stroke next day .. probably related - claimed hit with fire extinguisher but not found to have blunt force trauma, maybe pepper spray an issue .... glad we can now admit strokes happen because something prior may have caused it

2 police suicides in weeks after

Also other police suicides months later which people tried to link but seems not even NY Times wanna go there
 

Gronk

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74,326
I couldn't read your article because it's paywalled so I don't know if seven people actually died because of Trump. But you're the one who blamed him, so that's obviously your point. How did Trump kill them? I remember one woman was shot dead by a cop and some clowns took souvenirs. It's not really what an insurrection looks like. Trust me, I've been involved in a few.
1 woman protestor shot

1 man protestor heart attack outside before anyone went into building

1 woman protestor claimed to be crushed but found to have had drug overdose to the side of the mob

1 man heart failure, organised people to go to protest but not sure if was actually there

1 capitol police stroke next day .. probably related - claimed hit with fire extinguisher but not found to have blunt force trauma, maybe pepper spray an issue .... glad we can now admit strokes happen because something prior may have caused it

2 police suicides in weeks after

Also other police suicides months later which people tried to link but seems not even NY Times wanna go there
Placing a benchmark of deaths to judge if it was an insurrection seems to be minimising to me.



Jan 2023

Two years ago, on January 6, 2021, a crowd of thousands attacked the United States Capitol in an effort to stop the certification of the 2020 election results, spurred on by false claims the election had been “rigged” against Republican incumbent Donald Trump.
More than 2,000 people entered the Capitol building, smashing windows, ransacking offices, defecating in public spaces and searching for members of Congress. The assault was ultimately unsuccessful but it has set off alarm bells about the stability of US democracy and the growing influence of anti-democratic elements within the Republican Party.

On the second anniversary of the riot, President Joe Biden is set to hold a White House ceremony in the East Room Friday to commemorate the deadly events that unfolded that day.


The US continues to grapple with the fallout from the attack. More than 950 people have been charged with federal crimes relating to the riot, with some facing accusations of seditious conspiracy – a rare but serious offence.

The US Department of Justice on Wednesday said that 192 of those defendants have been sentenced to time behind bars and 484 have pleaded guilty to various crimes.

An investigative committee in the US House of Representatives recommended criminal charges last month for key political figures linked to the attack, including Trump who was presiding at the time and encouraged the rioters.

Al Jazeera looks at what has happened to some of the most high-profile instigators of and participants in the January 6 attack.

Donald Trump: criminal referrals to Department of Justice​

The former Republican president has refused to concede the 2020 election, turning his false claims of election fraud into a rallying cry for some in his party.

But those claims have come with repercussions. The former president had already been impeached and acquitted once in his presidency in 2019 for abuse of power and obstruction of Congress. He was impeached a second time for “inciting” the January 6 riot. It had caused legislators and the then-vice president to go into hiding and left an estimated 140 police officers injured. A Senate report last June documented seven deaths connected to the attack, including three members of law enforcement. Trump was acquitted in his second impeachment.

Trump was also front and centre during the House’s January 6 investigation. The committee in charge of the investigation subpoenaed the former president to testify, but he refused.

But using hundreds of interviews, including with some of Trump’s closest advisers, the committee compiled an 845-page report detailing the former president’s activities on and around January 6.

INTERACTIVE - CAPITOL RIOTS 2 YEARS_1



It also sent non-binding criminal referrals to the US Department of Justice, including four charges against Trump which included assisting or inciting an insurrection. The committee has since disbanded, in anticipation of a Republican majority taking control of the House.

Trump has continued to spread the “stolen election” lie and has used his heft in the party to elevate candidates who mirror his false claims, with mixed results. Many election-deniers fared poorly in the 2022 midterm elections. Trump also faces several continuing legal investigations, including cases in Georgia and New York.

The former president announced in November that he would compete for the White House again in 2024.

Stewart Rhodes, speaking into a microphone and pointing. He's wearing a black cap with Oath Keepers written across the front in yellow. He also has glasses on, which cover an eyepatch over his left eye.


Oath Keepers founder Stewart Rhodes was convicted of seditious conspiracy in November, setting what prosecutors hope will be a precedent for other January 6 trials [File: Susan Walsh/AP Photo]

Stewart Rhodes of the Oath Keepers: guilty of seditious conspiracy​

A number of far-right groups have gained attention for their roles in the January 6 attack. One of those groups is the Oath Keepers, an anti-government militia that calls on its members to fulfil the oath US service members take: to “defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic”.

The group’s founder is Stewart Rhodes, a former US Army paratrooper and Yale-educated lawyer who often wears an eyepatch to cover an injury sustained during a firearm accident.


Rhodes and several of his fellow Oath Keepers were the first to face seditious conspiracy charges in relation to the January 6 attack. The serious but rarely used charge implies that a defendant conspired to overthrow the government, oppose its authority or hinder its laws.

The US Department of Justice alleged that the Oath Keepers were “prepared and willing to use force” to prevent the peaceful transfer of power. They argued that the January 6 attack was coordinated.


But Rhodes and his co-defendants denied those claims, testifying that there was no plan to enter the Capitol building.

On November 29, a jury found Rhodes guilty of seditious conspiracy, in one of the most significant convictions to stem from the Department of Justice’s investigations. Rhodes faced up to 20 years in prison as he awaited sentencing.

Another codefendant, Kelly Meggs, was also found guilty of seditious conspiracy while three other defendants – Kenneth Harrelson, Jessica Watkins and Thomas Caldwell – were acquitted of the charge.

All five were found guilty of obstructing an official proceeding, with mixed verdicts on other charges.


All five were found guilty of obstructing an official proceeding, with mixed verdicts on other charges.

Enrique Tarrio, in a baseball cap and bulletproof vest. The black cap has yellow letters saying THE WAR BOYS'. He is wearing sunglasses and has a cigarette in his mouth. There is a can of beer resting in a cup holder attached to his vest.
Proud Boys leader Henry “Enrique” Tarrio was not present at the January 6 attack but encouraged his followers to ‘do what must be done’ [File: Allison Dinner/AP Photo]


 

Gronk

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74,326

Enrique Tarrio of the Proud Boys: on trial​

The Oath Keepers trial was seen as a litmus test for another case against a far-right group, the Proud Boys.

The all-male group describes itself as “Western chauvinists” and is associated with white supremacy, anti-immigration sentiment and misogyny.

On January 6, members of the Proud Boys were among those that stormed the US Capitol, though its leader, Enrique Tarrio, was not present. He had been barred from entering Washington, DC as a condition of his bail, after being arrested for vandalising a Black Lives Matter banner.

Still, Department of Justice prosecutors have alleged he played an active role behind the scenes during the Capitol attack, encouraging his followers to subvert the democratic process and halt the peaceful transfer of power.

Tarrio faces seditious conspiracy charges alongside four other members: Joseph Biggs, Ethan Nordean, Zachary Rehl and Dominic Pezzola. All five have pleaded not guilty. They face potential prison sentences of up to 20 years. The trial is expected to take about six weeks from start to finish.

In December 2021, Matthew Greene became the first Proud Boys member to plead guilty to conspiracy. Several of the group’s leaders have also submitted guilty pleas, including 43-year-old Jeremy Joseph Bertino, who also faced a seditious conspiracy charge.

Another top member of the Proud Boys, Charles Donohoe, pleaded guilty to charges of conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding and assaulting and impeding police officers in April 2022.

Jacob Chansley, with his top off and face painted with the US flag is looking upwards with his mouth open. He is wearing a horned helmet and fur hat.
Jacob Chansley holds a US flag and megaphone outside the Senate chamber during the January 6 attack [File: Manuel Balce Ceneta/AP Photo]

Jacob Chansley, the QAnon Shaman: 41 months​

One of the most recognisable figures from the January 6 attack was Jacob Chansley, whose horned headdress and face paint earned him the nickname “QAnon shaman”.


Chansley was a supporter of the QAnon conspiracy theory, which posits that an anonymous figure named Q has secret information about a deep-state “cabal” inside the US government. Trump figures into the conspiracy theory as a hero figure, capable of rooting out the cabal.

Photographed standing atop the Senate rostrum during the January 6 attack, Chansley was ultimately sentenced to 41 months in prison.

His sentence matched that of another participant, ex-mixed martial artist Scott Fairlamb, who was captured on film punching a police officer. He, too, received 41 months in prison in November 2021, one week before Chansley.

Prison officials have since diagnosed Chansley with transient schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, depression and anxiety. Chansley had hoped that Trump would pardon him for his actions.

Guy Wesley Reffitt: seven years, three months​

In March 2022, a Texas man named Guy Wesley Reffitt became the first participant to be convicted of storming the Capitol. It was a first victory for federal prosecutors pursuing hundreds of cases stemming from the riot.

While Reffitt did not personally enter the Capitol, the Department of Justice said he arrived “armed and determined to instigate violence” on the Capitol grounds.

Prosecutors allege he helped charge at Capitol police officers outside the building, leading other rioters up the stairs to the Capitol doors. “We’re taking the Capitol before the day is over,” Reffitt reportedly said.

He was ultimately convicted of storming the Capitol with a loaded handgun, interfering with police officers guarding the building and obstructing justice by threatening his two children to dissuade them from reporting him to law enforcement.

Reffitt was handed a sentence of seven years and three months.
 

Gronk

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74,326
^^^^ this is what I posted the other day. Fox News will have you think that the trial is about paying money to a pornstar. It partially is and his lawyer went to actual real jail for it. But there is way more to it. Surprisingly Ch9 are across it.


 

Poupou Escobar

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Messages
86,031
1 woman protestor shot

1 man protestor heart attack outside before anyone went into building

1 woman protestor claimed to be crushed but found to have had drug overdose to the side of the mob

1 man heart failure, organised people to go to protest but not sure if was actually there

1 capitol police stroke next day .. probably related - claimed hit with fire extinguisher but not found to have blunt force trauma, maybe pepper spray an issue .... glad we can now admit strokes happen because something prior may have caused it

2 police suicides in weeks after

Also other police suicides months later which people tried to link but seems not even NY Times wanna go there
So how many people were killed by the 'insurrectionists'? Or were they all killed by Trump? Now that's a powerful billionaire.
 

Poupou Escobar

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Messages
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Placing a benchmark of deaths to judge if it was an insurrection seems to be minimising to me.
How about an attempt by the insurrectionists to defeat the state's security forces? That's an important characteristic of all the insurrections I've seen. You said something about there being a lot of guns in America? Kyle Rittenhouse fired more shots than the merkins at the Capitol.
 

Gronk

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74,326
What? That a bunch of people turned up to overthrow the government, but forgot to bring their guns? ..... ok

"I thought you were bringing the guns"
"No that was you"
"Shit!"
"Lets as Ray Epps if he knows who brought guns"
Overthrow the government ? It wasn't a military coup carried out on any random day.

It was an attempt to prevent the peaceful transition of power. They wanted their preferred leader to stay in charge by any means because he lead them to believe that, well you know the rest....

But you knew that anyway, right ?

1713747382519.png1713747434175.png1713747479487.png1713747508863.png1713747571816.png
 

Gronk

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Staff member
Messages
74,326
So how many people were killed by the 'insurrectionists'? Or were they all killed by Trump? Now that's a powerful billionaire.
Didn't pull the trigger, so must be ... innocent ?

He is damn lucky not to be charged with Seditious Conspiracy, yet.

Currently he is facing these charges:

  • one count of conspiracy to defraud the United States applies to Trump's repeated and widespread efforts to spread false claims about the November 2020 election while knowing they were not true and for allegedly attempting to illegally discount legitimate votes all with the goal of overturning the 2020 election, prosecutors claim in the indictment.
  • one count of conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding was brought due to the alleged organized planning by Trump and his allies to disrupt the electoral vote's certification in January 2021.
  • one count of obstruction of and attempt to obstruct an official proceeding is tied to Trump and his co-conspirators' alleged efforts after the November 2020 election until Jan. 7, 2021, to block the official certification proceeding in Congress.
  • one count of conspiracy against rights refers to Trump and his co-conspirators alleged attempts to "oppress, threaten and intimidate" people in their right to vote in an election.

Link

Remember the Kraken lady ? She has turned state witness.


When Sidney Powell, a top ally of Donald Trump, pleaded guilty Thursday to crimes associated with the 2020 election, lawyers for many Jan. 6 defendants were stunned by her relatively meager sentence: six years of probation and a modest fine.

For years, those lawyers — and some judges — have lamented that the thousands who breached the Capitol were used as pawns and dupes by Trump, Powell and their associates in a bid to subvert the election. So Powell’s plea was the first taste of accountability for Trump’s inner circle. Yet her punishment, Jan. 6 defense lawyers noted, paled in comparison to even some of the low-level offenders who entered the Capitol that day and now face consequences that may dog them for life.

“Gobsmacked is certainly an appropriate description considering the sentences that have been imposed against others who believed the lies spread by Donald Trump, Sidney Powell and others,” said Bjorn Brunvand, whose client Robert Palmer was sentenced by Judge Tanya Chutkan to 63 months in prison for assaulting officers at the U.S. Capitol. “The rules we all share are not applied equitably to all. Frequently, deals are made with the highest-ranking players in criminal conspiracies, while the pawns receive the most significant sentences.”


Powell’s mild sentence was a reflection of an apparent cooperation deal she struck with prosecutors. Another close Trump ally, Kenneth Chesebro, entered a similar plea deal on Friday that will allow him to avoid prison. (Brunvand and other lawyers for Jan. 6 defendants spoke with POLITICO before news emerged of Chesebro’s plea.)

Both Powell and Chesebro provided statements to prosecutors and promised to testify for the government in the racketeering case in Fulton County, Ga., where prosecutors have charged Trump and 18 others with conspiring to subvert the 2020 election. It’s unclear whether Powell or Chesebro will testify against Trump himself, but they were among his closest advisers in the final frantic weeks of his presidency as his efforts to overturn the election grew increasingly desperate. Their testimony could offer firsthand accounts that give jurors unparalleled insight into Trump’s mindset.

District Attorney Fani Willis initially charged Powell with seven felonies, including racketeering and conspiracy to commit election fraud, for her involvement in an effort to unlawfully access voting equipment in Georgia’s Coffee County. Powell initially denied the charges and fought to have them thrown out, but her plea deal includes an admission to many of the facts prosecutors alleged. Ultimately, she pleaded guilty to six misdemeanor charges, which will be wiped from her record under Georgia’s “first-time offender” policies as long as she doesn’t commit additional crimes in the near future.

Powell’s lawyer, Brian Rafferty, and a spokesperson for Willis did not respond to requests for comment.

Attorneys for several Jan. 6 defendants told POLITICO that it seemed incongruous for foot soldiers to face steep penalties — often including jail time — while Powell, an architect of the effort to overturn the election, was permitted to negotiate a misdemeanor plea deal.

“This is sick and scandalous,” said Carmen Hernandez, a defense attorney whose former clients include Philadelphia Proud Boy Zachary Rehl. “There are J6 defendants with no priors who’ve served jail time. … It’s obscene given that she was a prominent attorney and was one of the leading and loudest of the ‘stolen election’ BS.”

Rehl, who was sentenced to 15 years in prison after a jury convicted him of seditious conspiracy in May, quoted Powell — and her chest-thumping promise to “release the Kraken” as she sought to overturn the election results in court — in his social media exchanges with other Proud Boys.

Norm Pattis, who represents Florida Proud Boy Joseph Biggs and InfoWars broadcaster Owen Shroyer in Jan. 6 criminal cases, said it simply didn’t sit right to see Powell receive light punishment.

“Ms. Powell must have offered Georgia a lot for this deal. In the meantime, ordinary J6 defendants, who listened to her, get severe sentences,” Pattis said. “None of this promotes respect for the law..”

Biggs, one of Rehl’s co-defendants, was sentenced last month to 17 years in prison for seditious conspiracy and other felony convictions. Shroyer, who pleaded to a single misdemeanor, was sentenced recently to 60 days in prison.

Other Jan. 6 defense attorneys, however, said it’s not surprising that Powell’s cooperation was a white whale for prosecutors. Her cooperation could reshape the calculus of many of Trump’s other co-defendants, arm prosecutors with explosive new evidence and even influence special counsel Jack Smith’s ongoing probe in which Powell has been identified as an as-yet-uncharged co-conspirator.

Powell, they say, simply has something to offer that most Jan. 6 defendants do not.

“They really, really wanted her cooperation. She will be an explosively helpful witness,” said Gene Rossi, who represents William Isaacs, a Jan. 6 defendant who joined members of the Oath Keepers at the Capitol. “If I were the state prosecutor, I could not ask for a better … cooperator testifying against President Trump and the others than the attorney who was going to be the special counsel for the ‘stop the steal’ investigation.”

Rossi noted that Powell’s deal also sends a signal to other Trump co-defendants “that if you come in early, you will get a bargain deal. If you wait until the end, you will get hammered.”

Scott Weinberg, who also represented a member of the Oath Keepers in a Jan. 6 trial, said he was “hardly surprised” by the outcome.

“With these numerous prosecutions, indictments, involving massive resources both criminal and civil, it seems the government would hand out a jaywalking ticket to Charles Manson if it meant securing a conviction against Trump,” he said.

Both Weinberg and Rossi referenced the cooperation deal that Sammy ‘the Bull’ Gravano reached with the government to testify against mobster John Gotti, even after confessing to a role in 19 murders.

“Not comparing Trump to Gotti,” Weinberg said, “but if the government wants you, they’ll get you.”
 

hindy111

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Messages
59,911
Overthrow the government ? It wasn't a military coup carried out on any random day.

It was an attempt to prevent the peaceful transition of power. They wanted their preferred leader to stay in charge by any means because he lead them to believe that, well you know the rest....

But you knew that anyway, right ?

View attachment 86939View attachment 86940View attachment 86941View attachment 86942View attachment 86943


Your getting analed by two members smarter then you with more knowledge. Completely outfoxed.
It's time to concede defeat.
 

Poupou Escobar

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Messages
86,031
Didn't pull the trigger, so must be ... innocent ?

He is damn lucky not to be charged with Seditious Conspiracy, yet.

Currently he is facing these charges:

  • one count of conspiracy to defraud the United States applies to Trump's repeated and widespread efforts to spread false claims about the November 2020 election while knowing they were not true and for allegedly attempting to illegally discount legitimate votes all with the goal of overturning the 2020 election, prosecutors claim in the indictment.
  • one count of conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding was brought due to the alleged organized planning by Trump and his allies to disrupt the electoral vote's certification in January 2021.
  • one count of obstruction of and attempt to obstruct an official proceeding is tied to Trump and his co-conspirators' alleged efforts after the November 2020 election until Jan. 7, 2021, to block the official certification proceeding in Congress.
  • one count of conspiracy against rights refers to Trump and his co-conspirators alleged attempts to "oppress, threaten and intimidate" people in their right to vote in an election.

Link

Remember the Kraken lady ? She has turned state witness.


When Sidney Powell, a top ally of Donald Trump, pleaded guilty Thursday to crimes associated with the 2020 election, lawyers for many Jan. 6 defendants were stunned by her relatively meager sentence: six years of probation and a modest fine.

For years, those lawyers — and some judges — have lamented that the thousands who breached the Capitol were used as pawns and dupes by Trump, Powell and their associates in a bid to subvert the election. So Powell’s plea was the first taste of accountability for Trump’s inner circle. Yet her punishment, Jan. 6 defense lawyers noted, paled in comparison to even some of the low-level offenders who entered the Capitol that day and now face consequences that may dog them for life.

“Gobsmacked is certainly an appropriate description considering the sentences that have been imposed against others who believed the lies spread by Donald Trump, Sidney Powell and others,” said Bjorn Brunvand, whose client Robert Palmer was sentenced by Judge Tanya Chutkan to 63 months in prison for assaulting officers at the U.S. Capitol. “The rules we all share are not applied equitably to all. Frequently, deals are made with the highest-ranking players in criminal conspiracies, while the pawns receive the most significant sentences.”


Powell’s mild sentence was a reflection of an apparent cooperation deal she struck with prosecutors. Another close Trump ally, Kenneth Chesebro, entered a similar plea deal on Friday that will allow him to avoid prison. (Brunvand and other lawyers for Jan. 6 defendants spoke with POLITICO before news emerged of Chesebro’s plea.)

Both Powell and Chesebro provided statements to prosecutors and promised to testify for the government in the racketeering case in Fulton County, Ga., where prosecutors have charged Trump and 18 others with conspiring to subvert the 2020 election. It’s unclear whether Powell or Chesebro will testify against Trump himself, but they were among his closest advisers in the final frantic weeks of his presidency as his efforts to overturn the election grew increasingly desperate. Their testimony could offer firsthand accounts that give jurors unparalleled insight into Trump’s mindset.

District Attorney Fani Willis initially charged Powell with seven felonies, including racketeering and conspiracy to commit election fraud, for her involvement in an effort to unlawfully access voting equipment in Georgia’s Coffee County. Powell initially denied the charges and fought to have them thrown out, but her plea deal includes an admission to many of the facts prosecutors alleged. Ultimately, she pleaded guilty to six misdemeanor charges, which will be wiped from her record under Georgia’s “first-time offender” policies as long as she doesn’t commit additional crimes in the near future.

Powell’s lawyer, Brian Rafferty, and a spokesperson for Willis did not respond to requests for comment.

Attorneys for several Jan. 6 defendants told POLITICO that it seemed incongruous for foot soldiers to face steep penalties — often including jail time — while Powell, an architect of the effort to overturn the election, was permitted to negotiate a misdemeanor plea deal.

“This is sick and scandalous,” said Carmen Hernandez, a defense attorney whose former clients include Philadelphia Proud Boy Zachary Rehl. “There are J6 defendants with no priors who’ve served jail time. … It’s obscene given that she was a prominent attorney and was one of the leading and loudest of the ‘stolen election’ BS.”

Rehl, who was sentenced to 15 years in prison after a jury convicted him of seditious conspiracy in May, quoted Powell — and her chest-thumping promise to “release the Kraken” as she sought to overturn the election results in court — in his social media exchanges with other Proud Boys.

Norm Pattis, who represents Florida Proud Boy Joseph Biggs and InfoWars broadcaster Owen Shroyer in Jan. 6 criminal cases, said it simply didn’t sit right to see Powell receive light punishment.

“Ms. Powell must have offered Georgia a lot for this deal. In the meantime, ordinary J6 defendants, who listened to her, get severe sentences,” Pattis said. “None of this promotes respect for the law..”

Biggs, one of Rehl’s co-defendants, was sentenced last month to 17 years in prison for seditious conspiracy and other felony convictions. Shroyer, who pleaded to a single misdemeanor, was sentenced recently to 60 days in prison.

Other Jan. 6 defense attorneys, however, said it’s not surprising that Powell’s cooperation was a white whale for prosecutors. Her cooperation could reshape the calculus of many of Trump’s other co-defendants, arm prosecutors with explosive new evidence and even influence special counsel Jack Smith’s ongoing probe in which Powell has been identified as an as-yet-uncharged co-conspirator.

Powell, they say, simply has something to offer that most Jan. 6 defendants do not.

“They really, really wanted her cooperation. She will be an explosively helpful witness,” said Gene Rossi, who represents William Isaacs, a Jan. 6 defendant who joined members of the Oath Keepers at the Capitol. “If I were the state prosecutor, I could not ask for a better … cooperator testifying against President Trump and the others than the attorney who was going to be the special counsel for the ‘stop the steal’ investigation.”

Rossi noted that Powell’s deal also sends a signal to other Trump co-defendants “that if you come in early, you will get a bargain deal. If you wait until the end, you will get hammered.”

Scott Weinberg, who also represented a member of the Oath Keepers in a Jan. 6 trial, said he was “hardly surprised” by the outcome.

“With these numerous prosecutions, indictments, involving massive resources both criminal and civil, it seems the government would hand out a jaywalking ticket to Charles Manson if it meant securing a conviction against Trump,” he said.

Both Weinberg and Rossi referenced the cooperation deal that Sammy ‘the Bull’ Gravano reached with the government to testify against mobster John Gotti, even after confessing to a role in 19 murders.

“Not comparing Trump to Gotti,” Weinberg said, “but if the government wants you, they’ll get you.”
All this supports Trump’s Deep State conspiracy theories. I say this as someone who doesn’t believe Deep State conspiracies are even possible in the West. But this looks like nothing more than a totalitarian attempt to enforce a narrative.

Seventy million people voted for Trump. He isn’t some fringe loony. The 2020 election was an absolute shitshow, and voters are right to be suspicious about the process.
 

Gronk

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Staff member
Messages
74,326
All this supports Trump’s Deep State conspiracy theories. I say this as someone who doesn’t believe Deep State conspiracies are even possible in the West. But this looks like nothing more than a totalitarian attempt to enforce a narrative.
Alphabet soup. Hit me with facts.
Seventy million people voted for Trump. He isn’t some fringe loony. The 2020 election was an absolute shitshow, and voters are right to be suspicious about the process.
No, it was a normal election. The reaction to the result was a shitshow. That we can agree on.
 

Poupou Escobar

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Messages
86,031
Alphabet soup. Hit me with facts.

No, it was a normal election. The reaction to the result was a shitshow. That we can agree on.
Even the fact that BLM and Covid disappeared after the Democrats took power. You’ve spoken about the pub test before. Obviously you go to a different sort of pub to ordinary people.
 

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