Parramatta Eels Juniors

[I'm a loser baby...]

They're referring to the content of another thread (the 2018 Salary Cap Info one), which has turned into 6 pages of puns about cows, bulls, beef, steaks and anything else vaguely related to cows.

It did ranch out a bit.

 

[hindy111]

Tupou is a middle forward.

We should always be trying to get the best players in every position whether it be from our local competitions are external signings. There's no way we'd "not worry about developing a fullback for a while". You contradict yourself a bit there, you said previously that we can take advantage of the junior system by going with them instead of getting into a bidding war to retain the more senior players. What happens in the future when we get into a bidding war for The King and Bev and we have no fullback because we decided we didn't need to develop one?

True, as we may develop one and get a few cheap years out of them. I should of said priority would be other players.

Id follow what Storm done and try and keep a solid spine together for 5+ yrs.

 

[hindy111]

6 first graders from this year

https://www.penrithpanthers.com.au/news/2015/10/01/where-are-they-now-2013-nyc-premiers/

 

[hindy111]

Another 6 first graders from 2015 and I think Cleary come into this team perhaps?

https://nycdatabase.org/2015/02/12/penrith-panthers-2015-nyc-squad/

 

[hindy111]

If we can produce a side where 3 genuine first graders pop out a year it would be excellent.

We seem to be starting to produce a few. 2017 was a rare year where I dont think anyone made there first grade debut?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

2017 was the first time we never awarded a rookie of the year.

The 2014 NYC side finished top four and a bunch of them went on to make their NRL debuts (though obviously most still aren't genuine first graders):

Folau
Li
Davis
Matterson
Dockar-Clay (not NRL but played a couple of Challenge Cup games last year)
Pritchard
Tanginoa
Pauli
Kamikamica
Moeroa
Aloiai

The 2015 and 2016 sides were ordinary (only French has emerged as a first grader) and the 2017 team finished top four. It was a young side, so plenty are still playing Flegg this year, but five graduates are with NRL clubs (including Dean Matterson allegedly on the Roosters' development list).

 

[hindy111]

Well i think 3 first grader maybe 4 from that list. I also think Davis has potential to carve out an Nrl career if gets a break.

 

[rugby league fan]

Over all a great start to the SG Ball season
Parramatta 70 - West coast 12
Slow start to the game not completing.
As the game went on we fortunately got better,
I personally thought our middle forwards laid the platform
For mine Sam Huges - Stefano Utoikamanu - Aitasi Matautu where outstanding
13 tries - 2
Schneider kicking 9/13
Manly next week

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

Any chance that the opposition are called 'The Coolers'?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Unskilled migrant labourers from the far east?

 

[Glenneel]

Even though he is only young. One of the best props at Parramatta is Stefano Utoikamanu.
Intimidating presence standing 6'"4 115kg. has stamina and speed. Jst been unlucky with injury last few seasons. This kid is a super star. Hope he has a great 2018

Hope we hang onto him then! We seem to lose some of these promising players without a fight. We have the vision to bring these young blokes into our system but not the vision to give them a pathway into NRL.
We seem to be spending a squillion on all these young players but virtually none have made our team. So are we wasting money? I'd be cheaper just raiding the other nurseries for their best. If we persevere with our present setup we have to cherry pick the best based on our immediate and future needs and lock them up.

Our biggest weakness atm is big middle forwards with some skill and their as scarce as hen's teeth on the open market. Therefor we have to develop our own and keep them! The same with any other position within our team. And sometimes instead of discarding some players we need to keep them in lower grades as at times they'll become good players once they mature a bit more.

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

Unskilled migrant labourers from the far east?

Nah, the wine spritzer sold in bottles that particularly popular with chicks in the 80s.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Hope we hang onto him then! We seem to lose some of these promising players without a fight. We have the vision to bring these young blokes into our system but not the vision to give them a pathway into NRL.
We seem to be spending a squillion on all these young players but virtually none have made our team. So are we wasting money? I'd be cheaper just raiding the other nurseries for their best. If we persevere with our present setup we have to cherry pick the best based on our immediate and future needs and lock them up.

Our biggest weakness atm is big middle forwards with some skill and their as scarce as hen's teeth on the open market. Therefor we have to develop our own and keep them! The same with any other position within our team. And sometimes instead of discarding some players we need to keep them in lower grades as at times they'll become good players once they mature a bit more.

You're coming at it from the wrong direction.

The point isn't to bring kids all the way from your junior system to first grade - that is just a means to an end. The desired end state is to have a strong NRL squad, and it doesn't actually matter where the players come from, as you correctly identify. Sure it's good to bring kids through the grades, but keeping them all isn't the priority. The reason you develop them is so that you have options if you need them. If you don't need them (or some other club makes a stupid offer) you let them go and spend your money sensibly somewhere else.

 

[Gazzamatta]

Glenns point, to my way of thinking, is that we pay good money for Matagi, Vave, Evans and have enlisted players such as O'Brien, Stromquist and the young boxer bloke that didnt work out while releasing Twal and Keppie.
Everyone agrees we need more size up front and have been linked with numerous big boppers, Walmsly, Klemmer, Vaughn etc.
Are we patient enough with our developing middle forwards?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Glenns point, to my way of thinking, is that we pay good money for Matagi, Vave, Evans and have enlisted players such as O'Brien, Stromquist and the young boxer bloke that didnt work out while releasing Twal and Keppie.
Everyone agrees we need more size up front and have been linked with numerous big boppers, Walmsly, Klemmer, Vaughn etc.
Are we patient enough with our developing middle forwards?

The thing about Matagi, Vave and especially Evans is that they had proven they were ready for first grade right away, which means they had what we needed. Note also that these three are attacking forwards, whereas Twal is more of a worker. Keppie hasn't even played reserve grade, so he is totally unproven, plus he isn't an impressive attacking player, which is what we need.

O'Brien was a backup player on minimum salary, ready to do that job, so hardly an investment. Stromquist isn't even contracted to Parramatta - he is a part timer who plays for Wenty. Willis Meehan came to show what he's got and it turns out he didn't have enough, which is why no other club wants him either. At least Klemmer and Vaughn are proven quality first graders, which is why their current clubs are paying so much for them. If they were playing for us we would be paying a lot for them too. And maybe we wouldn't have a better team than the Bulldogs and the Dragons, like we currently do.

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

Glenns point, to my way of thinking, is that we pay good money for Matagi, Vave, Evans and have enlisted players such as O'Brien, Stromquist and the young boxer bloke that didnt work out while releasing Twal and Keppie.
Everyone agrees we need more size up front and have been linked with numerous big boppers, Walmsly, Klemmer, Vaughn etc.
Are we patient enough with our developing middle forwards?

Ultimately I guess it depends on what it costs to be patient, and what it costs to plug gaps otherwise. I'll say right now that I'm disappointed that we didn't keep Keppie, but let's say we kept him, and it turns out he is ready for NRL in 2 or so years. Do we get him any cheaper on his next deal as a consequence? That used to be the case but I'm not so sure these days.

 

[84 Baby]

Glenns point, to my way of thinking, is that we pay good money for Matagi, Vave, Evans and have enlisted players such as O'Brien, Stromquist and the young boxer bloke that didnt work out while releasing Twal and Keppie.
Everyone agrees we need more size up front and have been linked with numerous big boppers, Walmsly, Klemmer, Vaughn etc.
Are we patient enough with our developing middle forwards?

Na pretty sure Glenn’s point was the club is shit and we will lose these players because we couldn’t identify how good they were after 5-10 years in our system and they’ll change clubs and carve us up when they finally kickstart their glorious 1st grade career of 10-12 games before never being heard from again

 

[Gazzamatta]

The thing about Matagi, Vave and especially Evans is that they had proven they were ready for first grade right away, which means they had what we needed. Note also that these three are attacking forwards, whereas Twal is more of a worker. Keppie hasn't even played reserve grade, so he is totally unproven, plus he isn't an impressive attacking player, which is what we need.

O'Brien was a backup player on minimum salary, ready to do that job, so hardly an investment. Stromquist isn't even contracted to Parramatta - he is a part timer who plays for Wenty. Willis Meehan came to show what he's got and it turns out he didn't have enough, which is why no other club wants him either. At least Klemmer and Vaughn are proven quality first graders, which is why their current clubs are paying so much for them. If they were playing for us we would be paying a lot for them too. And maybe we wouldn't have a better team than the Bulldogs and the Dragons, like we currently do.

Cant argue with any of that Poo.
So are we more prepared to pay up for juniors only if they are NRL ready at a younger age? Maybe we just didnt rate Keppie and Twal. Hard to know the thinking behind such decisions which must be difficult. I wonder what we are paying Salmon.
Hopefully we at least get a contender for rookie of the year this season.

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

I think you get value from junior investment if it produces Origin level players, because you may get a few years of real value out of those chaps. . If you just produce an abnormal number of solid NRL players, I'm not sure it helps the NRL club too much (not saying that we shouldn't do it.)

 

[Happy MEel]

Cant argue with any of that Poo.
So are we more prepared to pay up for juniors only if they are NRL ready at a younger age? Maybe we just didnt rate Keppie and Twal. Hard to know the thinking behind such decisions which must be difficult. I wonder what we are paying Salmon.
Hopefully we at least get a contender for rookie of the year this season.

To be honest, I hope we don’t. I hope we have minimal injuries and only use our fringe first graders/back ups (of which many have 1st grade experience) sparingly.